GambitGuild

Gambit => Gambit => Topic started by: cc008 on October 04, 2017, 10:08:33 AM

Title: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 04, 2017, 10:08:33 AM
January 2018


https://www.newsarama.com/36702-rogue-gambit-and-legion-titles-coming-in-2018.html (https://www.newsarama.com/36702-rogue-gambit-and-legion-titles-coming-in-2018.html)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 04, 2017, 10:30:43 AM
Marvel has announced two new X-Men-related titles coming in January 2018 - Rogue & Gambit and Legion. Two covers came with the announcement, but nothing else in the way of creative teams or plots.

Look for more information on these titles this weekend during New York Comic Con.
https://www.newsarama.com/36702-rogue-gambit-and-legion-titles-coming-in-2018.html (https://www.newsarama.com/36702-rogue-gambit-and-legion-titles-coming-in-2018.html)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 04, 2017, 12:32:43 PM
Hmmm... I wonder who's been talking about Gambit/Rogue shared book for the last few months. Gee...  ;D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 04, 2017, 12:50:55 PM
This and Legion? Holly @#@#, am I back to reading X-Men again!?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 04, 2017, 01:21:49 PM
This and Legion? Holly @#@#, am I back to reading X-Men again!?


I'm up to 4 books right now, myself. Astonishing, Iceman, Old Man Logan, and now R&G. Not too shabby.
5 if you include Deadpool.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 04, 2017, 04:03:34 PM
I'll give the new book a shot, but not buying as much as others.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 04, 2017, 04:24:37 PM
Oh the shock is wearing off and I'm becoming waaay more cynical lol. I'm starting to analyze things such as;


Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 04, 2017, 04:55:08 PM
There most likely is a creative team, they just haven't announced it yet. The same was done for every ResurrXion title.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 04, 2017, 05:16:59 PM
Hmm. Good point.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 04, 2017, 05:26:46 PM
I am sure we wil get more news and creative team on Friday ar NYCC. Excited for ths book.


I hope writer is not Thompson.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 04, 2017, 05:40:40 PM
Anka isdoing only covers for Rogue&Gambit.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 04, 2017, 06:21:55 PM
I like Anka's covers. Not sure why, but I do. I hope the creative team is good. I can't help but think this book is a lot of years late but ... I'm willing to try it but won't be on a pull list until I get more details.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 04, 2017, 06:25:49 PM
I like Anka`s cover too. It is dynamic and different from most Romy covers.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: albahan888 on October 04, 2017, 07:25:55 PM
I was definitely shocked to see a Rogue and Gambit title is coming. I don't trust Marvel to do anything good with it but the fact that it's going to exist is interesting. I think it all (obviously) depends on the premise and especially the creative team. Until this weekend (I assume) we won't know either of those things but given the spoilers I read about Astonishing X-Men 4 and the terrible treatment they've gotten in terms of being together since X-Treme X-Men (more than 10 years ago at this point) I figure this might just be Marvel preying on their fans and putting an end to them as a pair 'once and for all' as much as that's ever true in comics.

I hope to be proven wrong but for them to work it'll take a lot of work and a writer who cares about both characters equally and I don't know any off the top of my head who don't lean towards one or the other. I also don't really know any current Marvel writers anymore so maybe there is someone there who won't be biased. Even taking the romance aspect out of it which is really almost impossible to do there's just been a bunch of weird junk piled between them since Carey that still needs working out for them to be Gambit and Rogue again. Don's right though if this is just an editorially assigned title it's definitely going to be real bad. I'll have more thoughts when there's more to have them on but I mostly just hope this is at least a good spotlight for Gambit and he can be a hero again and not just all the weird and bad ways he's mostly been used for years now.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 04, 2017, 08:19:59 PM
I am sure we wil get more news and creative team on Friday ar NYCC. Excited for ths book.


I hope writer is not Thompson.


If it's ROBBIE Thompson, then that'd be great lol.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 04, 2017, 08:50:56 PM
The more I look at the cover the more apprehension builds for me. Gambit and Rogue are a lot of things together. Angsty for sure, sad, sometimes. But they are also dangerous, steamy, sexy, mysterious, brash, fierce... I'm getting something else from the pic. The smiles and dull yet bright coloring. It's something I'd put on the front of promotional gift from Pizza Hut. Or an exclusive Walmart lunch box. I think it was a poor choice for issue #1. Perhaps further down the line I'd be more receptive. The art of a book says a lot about the direction of said book. This might not be what it's supposed to be... Especially if you take into a account that this is still Marvel. The people that push Squirrel Girl down our throats and make half their female heroes look like Disney princesses. I really need more information. I'm starting to get an idea of what they might be up to and it's beginning to disturb me.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 05, 2017, 01:15:20 PM
New ‘Rogue & Gambit’ Series From Kelly Thompson And Pere Perez Coming In January. 5 issues mini


https://www.bleedingcool.com/2017/10/05/kelly-thompson-pere-perez-rogue-gambit/
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 05, 2017, 03:16:24 PM
Is this the same Kelly Thompson that reviewed Asmus' Gambit solo?

Her twitter accounts lists:
Quote
Writer: HAWKEYE, PHASMA, GHOSTBUSTERS, JEM, MISFITS, A-FORCE, MEGA PRINCESS, HEART IN A BOX, STORYKILLER, THE GIRL WHO WOULD BE KING. Feminist-y & Tired.

And with the attached picture the latest of her tweets.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 05, 2017, 03:49:13 PM
Yeah, the same Kelly Thompson that reviewed Asmus' Gambit solo :(
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 05, 2017, 04:46:41 PM
Yeah, the same Kelly Thompson that reviewed Asmus' Gambit solo :(

This does not instill confidence in me for this title.  :(
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 05, 2017, 10:45:04 PM
So I hear she was part of that whole comicgate fiasco where her and bunch of other creators got together on a FB page to lure a YouTuber into a fight at a comic Con to discredit him for criticizing their books... More concerned.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 06, 2017, 12:04:17 AM
Tweeted KT. Pretty fast reply. We're getting some interior art, maybe some info. Her openness has settled me some...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 06, 2017, 02:22:05 AM
I think we will get more news today at X-Men Legacy panel. I hope good news :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 06, 2017, 10:44:23 AM
I am concerned that Gambit will be treated poorly solely to show some feminist pride or what not.

Edit1: I'm not making a comment about feminism, however, I do not want to be preached to in a comic book. There are other better and wider platforms for those agendas.

Edit2: I'll wait to hear what comes out of NYCC .... and hope for the best. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Spoonz on October 06, 2017, 11:34:08 AM
Is this the woman who wrote an article about how Asmus was sexist?  I found that laughable, Asmus was one of the least chauvinistic writers you could have asked for, but some people just look for offensiveness under every rock and stone.   

I'm sort of indifferent to this.  I'd rather a Gambit and Storm series if he was going to be teamed up with anybody.  I think this Gambit and Rogue ship sailed after X-Treme, when they were together with no stupid baggage.  As it stands right now I'm not sure. 

And again, I can't for the life of me understand why a fellow writer would slag off Asmus's Gambit run unless they were butthurt.  It was a great book.  So I'm not holding a lot of faith :(

 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Rakkner on October 06, 2017, 01:33:01 PM
Here's what I found, maybe there's another article out there.     

www.cbr.com/gambit-1/

She pretty much just s***s on issue #1 start to finish, I only saw one line about sexism.  I disagree with everything she said, but the good news is it seems she has a high standard for how Gambit should be written.     
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Spoonz on October 06, 2017, 01:42:56 PM
That's a good way of looking at it. Guess we can wait and see what she comes up with. But that first issue was a breath of fresh air after all Gambit had been through so I'm uncertain about any fan who bashes it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 06, 2017, 01:45:47 PM
She had poor views of several issues of the Asmus Gambit solo. That aside - that is a positive way to look at it, we'll see how high the standard will be once we actually get an issue.

I fixed your link Rakkner - a few more posts to go before you won't need me or any other mod to fix links.  ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 06, 2017, 02:34:15 PM
Is this the woman who wrote an article about how Asmus was sexist?  I found that laughable, Asmus was one of the least chauvinistic writers you could have asked for, but some people just look for offensiveness under every rock and stone.   

I'm sort of indifferent to this.  I'd rather a Gambit and Storm series if he was going to be teamed up with anybody.  I think this Gambit and Rogue ship sailed after X-Treme, when they were together with no stupid baggage.  As it stands right now I'm not sure. 

And again, I can't for the life of me understand why a fellow writer would slag off Asmus's Gambit run unless they were butthurt.  It was a great book.  So I'm not holding a lot of faith :(


Got to take into account she's a super fan of Rogue. The Asmus solo was about Gambit, not her. For large part it was about Gambit  finding himself, and getting over Rogue. Someone that's a fan of hers isn't going to like that story being told from the male prospective or a story that's essentially putting space between Gambit and Rogue. Even Jen over on CBR was complaining how Gambit "told Rogue off" in the Asmus solo and she didn't like that... I still have no idea what she's talking about but the instance was enough for her to say the whole run was bad because of it.


Can't really stand fans who are so infatuated with a fictional character that anything remotely not perfect sets them off as if a character should never have flaws or make mistakes. Imperfections are what make characters relatable, otherwise it's just mindless worship. If you take this into account I think it makes sense as to why Kelly Thompson wasn't too positive on the Asmus run. It wasn't a Romy lovefest. It involved another woman Gambit came to care for, despite having Rogue show up more than just about anyone.


Spas over on CBR did bring up an interesting point. That Gambit and Rogue haven't been written from a woman's point of view before. I'm intrigued to see where she goes with it. Perhaps all the unnecessarily injected angst was the result of the writer having a Y chromosome lol. Could be worth it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 06, 2017, 03:27:02 PM
Perhaps not from a women's pov in a comic book, but in a short story in a collection of stories that Marvel had published where Marjorie Liu wrote Gambit and Rogue and they were together in that story. :)

Keep in mind that story was in their heyday, so its incredibly old now.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on October 06, 2017, 04:32:19 PM
Is this the woman who wrote an article about how Asmus was sexist?  I found that laughable, Asmus was one of the least chauvinistic writers you could have asked for, but some people just look for offensiveness under every rock and stone.   

I'm sort of indifferent to this.  I'd rather a Gambit and Storm series if he was going to be teamed up with anybody.  I think this Gambit and Rogue ship sailed after X-Treme, when they were together with no stupid baggage.  As it stands right now I'm not sure. 

And again, I can't for the life of me understand why a fellow writer would slag off Asmus's Gambit run unless they were butthurt.  It was a great book.  So I'm not holding a lot of faith :(
I think I remember that article and I don't think it was Thompson. Though it sounds like Thompson was a very picky reviewer...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 06, 2017, 06:58:50 PM

X-Men Panel

01:53
GMarston

Shan was coy about whether Gambit and Rogue would get back together as a couple - an idea the audience seemed to like.

0
01:53
GMarston

"The goal here is to tell a Rogue and Gambit story that has never been told before," said Shan. "It's a fun action/adventure comic."

0
01:52
GMarston

Shan said that Gambit & Rogue are Kelly Thompson's favorite characters. She re-read every Rogue and Gambit story in preparation for the series.

0
01:51
GMarston

Like Legion, Gambit & Rogue will receive a mini-series - though Alonso teased it could go beyond the five planned issues.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 06, 2017, 07:09:23 PM
There is some positives there! I think action/adventure is a good way to go.

A story never told before? LOL .... okay, yet to be seen but who knows.  ;)

A writer doing research - that is encouraging as well.
 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Blade3D1 on October 06, 2017, 08:12:11 PM
Quote from: purplevit link=topic=4926. msg70800#msg70800 date=1507330730
X-Men Panel

01:53
GMarston

Shan was coy about whether Gambit and Rogue would get back together as a couple - an idea the audience seemed to like.

0
01:53
GMarston

"The goal here is to tell a Rogue and Gambit story that has never been told before," said Shan.  "It's a fun action/adventure comic. "

0
01:52
GMarston

Shan said that Gambit & Rogue are Kelly Thompson's favorite characters.  She re-read every Rogue and Gambit story in preparation for the series.

0
01:51
GMarston

Like Legion, Gambit & Rogue will receive a mini-series - though Alonso teased it could go beyond the five planned issues.


Is there a video anywhere of this panel?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 07, 2017, 04:51:45 AM

Is there a video anywhere of this panel?


No video. Found it here


https://www.newsarama.com/36783-nycc-17-marvel-legacy-x-men.html
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 07, 2017, 05:36:04 AM

R&G video from panel.


https://vimeo.com/237162764?ref=tu-v-share
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 08, 2017, 01:07:37 AM
Got some more information. She's actually pretty open on Twitter. Pretty refreshing and relatable. Don't get that too often;


KT; "I believe There will be an interview coming soon (hopefully with art?) But I'd say that this story has some outside the box elements that I don't think have been seen before for these characters. & in addition to the "fun adventure" a deeper slightly esoteric layer."
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 12, 2017, 02:44:12 PM
Marvel.com posted a interview with Kelly Thompson;


https://news.marvel.com/comics/78103...t-untouchable/ (https://news.marvel.com/comics/78103/rogue-gambit-untouchable/)


This part stuck out to me most;

"So instead of shying away from that history, I built the story around it and we’re leaning into it—in what I hope reads as a creative way—that will be rewarding to longtime fans, but also accessible for those who might be new to the characters and curious to find out what’s so great about them and why fans both love and hate seeing them together."

Interesting quote. As someone that routinely interviews the most tight-limped of individuals, I think they could have gone deeper. Perhaps fielded questions from fans, because these questions were really shallow, but I wouldn't expect much more than that from Marvel.com. Otherwise, we got our question of what this would be leaning towards; Romance with points of action, or Action with points of romance, it being the latter. As the weeks go on, I'm getting more enthused.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Spoonz on October 12, 2017, 03:00:27 PM
If she can put her money where her mouth is and write a good story out of it then it could be a winner.  But like with every writer the proof is in the pudding so we just have to wait and see!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 12, 2017, 03:09:48 PM
I'm guessing 'Untouchable' is the tagline... Still cant believe they went with this "cant touch anybody" thing with Rogue again. With that said, I still don't understand how she had a "fling" with the Human Torch sometime off panel before he got with Medusa. Not to mention she supposedly had the terrigan-sickness. I think they over complicate things sometimes.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 12, 2017, 03:29:21 PM
Maybe Kelly Thompson is the writer we NEED as Gambit fans and not so much the one we WANT.


As for the poll.. I voted solidify their relationship. But not in a romantic way. I think it's going to establish where they are with each other from here on out.


Not without a kiss or two along the way though lol.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 12, 2017, 04:03:02 PM
Voted just a fun adventure. I doubt that they will be a couple or split forever. Always somwhere in between.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 13, 2017, 02:38:49 AM
Kelly Thompson definetely win me over with Q&A.Super excited for R&G!
Q:Really excited for R and G book and hope that Marvel will make from it a succesfull ongoing. Can we expect to see Remy's great hand to hand skills, speed and agility back? Maybe even finally his telepathy resistance back?
A:I’m a big fan of Gambit being super agile (and leaping around acrobatically) so I’ll do my best. But it’s obviously not like “Mission One!” of the series. ;D 
Q: What is your favorite thing about Remy?
A:Too many thing to pick just one. But I can tell you that while I loved him from the first moment I saw him, it was this moment in Uncanny X-Men #272 that made me realize I’d love him FOREVER. ;D 

https://78.media.tumblr.com/cb0dfe3ffd6382bccf57bfbe71951e3a/tumblr_inline_oxqihvCwbx1r9n07i_1280.jpg (https://78.media.tumblr.com/cb0dfe3ffd6382bccf57bfbe71951e3a/tumblr_inline_oxqihvCwbx1r9n07i_1280.jpg)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 16, 2017, 08:43:16 AM
Mark Paniccia posted this on twitter:

He posted Happy Xmen Monday with this image.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 16, 2017, 11:29:40 AM
The overall artwork is good, except for why Gambit is blocking Rogue with a handful of cards. That piece looks it should be on a special box for Pizza Hut personal pan pizza, Gambit's face the way his hand and the cards are drawn, bleh... Rogue looks great however. Wow he didn't scan those scenes. He went through and recreated each of those moments by hand. Wonder if I can name them all


X-Men #4, the basketball game
X-Men Legacy "Salvage", where Xavier helped Rogue gain control of her powers
X-Men.... err Dont remember the number maybe #8, but the picnic/Bishop fight (two from that book)
Uncanny X-Men 348, aka the deflowering of Rogue
X-Men Legion Quest just before the crystal wave hit
X-Treme X-Men after Vargas ran both of them through with his sword
Messiah Complex, I think, right after Mystique hit her with a baby


I don't know where the one with her wearing shades is from or the one with just his boots in it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 16, 2017, 12:16:14 PM
Mark Paniccia posted this on twitter:

He posted Happy Xmen Monday with this image.


Headsock is back, lol)
Overall it is a good pic.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 16, 2017, 12:17:54 PM
The one with the shades, I think is from the issue where Rogue was blinded, but I can't think of number.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 16, 2017, 12:57:07 PM
I like it. I'm interested enough because of being a Gambit fan to support the initial mini series. How that goes will determine if I pick up an ongoing if it continues.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 16, 2017, 01:03:04 PM
I like it. I'm interested enough because of being a Gambit fan to support the initial mini series. How that goes will determine if I pick up an ongoing if it continues.

Me too. We've gotten enough positive stuff to make want to try it. The art is helping too, I really like the crispness of it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 16, 2017, 01:21:00 PM
I like it. I'm interested enough because of being a Gambit fan to support the initial mini series. How that goes will determine if I pick up an ongoing if it continues.


Guys, if anything with him in it doesnt sell, its obviously going to be his fault! You have to buy everything!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 16, 2017, 01:50:02 PM

Guys, if anything with him in it doesnt sell, its obviously going to be his fault! You have to buy everything!


Sad but true, LOL.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Spoonz on October 16, 2017, 01:50:23 PM

Guys, if anything with him in it doesnt sell, its obviously going to be his fault! You have to buy everything!


I know I just...man I thought Astonishing started so well and then the Logan issue and then Gambit being a chump....


I'll give this one a shot though she's said enough good things about Gambit to deserve a chance. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 16, 2017, 07:06:14 PM

Guys, if anything with him in it doesnt sell, its obviously going to be his fault! You have to buy everything!


I'll never get over that.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 17, 2017, 10:10:12 AM

Guys, if anything with him in it doesnt sell, its obviously going to be his fault! You have to buy everything!


I'll never get over that.

Me either - its never the writer or art or any of the stuff that is content. LOL

Keep in mind, it won't be Rogue's fault, because nothing ever is her fault. <<sarcasm
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on October 17, 2017, 11:07:02 AM
I will definitely be picking this up and supporting this series. I feel a Gambit and Rogue series is years over to and absolutely excites me. With that said, I have my doubts over the idea or actual purpose of this series. I can't help but wonder if there will be a SJW agenda here or just that they'll have Gambit there to build up Rogue and make here stronger. The writer has said some promising things and all but we'll see. I'm just dying to see Gambit written well again and shown to be an extremely effective combatant. I just don't know if that's what we're going to be getting here. I hope so.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 17, 2017, 02:27:48 PM
Damn. In January Rogue will be in Avengers, in X-Men in Deadpool and overall in more theb 10 books.
Noone will need to read her solo because she is everywhere.


And Gambit will be the one to blame for bad sales.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 17, 2017, 04:22:14 PM
Keep in mind, it won't be Rogue's fault, because nothing ever is her fault. <<sarcasm


Nah, that's about accurate.


Damn. In January Rogue will be in Avengers, in X-Men in Deadpool and overall in more theb 10 books.Noone will need to read her solo because she is everywhere.And Gambit will be the one to blame for bad sales.

I wonder what this big push is all about?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 17, 2017, 04:24:19 PM
Damn. In January Rogue will be in Avengers, in X-Men in Deadpool and overall in more theb 10 books.
Noone will need to read her solo because she is everywhere.


And Gambit will be the one to blame for bad sales.


I don't think the former is going to lead to the latter.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 17, 2017, 05:07:43 PM

Nah, that's about accurate.


I wonder what this big push is all about?


I dunno. It seems writers just want to use her.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 17, 2017, 05:12:29 PM

I dunno. It seems writers just want to use her.




Oh, I have no doubt of that.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 19, 2017, 04:46:44 PM
Kelly Thompson did a non-fan generated q/a with CBR;


http://community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?102774-Kelly-Thompson-Talks-Rogue-amp-Gambit/page2


She's also been popping into boards over the last couple of days.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 19, 2017, 06:30:04 PM
While I have my opinions on the Iceman book, Sina Grace is making the most of his opportunity to write Bobby and you can tell he's done his research. It's obvious that Thompson is treating this opportunity the same way. Love writers like this. Marvel needs more of them.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 19, 2017, 07:27:37 PM
I'll be the first to admit that I had my reservations about this book that it'd just turn into;


Rogue: Why Gambit just can't get right.


But I don't think that way anymore. She's been deliberate to express her fondness of both characters. She's actually what we've been asking for. A writer that is actually a fan/product of the 90s era. Someone who isn't a zealot for "anything not the 90s". She started reading around the same time as a lot of us and basically for the same reasons. We can only judge after it comes but I urge everyone to not just wave it off. I know Marvel hasn't been "kind" to the Cajun lately but this may not be the case here.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 20, 2017, 06:02:52 AM
After her Q&A I am really positive for this book.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on October 20, 2017, 10:00:19 AM
Damn, I am a lot less hesitant about this book after this Q&A. I'm always super worried about their interactions because I haven't been a fan of how their relationship has been written in the past. I actually like them as a couple, but, tbh, I kinda hope they can just be friends for a while instead of always having that weird antagonistic relationship where Gambit is seen as a putz.


Either way, I'm really hoping she can tap into their chemistry for this book and I have a feeling she will.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 20, 2017, 10:57:02 AM
Agree with everyone. I was definitely a little apprehensive at it's announcement... but I've been swayed and can't wait for the book now. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on October 22, 2017, 03:06:58 AM
Tumbler feed where K Thompson was answering questions.


https://1979semifinalist.tumblr.com/
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 22, 2017, 08:16:14 AM
I think its great when writers make themselves accessible to fans. It's good for them, the book and the characters in their care.  ;D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Rakkner on October 22, 2017, 03:46:53 PM
I think all the things I’ve said up to this point - in interviews and extensive asks on this Tumblr - point to the fact that I have no interest in writing Gambit as a “clumsy chump. ” That’s not remotely how I see the character. 

My favorite answer from her.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 22, 2017, 05:03:53 PM
Agreed. He'll be competent. And that's the perfect elevator pitch for me.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 22, 2017, 05:55:44 PM
As long as she delivers and doesn't make him an accessory to her ... then I'll support the book. Gambit becomes a prop to Rogue and  I won't be happy.

I'm still in the wait and see thing. So far so good, at this point in time.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Spoonz on October 23, 2017, 08:32:41 AM
I'm only waiting and seeing because I don't trust writers anymore but apart from that, if she delivers, it could be awesome and I'd dig an on going.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on October 23, 2017, 11:41:35 AM
I've been trying not to get my hopes up too much but dammit, Thompson's won me over. Really can't wait for January.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 24, 2017, 01:23:47 PM
Things I dont want to see Gambit doing in this, that I've seen in the past:


I miss anything?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on October 24, 2017, 05:17:35 PM
Great list. I just also don't want to see Gambit written as a "clumsy chump" or someone who is there to merely "put Rogue over". I don't mean to be skeptical but I'll believe what she says after reading a few issues. Just because she really wants Gambit fans to buy her series and is saying the right things, doesn't mean it's what we're going to get. All I can say is, I hope we do.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 24, 2017, 05:37:05 PM
I don't mean to be skeptical but I'll believe what she says after reading a few issues. Just because she really wants Gambit fans to buy her series and is saying the right things, doesn't mean it's what we're going to get. All I can say is, I hope we do.

Agreed. I'm not completely sold mostly because writers have fed fans lines of bs before, this one would be no different. Perhaps its a jaded view but by this point in time - the Gambit fan has been dragged with pretty words and no delivery on the pretty words for a few years now. The truth will be in the issues.

As for the list Don, all good except for the cats.  :2funny: *teasing you*

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 24, 2017, 05:45:25 PM
no, no, no, I know your stance on those flea-bags! You love them. As for the book, well of course she has to walk the walk, but there a few out there that aren't even willing to give it a shot, despite her openness. The only other writer that interacted this much (positively, Carey had some wars and that was BEFORE Twitter) with fans was Asmus, who even granted our little corner of the internet a visit. Last I checked no one was saying go sign up a for a pre-sale. However wishing Gambit into a oblivion is counter productive if your a comic reading fan. It's not absurd to want to see him in a book and written well. Otherwise, why are we here? To talk about decades old story lines and a 17 issue run? Having a hostile fandom especially with how sensitive creators are nowadays can't do anything but push interest away from the character. I'm a comic fan. I like reading comic books (can't believe I'm reading a DC title [Mr Miracle] and might even start reading more. See what you've done to me Marvel?!) and I'd prefer to read my favorite character occasionally, preferably portrayed as competent.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 25, 2017, 08:42:05 AM
RE: Rogue and Gambit book. (edit for clarity)

The characters are polarizing. That divide between fans created by Marvel itself with poor story telling, and bad decisions. Add in poor characterization and bad attitude  with some writers and lets be honest - very little delivery of the "goods", this is a combination that does not lend itself to "lets get on the bandwagon" for this thing. Not defending, pointing out that the opposition to this book has its foundation.

Written well has YET to be seen. All that has been given is some press and opinions that sound favorable. PAD said good things too. Carey straight up lied for the most part but clearly knew the characters. Asmus was editorially hand tied. The B Boys (DvG) only did a mini for the money. The track record doesn't look good.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 25, 2017, 09:00:27 AM
polarizing ...are we talking about the cats or Gambit and Rogue. Because I reeeeaaaally hate those cats. Not cats in general. I'm big dog guy, but I do enjoy cats.


I understand what you mean. And your forgot Lui. She promised a Gambit arc in AST. Never got it. But to have this cynical attitude for something we have no idea what it is won't help matters. Writers get around the net. They do read comments and posts. Creating a less than peaceful attitude around the subject matter will scare creators away (because they are sensitive and net response DOES effect them). I consider myself a "super fan" of Gambit, there aint much I dont know about the character. But I'm never going to allow my fandom to override my sense or reason. Gambit is a comic book character. It's great that he's finally getting a movie, but to hold onto that only... that's an appearance every couple of years, at best. Gambit isn't slated for any other book. Creators most often have freedom to use characters  as they see fit and if I was one and got around and saw this a 3 to 4 month-early backlash from Gambit fans (I'm not saying here or even CBR is the end all but they do visit. it's a fact) about something they even haven't read or them saying they won't even keep an open mind, I might pass on using him to spare my social media timeline. To each their own but while I'd rather he'd not be used than be used badly, I'm not satisfied with limbo. Outside of this mini, he's not slated to be anywhere else. Hopefully the movie spawns a solo or at least a team birth.


And before anybody catches feelings, I'm open the idea of this BOOK because I want to read a good book with Gambit in it (AST is a good book, but Gambit is weak as hell in it). The relationship part is whatever to me. I'm historically a Romy fan, but not at the expense of Gambit's character. I'm the one that made this poll and I'm one of two people that believe that this book is an instrument to split them up. That part doesn't concern me too much, more than how Gambit get's portrayed. I wasn't even all that happy about KT writing it until I started talking to her. Now I'm more open to idea and her ability to write Gambit. I'm giving her a chance. Ain't no "gushing" over here. If we're resigned to not caring but a possible comic future because of the past... why the *bleep* are we here and not just in the movie sections of this and CBRs board?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 25, 2017, 09:07:33 AM
I completely skipped the cat thing, it was a joke and I know you don't like them. I love cats, I've lived with cats all my life so there is no problem with them for me ever. :) and you and I agreed long ago to agree to disagree on them. They're more for fun or teasing now than any actual discussion.  ;)

I focused on the The Rogue and Gambit Book and your comments regarding those who are dismissing or wishing G into oblivion instead of jumping up and down for joy based on some nice words by a writer. I should have added a regarding thing which I will do now. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 25, 2017, 09:30:53 AM
See that's what I'm talking about, "jumping up and down"? I'm not saying that should be us or anybody. There's a huge difference in "joy" which I've seen on CBR and spewing straight venom for Gambit's sake. I'm not "jumping for joy" because I' havent read it, but I'm also not damning Gambit to oblivion at the thought of him being around Rogue. I was skeptical, but after talking KT, I'm giving her chance. Instead of stamping feet in the ground, go to Tumblr and Twitter and do the same yall. Might be surprised. At least enough to stop wishing oblivion.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on October 25, 2017, 11:16:29 AM
See that's what I'm talking about, "jumping up and down"? I'm not saying that should be us or anybody. There's a huge difference in "joy" which I've seen on CBR and spewing straight venom for Gambit's sake. I'm not "jumping for joy" because I' havent read it, but I'm also not damning Gambit to oblivion at the thought of him being around Rogue. I was skeptical, but after talking KT, I'm giving her chance. Instead of stamping feet in the ground, go to Tumblr and Twitter and do the same yall. Might be surprised. At least enough to stop wishing oblivion.


I agree Don, because I felt the same way. Very skeptical. But the fact that Gambit is headlining a book again (whether he's second billing or not) and is being written by someone who has been very vocal about how she wants to treat him in ways that I certainly agree with, I'm gaining confidence by the day. Certainly don't believe he's doomed just because he's in a book with Rogue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 25, 2017, 11:39:02 AM
If it turns out to be bad, then it's bad. But deezang y'all, it's already happening. I don't want be that "crazy fan base" writers talk about. You know, the ones that drove Carey crazy lol. So crazy he retconned his own story just to get back at them? Good times.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 25, 2017, 11:43:19 AM
If you/any/all are excited, awesome. Buy this book!!! I will never tell you not to buy something you are genuinely excited about.

I'm glad she stoking your interest in the hobby via tumblr, twitter or where else KT wants to promote her projects. I wish her well and its great she's managing some excitement.
 
If she has instilled confidence via your interaction with her, fantastic.

I am not taking writers at their word anymore, too much subjectivity and no agreement on terminology. And I will go so far as to not interact with them either, let them do their thing and  I'll wait and see. The proof will be in print.  :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 25, 2017, 11:57:48 AM
I wouldn't use the word "excited", for me. Open to "waiting to pass judgment"... perhaps I should I just drop this. There seems to be a bias that because I'm not "against" the pairing, that I'm championing something (because I'm not) rather than cautioning fans about the way and frequency in which they voice negatively. Not talking about you persay, boss. Over on CBR as well. All I'm asking is that we wait and see. That's it. I'm not conducting a train here and you won't find any posts of me doing so. I don't like the idea of your either "for" or "against". It's just not a healthy way to get Gambit, the character, a fair shake in this climate of hyper-sensitive creators and execs (across the board, not just in comic either. Video game producers are very similar. But the two past times are so close in terms of demo, its basically the same type of person). I'm not about this allowing myself to be "polarized" by anything. I just dont get it. I dont harbor passion for one way of thinking or another. I pride myself on being that way. Except with cars... I'm a gear head and there certain things people do to their cars that I just can't stand. Oh, and I'm a Miami Heat fan... so, like eff LeBron (he tried to kill us on his way out. I will never forgive him for that. Let's go Heat.)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 25, 2017, 12:01:53 PM
Clearly, I'm using all the wrong words today. I apologize.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on October 25, 2017, 12:57:22 PM
People care too much about what writers or Marvel thinks.  We are the customers and I demand a good product.  I will never again temper my expectations or settle for breadcrumbs.  I did that for years with Gambit and you know what it didn't get better.


Marvel has earned my open hostility, disdain, and skepticism given their treatment of the character and saying that scares them away is making excuses.  When we were quiet they still screwed the character over so this idea we scare them away is just Marvel's way of justifying their f***ery.  If playing nice mattered then we wouldn't be in this predicament in the first place because sorry we played nice for decades.


Right now some of you guys sound like people that have been tortured for so long that they start making excuses for their torturer.  It's like comic book Stockholm Syndrome.  I'm done playing Neville Chamberlain to Marvel's Hitler.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 25, 2017, 01:39:53 PM
You aren't wrong Remydat. We are the consumers, and we should expect good product.  For me personally, that is one without Rogue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on October 25, 2017, 01:53:31 PM
Well the fundamental issue is this.  Does anyone honestly think anything is going to happen in this book that represents lasting development for Gambit?


At least with Deadpool and Gambit, the end result was a new relationship despite how lame the story was.  Now Gambit and Deadpool have a friendship.  What's going to come out of this?  The likely answer is nothing.


But if I'll happily eat crow if I'm proving wrong but I doubt I will be.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 25, 2017, 02:19:46 PM
Well the fundamental issue is this.  Does anyone honestly think anything is going to happen in this book that represents lasting development for Gambit?


At least with Deadpool and Gambit, the end result was a new relationship despite how lame the story was.  Now Gambit and Deadpool have a friendship.  What's going to come out of this?  The likely answer is nothing.


But if I'll happily eat crow if I'm proving wrong but I doubt I will be.




...where have you seen Gambit and Deadpool have a relationship since that book? We still don't know when that story took place as it had Gambit in his classic get-up and Deadpool didn't seem to have any relationship with Brother Voodoo. Deadpool has an ongoing and (was) part of several team books. It hasn't been brought up once, not even as a gag in UA where it would have had the biggest chance of being referenced. That book (which should have been cc's dream) devolved into utter nonsense. You give Marvel's observance of continuity too much credit. I'm almost certain that book was a cash grab because Marvel thought the Gambit movie was going to be in theaters, but when it got pushed they didn't want to hold onto it anymore, so they just added it to the Deadpool catalog.


And I just realized Neko's avatar is the ANXF cover with all those... things.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on October 25, 2017, 02:34:25 PM



...where have you seen Gambit and Deadpool have a relationship since that book? We still don't know when that story took place as it had Gambit in his classic get-up and Deadpool didn't seem to have any relationship with Brother Voodoo. Deadpool has an ongoing and (was) part of several team books. It hasn't been brought up once, not even as a gag in UA where it would have had the biggest chance of being referenced. That book (which should have been cc's dream) devolved into utter nonsense. You give Marvel's observance of continuity too much credit. I'm almost certain that book was a cash grab because Marvel thought the Gambit movie was going to be in theaters, but when it got pushed they didn't want to hold onto it anymore, so they just added it to the Deadpool catalog.


And I just realized Neko's avatar is the ANXF cover with all those... things.


I didn't say they have a relationship outside the book.  I said at least the book established a new relationship that didn't really exist before.  I enjoy Gambit interacting with people he hasn't interacted with before even though again the story was lame.  And it most certainly was a cash grab. 


Just like this book is most certainly a cash grab but it's a cash grab exploring a relationship I have seen done to death for 2 decades.  So again, I ask, what in this book will represent lasting development?  You are avoiding the question because deep down you know the answer.  There will be none.  Marvel will prostitute Gambit and Rogue to make a quick buck.  You just don't mind because you like the two together which is fine.


Neko and I are tired of this Marvel strategy so it's why we don't like the premise of the book.  Again, not much different than when they prostituted Gambit and Deadpool but the difference is I haven't seen those two interact as much so it's not as stale a concept as this book is.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 25, 2017, 04:02:53 PM
Avoiding the question? I didn't know you were asking... Sounded rhetorical. You read far too into that. When I respond its like you see what you want, sometimes. I never said I wanted this book, written by this writer. When it was announced I found it hilarious. I wasn't swooning as you seem to believe. I'm just not opposed to it as you are. I already said just a couple posts ago: "I THINK THIS BOOK IS A SET UP TO SEPARATE THE CHARACTERS." That's what I voted above in the poll I inserted on this thread more than two weeks ago. My lack of disdain for the couple doesn't mean I'm cheering them on, or even want them together. I. Don't. Really. Care. That is what Marvel has done to my "preference". End of the day, it's still happening. Got to live with that.


Most of, if not all, of my fandom for them as a couple doesn't exist past 2002, or whenever XXM ended. The only version of them that worked for me were alternate reality versions of the characters (The End and AoX, and that wasn't even them together). I just want to read a good book with my favorite comic character. And he's not slated to be anywhere else for the foreseeable future (I'm not happy about that. I'm already reading a DC title). I simply don't have the same hang-ups about Rogue as some of you. I don't think the character is the problem. Its the writers lack of imagination and their understanding of what makes Gambit work, ultimately. I said a looooonng time ago, that the only way I'd buy them being together was with some sort of universe reset or them to be able to address, on panel, the last decade of bad story lines. I figured that wouldn't be possible in a team book due to time constraints and I didn't see either of them getting a solo to do that and TBH I didn't think a book like that sounded like much fun. I've said this. If I had the patience I'd go find the post.


I think a while after I mocked up Gambit/Rogue fanfic outline to demonstrate as much. I think Purp got a kick out of that. But I digress... this announcement was quite a surprise. I'm also the same guy that's been advocating for Polaris, and Sage. You're painting me out to be some sorta of Romy-warrior. Go ahead and back track my posts and see where I'm such a bleeding heart.  Before I spoke KT I was not onboard with giving this a shot. And thats all I'm doing. I'm not singing any praises outside of how different she is to Soule (patronizing), Duggan (dick), Gage (spineless), PAD (spaz) and Carey (nutcase). I even pointed out that she was implicated in that "comic-gate" thing, which would be a strike against her. So I'm not saying this book is going to work or even be good. I'm saying I'm keeping an open mind, and I rather see how this boils out opposed to Gambit being in limbo alongside Boom Boom, Cecelia Reyes, and several other characters I like.


You're making assumptions about my mindset based on the fact that I don't feel the same way you do. It's like your insinuating that your either: Spazticat (die hard fan) or Badou (zealot against) in terms of how you feel about the couple. Man, @#$% that. I'm Pricetag. Can't put Pricetag in a corner. No one puts Pricetag in a corner! (thats probably going over everyones head).
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 25, 2017, 04:04:48 PM
And I just realized Neko's avatar is the ANXF cover with all those... things.

heh heh! You finally noticed!  :2funny:
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on October 25, 2017, 04:31:41 PM
Gambit and Rogue are one of the most iconic couples in comics history. They should have had such book a long time ago and I think it is good that they finally have such book.


Should they be a couple again? I think no. So far it is just a 5 issue mini about ex couple that will be friends in it.


I believe in KT answers and hope for the best. Will see.


Also I doubt that we would get Gambit project right now if it was without Rogue. It seems he will be in limbo after Astonishing and R&G till 2019 when they will announce solo to capitalize on movie.


Also it is kinda funny that Storm whose previous book Gambit last issue outsold on issue 5 is getting new book but Gambit's new solo is not interesting for Marvel.



Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 25, 2017, 05:33:35 PM
Agreed they are iconic and yes, this book should have been published in 2000's or earlier to capitalize on the appeal. Its why it feels like to me as a ploy to get money and not really worry about the story so much. Which again makes me think of the DvG mini as well. It wasn't that those writers cared all that much. It was to make money. No matter how well the book does, KT got paid.

Not a thing wrong with having faith in KT and her promotional responses. But I'm not going to spend the time with her or her answers.  Nor will I spend time on social media with her. I don't have it in me to vest in that. That said, good for her to work social media and getting fans pumped up. That is smart for sales. Good, I hope she is successful.

I'll wait til an issue comes out. See what happens, for me now -I don't believe in anything writers tell us, I need to read it/see it.

Marvel is producing or force feeding the same ol' stuff over and over again. I never needed a Ms. Marvel or Captain Marvel. Yet they get relaunch or whatever repeatedly. Squirrel Girl as well. Those books are not sales burners by any stretch. The O5 and their adult versions hold no appeal.  Yet, there they are with stories and books. Female versions of male originals again, not for me. There is literally no book where I say, wow - can't wait til Wednesday to get that one.

The problem has been the same for quite some time. We're stuck with the same characters over and over again. And when Gambit finally gets something, I have to decide whether or not to support based on the premise he is thrown into. There was a time when that didn't matter to me, it does now. I can't do it anymore.

Look, if everyone here is digging the idea and concept, again. Awesome. All the power to you. Embrace it. I can't though, I'll live vicariously through others. I'm incredibly happy for Don, cc, Purp, and the list goes on who is looking forward to the material. You are getting something and looking forward to it. That is good enough for me. I'll hang out in a corner, probably with Remydat, drink beer and find something else to do.   ;)

Don - totally forgot about the Liu story. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on October 25, 2017, 05:53:36 PM
Avoiding the question? I didn't know you were asking... Sounded rhetorical. You read far too into that. When I respond its like you see what you want, sometimes. I never said I wanted this book, written by this writer. When it was announced I found it hilarious. I wasn't swooning as you seem to believe. I'm just not opposed to it as you are. I already said just a couple posts ago: "I THINK THIS BOOK IS A SET UP TO SEPARATE THE CHARACTERS." That's what I voted above in the poll I inserted on this thread more than two weeks ago. My lack of disdain for the couple doesn't mean I'm cheering them on, or even want them together. I. Don't. Really. Care. That is what Marvel has done to my "preference". End of the day, it's still happening. Got to live with that.

Most of, if not all, of my fandom for them as a couple doesn't exist past 2002, or whenever XXM ended. The only version of them that worked for me were alternate reality versions of the characters (The End and AoX, and that wasn't even them together). I just want to read a good book with my favorite comic character. And he's not slated to be anywhere else for the foreseeable future (I'm not happy about that. I'm already reading a DC title). I simply don't have the same hang-ups about Rogue as some of you. I don't think the character is the problem. Its the writers lack of imagination and their understanding of what makes Gambit work, ultimately. I said a looooonng time ago, that the only way I'd buy them being together was with some sort of universe reset or them to be able to address, on panel, the last decade of bad story lines. I figured that wouldn't be possible in a team book due to time constraints and I didn't see either of them getting a solo to do that and TBH I didn't think a book like that sounded like much fun. I've said this. If I had the patience I'd go find the post.

I think a while after I mocked up Gambit/Rogue fanfic outline to demonstrate as much. I think Purp got a kick out of that. But I digress... this announcement was quite a surprise. I'm also the same guy that's been advocating for Polaris, and Sage. You're painting me out to be some sorta of Romy-warrior. Go ahead and back track my posts and see where I'm such a bleeding heart.  Before I spoke KT I was not onboard with giving this a shot. And thats all I'm doing. I'm not singing any praises outside of how different she is to Soule (patronizing), Duggan (dick), Gage (spineless), PAD (spaz) and Carey (nutcase). I even pointed out that she was implicated in that "comic-gate" thing, which would be a strike against her. So I'm not saying this book is going to work or even be good. I'm saying I'm keeping an open mind, and I rather see how this boils out opposed to Gambit being in limbo alongside Boom Boom, Cecelia Reyes, and several other characters I like.


You're making assumptions about my mindset based on the fact that I don't feel the same way you do. It's like your insinuating that your either: Spazticat (die hard fan) or Badou (zealot against) in terms of how you feel about the couple. Man, @#$% that. I'm Pricetag. Can't put Pricetag in a corner. No one puts Pricetag in a corner! (thats probably going over everyones head).


The characters don't need separating.  They haven't been a couple for almost a decade now.  It's a cash grab plain and simple.


And my point about you being a Romy fan is not to say you are diehard for the couple being together right now.  The point here was you are a fan of both characters.  I'm at the point now where I absolutely hate Rogue.  That's what marvel has driven me to.  You exist in a world where you can still see them having a relationship whether that be friends or otherwise.  I exist in a world where I honestly wish they would stay apart to the point I'd prefer death for one of the characters than seeing them together.  If Gambit were sick and dying on the road, I'd want Rogue to keep on walking rather than help him.


So there is simply no bridging that gap and I have no desire to sugar coat things just because some Gambit fans are also Rogue fans.  I have no obligation to pretend to like or tolerate Rogue just because so many Gambit fans like her.  I get that it's Marvel and the writers fault and not Rogue herself but too bad, I wish would just go away and Avenger and Gambit could be left out of any and all stories concerning her.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 25, 2017, 05:55:10 PM
...what exactly do you all think I'm trying to say?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 25, 2017, 05:58:47 PM

The characters don't need separating.  They haven't been a couple for almost a decade now.  It's a cash grab plain and simple.


And my point about you being a Romy fan is not to say you are diehard for the couple being together right now.  The point here was you are a fan of both characters.  I'm at the point now where I absolutely hate Rogue.  That's what marvel has driven me to.  You exist in a world where you can still see them having a relationship whether that be friends or otherwise.  I exist in a world where I honestly wish they would stay apart to the point I'd prefer death for one of the characters than seeing them together.  If Gambit were sick and dying on the road, I'd want Rogue to keep on walking rather than help him.


So there is simply no bridging that gap and I have no desire to sugar coat things just because some Gambit fans are also Rogue fans.  I have no obligation to pretend to like or tolerate Rogue just because so many Gambit fans like her.  I get that it's Marvel and the writers fault and not Rogue herself but too bad, I wish would just go away and Avenger and Gambit could be left out of any and all stories concerning her.


You've... Had some pretty rough relationships, huh?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on October 25, 2017, 06:02:30 PM
...what exactly do you all think I'm trying to say?


I don't think it's a matter of what you are trying to say.  I think it's a matter of we are on two opposing sides of a war.  That's melodramatic but the point here is this is not personal.  You are a great poster and we will always share a love of all things Gambit.


However, we will never see eye to eye on Rogue and her being around Gambit and there is no way for you to make the relationship palatable to us.  I completely understand why you want to give this book a try and I don't fault or blame you for it.  But I am opposed to everything this book represents.


So there is nothing for us to do except accept that when it comes to this, we are on opposing sides of a conflict.  You defend Gambit and Rogue being friends, acquaintances, lovers or whatever and I will rail against it till the end of time.  History has conspired to make us enemies in this conflict but it is what it is.  We must all act in accordance with our beliefs on this matter and there is no reason for it to get personal or for their to be insults or the like.  We just have a fundamental difference of opinion on this matter that will never be resolved until Gambit is treated with respect by Marvel.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on October 25, 2017, 06:05:02 PM

You've... Had some pretty rough relationships, huh?


Nah I am friends with most of my long term ex'es and one of them remains one of my best friends.  Mainly because none of them have ever treated me like how Rogue treated Gambit  ;D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on October 25, 2017, 06:24:24 PM
I actually don't want Gambit anywhere near Rogue at the moment. Ive said that too... I'm just accepting that this book and AST are actually happening. I'm willing to give KT a chance simply because I like to take people at the word and I also would like to read Gambit in a comic book that's not 20 years old... Seriously, I just bought a lot of like 10 books from 90 something on eBay. In many many ways you all care more about this than even I do. I'm just not as cynical.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on October 25, 2017, 06:30:07 PM
I actually don't want Gambit anywhere near Rogue at the moment. Ive said that too... I'm just accepting that this book and AST are actually happening. I'm willing to give KT a chance simply because I like to take people at the word and I also would like to read Gambit in a comic book that's not 20 years old... Seriously, I just bought a lot of like 10 books from 90 something on eBay. In many many ways you all care more about this than even I do. I'm just not as cynical.


And in many ways I envy your ability to still hope.  My capacity for hope and my ability to give Rogue and Gambit a chance died a long time ago.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on October 25, 2017, 06:35:03 PM
Perhaps some are more cynical than others. I think the issue with taking people at their word means pressure for the pay off of what is meant by that word. There is an expectation that you didn't realize you were holding on to. You can be disappointed. It happens.

Edit: if the word is kept then that is a bonus and enjoyment is achieved. I may be too jaded to hold on to that though. LOL


Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: M on November 04, 2017, 04:44:25 AM
Perhaps some are more cynical than others. I think the issue with taking people at their word means pressure for the pay off of what is meant by that word. There is an expectation that you didn't realize you were holding on to. You can be disappointed. It happens.

Edit: if the word is kept then that is a bonus and enjoyment is achieved. I may be too jaded to hold on to that though. LOL


Mayhaps, sometimes people -as you still seem stuck in  :gambit: - wretch thinking about the same sullen tic-toc of words upon.... New Orleans


This could be a very good comic... I doubt the author, but selling off is like selling off to the x-tinction agenda. Maybe, some of you stitches still know
it.


Then again maybe,
just maybe
this author could do an entertaining series


As for
I need some change
who got that?
what mutie? got that?
none
except Legion. That was sick ass series
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on November 04, 2017, 09:21:22 PM
... your keyboard working ok?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on November 04, 2017, 11:05:02 PM
Was that like a freestyle?  :D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: M on November 05, 2017, 02:31:38 AM
Was that like a freestyle?  :D


I like to think so


afterall...................
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on November 06, 2017, 05:41:42 PM
Pic from issue 2.


Flasback to Muir Island Saga
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on November 06, 2017, 07:16:37 PM
I like that art. I really do, looks good.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on November 06, 2017, 11:48:56 PM
Looks good... Don't know why it makes me think of Naruto?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on November 07, 2017, 04:50:47 AM
Looks good... Don't know why it makes me think of Naruto?


A lot of speed lines.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on November 07, 2017, 12:55:31 PM

A lot of speed lines.


You're right... good eye, broham.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: dcgregorya on November 14, 2017, 03:21:08 PM
I'm super psyched about this series. 


Things I'd like to see :

- A new hook for Gambit.    He's been done the same way for so long, he needs to grow as a character.    Maybe a new manifestation of his powers, something he needs to learn to control, some kind of professional growth for the character so it's not the same old boring 007 stuff (that doesn't really translate well to comics).   Would give us a sense that the old dog has some new tricks and give him some kind of internal struggle that doesn't revolve around cat sitting and resisting the temptation to bang every skirt he comes across. 


- A new twist to the Rogue/Gambit relationship.    Shared struggle is good but in general, they need a reason to rekindle some kind of tension beyond just "ur hot no ur hot".    This either needs to be a trait that Rogue discovers about Gambit or Gambit discovers about Rogue that's outside of their original attraction.    I was thinking of something like showing their more nurturing sides or some scenes where they discover their own unique brand of shared humour or something.    Hell, could be an intense love for camping, I don't really care but I'd like to see them discover something new about each other instead of it just being a retread of their baggage.   


- No damsel in distress for either of them.    Gambit and Rogue are both peak professionals I don't really want to see them shown as weak for the benefit of a relationship hook.   


- Lots and lots of combat.    I haven't seen Gambit actually kick anyone's ass in a long time.   I'll be pretty happy if this book shows some A-list challenges for both of them to overcome.   A meaningful threat where they need to step up their game and actually do so.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on November 14, 2017, 03:39:41 PM
I'm super psyched about this series. 


Things I'd like to see :

- A new hook for Gambit.    He's been done the same way for so long, he needs to grow as a character.    Maybe a new manifestation of his powers, something he needs to learn to control, some kind of professional growth for the character so it's not the same old boring 007 stuff (that doesn't really translate well to comics).   Would give us a sense that the old dog has some new tricks and give him some kind of internal struggle that doesn't revolve around cat sitting and resisting the temptation to bang every skirt he comes across. 


- A new twist to the Rogue/Gambit relationship.    Shared struggle is good but in general, they need a reason to rekindle some kind of tension beyond just "ur hot no ur hot".    This either needs to be a trait that Rogue discovers about Gambit or Gambit discovers about Rogue that's outside of their original attraction.    I was thinking of something like showing their more nurturing sides or some scenes where they discover their own unique brand of shared humour or something.    Hell, could be an intense love for camping, I don't really care but I'd like to see them discover something new about each other instead of it just being a retread of their baggage.   


- No damsel in distress for either of them.    Gambit and Rogue are both peak professionals I don't really want to see them shown as weak for the benefit of a relationship hook.   


- Lots and lots of combat.    I haven't seen Gambit actually kick anyone's ass in a long time.   I'll be pretty happy if this book shows some A-list challenges for both of them to overcome.   A meaningful threat where they need to step up their game and actually do so.


Well the "007" thing was only in operation during Asmus run as Fabian's was more action-adventure. Asmus' run was handicapped as you know. The angle wasnt really allowed to breathe IMO. I feel you about it getting old though, but not that part. My issue is the "Gambit's robbing someone"  thing that writers won't let go as if he's some sort of klepto and not part of an ancient order of thieves and more often than not doesnt steal for the hell of it but out of necessity and from certain marks. I too can do without ever seeing those cats again. I don't want to speculate on what KT has in store for the couple in terms of their relationship, but she seems honestly excited. But yeah, that damsel crap needs to go. Gambit is not some defenseless child that needs to be rescued despite what X-Men books will tell you. One of the reason a lot of people, even the Romy-detractors liked about the XXM run is that Claremont got them over their issues and into a place where it wasn't angsty anymore. Combat and action is important. I don't want to read a soap opera with a bunch of exposition and spilling of emotion. What do you mean A-list? Tombstone wasn't top shelf enough for you?! ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on November 20, 2017, 05:16:34 PM
A tweet you might be interested in.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on November 20, 2017, 05:21:48 PM
Good art. Thanks Neko :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on November 20, 2017, 05:39:30 PM
A tweet you might be interested in.


You beat me to the post..? Me thinks the lady protest too much.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on November 20, 2017, 06:31:26 PM

You beat me to the post..? Me thinks the lady protest too much.

LOL - bored today.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on November 20, 2017, 06:55:14 PM
She's been dropping bombs all day like this;


https://twitter.com/79SemiFinalist/status/932705406777925633


I think the closer we get the more she'll be sharing. Flood gates be a opening.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on November 24, 2017, 06:43:25 PM

More info on the comic.

-• Remy's bo staff will return
• The series is aiming to clear up some inconsistencies in their relationship
• Southern dialects won't be as strong
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on November 25, 2017, 08:01:27 AM
The southern dialects not as strong is not only a good thing but would make sense by now. Neither character has lived in the South for some time so the accent should fade a little and only get stronger when in their "home" in the South.

Clear up some inconsistencies in the relationship, if that means the "talks" they've never had but should have? I dunno. Might feel old or too late, depends on how well its done. Of course we don't know what inconsistencies that the writer is thinking of.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on November 25, 2017, 10:42:10 AM
I am sure KT told earlier that dialects in flashbacks will be bigger and smaller in present time.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on November 25, 2017, 08:16:22 PM
The southern dialects not as strong is not only a good thing but would make sense by now. Neither character has lived in the South for some time so the accent should fade a little and only get stronger when in their "home" in the South.

Clear up some inconsistencies in the relationship, if that means the "talks" they've never had but should have? I dunno. Might feel old or too late, depends on how well its done. Of course we don't know what inconsistencies that the writer is thinking of.


The only consistent thing about their relationship is it's inconsistency.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on December 04, 2017, 01:22:14 PM
https://news.marvel.com/comics/81517/together-rogue-gambit-sketchbook/
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 04, 2017, 02:49:02 PM
And small Gambit pic from R&G


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DQOeFrWVAAAku_p.jpg
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Spoonz on December 04, 2017, 03:00:13 PM
Damn that art is awesome!

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 04, 2017, 03:13:15 PM
Yeah. Good previews.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on December 04, 2017, 04:54:17 PM
Damn, that's great. I love the coloring in those pages too.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on December 05, 2017, 03:36:41 PM
I have to admit, I am really liking everything they're saying and it's getting me a little hopeful for this series. I hope it's not just smoke and mirrors to try to get people like me to spend money.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on December 05, 2017, 06:13:33 PM
I have to admit, I am really liking everything they're saying and it's getting me a little hopeful for this series. I hope it's not just smoke and mirrors to try to get people like me to spend money.

Me too.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on December 08, 2017, 10:04:55 AM
Gambit is freakin' pathetic, yet again. This is the ad for the series. If that is how Gambit will be inside this mini, I'm so not buying this .... this is not how I want Gambit to be nor is that how I want to read him.

Edit: the image is small.

Gambit's thought bubble:
 
Quote
Dis could be my last chance t'make up wit' Rogue .. if we both survive, dat is!


Rogue's thought bubble:
 
Quote
If that ol' swamp rat tries t'use this mission as an excuse to get back together, ah'll send 'im straight back to the Bayou!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 08, 2017, 10:09:17 AM
Gambit is freakin' pathetic, yet again. This is the ad for the series. If that is how Gambit will be inside this mini, I'm so not buying this .... this is not how I want Gambit to be nor is that how I want to read him.


It was writtern by marketing department and not by Kelly Thompson. She warned fans about bad ad a few days before release. This ad has nothing to do with book.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on December 08, 2017, 10:14:38 AM
And we are the internet savvy enough to find this information and know these things. Keep in mind there is a whole group of people who know nothing about this stuff.

It looks bad, and can't be taken back.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 08, 2017, 10:24:43 AM
Ad is lame but is just an ad made by someone who has nothing to do with book. So I don`t worry about it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on December 08, 2017, 10:47:19 AM
The point being, if the person seeing that ad doesn't participate on the internet or do but not with comic books on the internet. There is no way for them to know 1)KT didn't write and it was pr, 2) why would they assume pr dept wrote it when KT's name is on the cover and 3) the stereotypical stigma or dogma is pushed, however you wish to deem it.

This ad is the thing that irks Gambit fans, and pushes the divide more strongly between the fans of both characters.


Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on December 08, 2017, 11:52:41 AM
Yeah, I see your point, Neko. That ad's pretty bad, even by PR standards. It's like they're trying to appeal to a wider audience at the cost of possibly pissing off the very people who want to buy the book - aka Rogue and Gambit fans. But that dialogue is still lame, so hopefully no one reads too much into it.


I'm still pretty excited for the book itself, though. I have faith in KT. Hopefully this will be the only bad thing to come out of the book.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on December 08, 2017, 03:49:21 PM
I'm totally with you Neko. You know I'm a fan of these two's rapport with each other but not like this. This is exactly what I hate and fearful of in this series. It kills Gambit's character.


Is this the cover for issue #1? When everyone says "this is just an ad"  do you mean we will not see this as a cover?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on December 08, 2017, 03:55:15 PM
I'm totally with you Neko. You know I'm a fan of these two's rapport with each other but not like this. This is exactly what I hate and fearful of in this series. It kills Gambit's character.


Is this the cover for issue #1? When everyone says "this is just an ad"  do you mean we will not see this as a cover?


Correct, the thought bubbles should not be on the actual cover for #1. And if it is, I will be more peeved than I am right now.

I will give KT/Perez a shot but if I was base my decision on that ad, I wouldn't even bother with the book.

Which is why I pointed out, that while we know KT's intentions and have her assurances, there are plenty who have no clue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on December 08, 2017, 03:56:40 PM
It's this cover but without the thought bubbles. It's part of a line of different ads that are supposed to be retro looking
 https://www.bleedingcool.com/2017/12/06/marvel-retro-ads-guardians-rogue-gambit-x-men-old-man-hawkeye/ (https://www.bleedingcool.com/2017/12/06/marvel-retro-ads-guardians-rogue-gambit-x-men-old-man-hawkeye/)
 
edit, not sure what happened with the text, but I fixed it. - Neko
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on December 08, 2017, 05:25:17 PM
Who's doing the advertising then? That's the exact type of stuff that make people roll their eyes and groan at Gambit and Rogue. And it annoys the hardcore fans of the characters. Awful stuff.  Honestly guys, I really don't even like that artwork. Multiple red flags pop up immediately to me. It's a really bad first look imo.


And whats "retro" about it?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on December 08, 2017, 06:15:01 PM
And whats "retro" about it?

I don't know about the "retro" thing. I really didn't spend time looking.

That's the exact type of stuff that make people roll their eyes and groan at Gambit and Rogue. And it annoys the hardcore fans of the characters. Awful stuff. 

You stated what I could not more clearly, thank you. Agreed. Again, those who don't spend the time with comic books online will see that ad and could make judgements. Some might like it, some might not. It was not a great way to solicit the book. IMO.


Honestly guys, I really don't even like that artwork. Multiple red flags pop up immediately to me. It's a really bad first look imo.

All we have is KT's assurances that this book won't be like the ad. I'll give it a shot but there are other issues or red flags as you noted already. I was already on the fence with this book. Still am, how its advertised doesn't help in any way.

I know there are those who believe the words of KT, but we've been bamboozled  more than once by a writer. The proof will be in print and she really only has one issue to show me. Just my opinion.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on December 08, 2017, 06:33:49 PM
KT does seem more sincere than some of the other writers, but you do never now.


As for the 'retro' aspect, I think it's supposed to mimic the thought bubbles from the old romance comics, which also usually said stupid stuff ( and that were occasionally mocked by the fine arts community...). I think it's actually supposed to be funny, (though it's not funny.) Though I would not be surprised if this book didn't exactly have the full support of the marvel staff and they weren't trying very hard to do a good job. :/
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on December 09, 2017, 02:55:18 PM
KT does seem more sincere than some of the other writers, but you do never now.

I agree. She seems to care about the characters and that is a positive thing.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 09, 2017, 03:46:26 PM
First review


https://www.bleedingcool.com/2017/12...lassic-couple/
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 09, 2017, 07:34:32 PM

Rosenberg:


So last night I read ROGUE & GAMBIT #1 by @79SemiFinalist, Pere Perez, & co. I don't want to spend too much time harping on this but y'all better read this f***ing book.


It's smart, fun, intriguing, and most importantly it is doing something that almost nothing at Marvel, hell almost nothing in comics period, is doing. It is a romance comic, but through the lens of X-Men.


And if it was simply that I think it would be reason enough to support it. But it isn't. This is a super smart, adult take on romance storytelling. It's about disappointment, anger, resentment, and trust in your partner.


It never hits you over the head with it, but this is the type of relationship story we don't get enough of in any media. It's a story of how we navigate the lives we share with damaged people.


And there are cameos from some of my favorite X-Men. It makes me laugh. It has some great action. It's gorgeous and cleverly laid out. And it ends on a truly great moment. So make sure you grab this one. It's A+ comicking in a way we don't get a lot.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bigbarda on December 10, 2017, 08:51:37 AM
I'm intrigued. Will this be the first comic with both Rogue and Gambit in it that hasn't made me dry heave since CC Milligan's run?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on December 10, 2017, 09:35:39 AM
It might be... (knock on wood)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on December 10, 2017, 06:52:01 PM
Friggin book has buried landmines everywhere. With as much controversy it's fostered I think it's going to do really well if people can get past the corny first issue cover.... That cover is really corny to me and made me laugh out loud the first time I saw it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on December 10, 2017, 07:10:14 PM
*siiiiiigh* Confession time: I've gone from "not interested" to "kind of excited." It hurts to admit it.

It's been years since I've shipped Romy. And I know it'll be a disappointment somehow. But I'm considering ending my Marvel boycott and giving this a shot.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on December 10, 2017, 09:35:40 PM
It's hard not to want to give this a try. And I have to admit, Marvel focusing on a romantic couple in a series, whatever the scenario, is a bit outside the box for them in recent times. If it's done even decently it could be pretty popular. And Gambit and Rogue at one point were a very special duo.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on December 10, 2017, 11:15:30 PM
if its written well - I'm in. If Gambit is a chump, I'm done.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: M on December 11, 2017, 04:59:35 AM
Friggin book has buried landmines everywhere. With as much controversy it's fostered I think it's going to do really well if people can get past the corny first issue cover.... That cover is really corny to me and made me laugh out loud the first time I saw it.


I might attest to the fact that I have been, in my youth, really hyped on various Spider-man comics only to see it... blah into the blahness of I can't even remember... that's marvel.


Maybe a cover doesn't define a comic... maybe


@Neko ummmmmmmm got it, got it
-and what happened to all the gambit smileys?-
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on December 11, 2017, 09:53:48 AM
@Neko ummmmmmmm got it, got it
-and what happened to all the gambit smileys?-

You mean these?  :gambit: :gambit: :gambit: :gambit: :gambit: :gambit: :gambit: :gambit:
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on December 11, 2017, 11:16:25 AM

I might attest to the fact that I have been, in my youth, really hyped on various Spider-man comics only to see it... blah into the blahness of I can't even remember... that's marvel.



As a long-time Spidey fan, I know your pain. Slott's always hyping up his events as "breaking the internet" but it's more like he's just trying to get a reaction out of fans while the stories themselves are...lackluster imo. I finally dropped it about a year ago.


Hopefully R&G is a different story
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on December 13, 2017, 12:24:04 AM
The cover bubbles were disappointing but KT gave us a heads up before. Kind of hard to hold it against them. But the booked getting a lot of backing. At least 2 variants and plenty of coverage. Still don't have a big interview from KT, bit I think it's coming. Or I suspect it is at least. She said her editor allowed her to do things she figured would get turned down. I'm interested in seeing what these were.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 13, 2017, 05:08:06 AM
The cover bubbles were disappointing but KT gave us a heads up before. Kind of hard to hold it against them. But the booked getting a lot of backing. At least 2 variants and plenty of coverage. Still don't have a big interview from KT, bit I think it's coming. Or I suspect it is at least. She said her editor allowed her to do things she figured would get turned down. I'm interested in seeing what these were.


If I remeber right, KT told that she made 3 interviews. I think only 1 or 2 were released.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 13, 2017, 05:38:22 PM

https://news.marvel.com/comics/82054/rogue-gambit-tainted-love/


ROGUE & GAMBIT: TAINTED LOVE
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on December 13, 2017, 06:05:02 PM
Once again, I like what I hear. If this turns out to be a sham I will be so angry. >:(
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on December 19, 2017, 03:47:18 PM
(https://img.purch.com/h/1400/aHR0cDovL3d3dy5uZXdzYXJhbWEuY29tL2ltYWdlcy9pLzAwMC8yMTYvNTIzL29yaWdpbmFsL1JPR1VFR0FNQklUMjAxODAwM19jb3YuanBnPzE1MTM2Mzg4MDk=)


Decent cover.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on December 19, 2017, 04:17:56 PM
I love this cover. Pretty cool seeing all of their costumes over the years
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 19, 2017, 04:46:42 PM
Awesome cover. Funny that shirtless Gambit from dragon fight is there. And that shirtless Gambit was in Marvel heroes game too.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on December 19, 2017, 10:57:06 PM
Not sure if intentional or accidental, but all those costumed variations are positioned in the shape of a heart. I noticed it the first time I looked at it. If it was an accident, then it was quite an interesting one.


Oh, and hello everyone. I usually check in once every four to six months to see if there was any changes - this comic and the X-Men movie rights going (potentially) home, I figured it was enough for me to post.


Once. Maybe twice. We'll see what happens with my favorite character this time. *sigh*


I hope Racky is on standby, just in case.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 20, 2017, 02:58:30 AM
Not sure if intentional or accidental, but all those costumed variations are positioned in the shape of a heart. I noticed it the first time I looked at it. If it was an accident, then it was quite an interesting one.


Oh, and hello everyone. I usually check in once every four to six months to see if there was any changes - this comic and the X-Men movie rights going (potentially) home, I figured it was enough for me to post.


Once. Maybe twice. We'll see what happens with my favorite character this time. *sigh*


I hope Racky is on standby, just in case.


Cool! I hadn`t noticed that costumed variations are positioned in the shape of a heart. Thanks :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on December 20, 2017, 09:26:07 AM
Not sure if intentional or accidental, but all those costumed variations are positioned in the shape of a heart. I noticed it the first time I looked at it. If it was an accident, then it was quite an interesting one.


Oh, and hello everyone. I usually check in once every four to six months to see if there was any changes - this comic and the X-Men movie rights going (potentially) home, I figured it was enough for me to post.


Once. Maybe twice. We'll see what happens with my favorite character this time. *sigh*


I hope Racky is on standby, just in case.


Yeah, I kinda thought that too. Especially with Rogue's hair and then her cape curving at the top like that. I just thought I was seeing things haha
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on December 20, 2017, 09:27:44 AM
Love the cover.


Hawkeye is ending with issue #16 (KT's other book). I wonder if that opens up a bigger possibility that this becomes an ongoing if it sells well enough.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on December 20, 2017, 09:48:32 AM
I'm sure the uniform positions help form the heart shape but if you look at the light green shading around both characters, you will indeed see a heart shape. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 20, 2017, 10:00:21 AM
Love the cover.


Hawkeye is ending with issue #16 (KT's other book). I wonder if that opens up a bigger possibility that this becomes an ongoing if it sells well enough.


Don`t want to be too optimistic and fly in dreams but I think that R&G was planned as mini because thay are planning Gambit ongoing for Summer 2018. Also I think Bunn will write it.
Just speculating :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on December 20, 2017, 10:36:01 AM

Don`t want to be too optimistic and fly in dreams but I think that R&G was planned as mini because thay are planning Gambit ongoing for Summer 2018. Also I think Bunn will write it.
Just speculating :)

Speculating is fun. With Bunn it might be a grittier book than we've had in a long time. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on December 20, 2017, 12:22:16 PM
I'm sure the uniform positions help form the heart shape but if you look at the light green shading around both characters, you will indeed see a heart shape. :)


Wow, nice catch! On my computer it doesn't show up super well, but I definitely see what you're saying.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on December 20, 2017, 12:41:46 PM
Speculating is fun. With Bunn it might be a grittier book than we've had in a long time. :)


I always liked darker stories for Gambit.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on December 20, 2017, 12:48:44 PM

I always liked darker stories for Gambit.


Same here - it just fits his whole aesthetic/background. I've always liked characters like Gambit who can face a dark/gritty situation while still cracking a joke. I think Bunn would be good at balancing the lighter sides of Gambit in a darker setting while not tipping it too much one way or another.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 03, 2018, 07:48:18 AM
After reading that sneak peek page, I found it funny, but I KNEW it was going to bother some of you. Some of us have gotten so gun shy from seeing Gambit whipped on, that we're like opposite of those Rogue zealots. They see Rogue as never doing any wrong; Let's not be as if we can't take Gambit never not being on the winning side as a problem. This was mild and it made sense... it's @#@$$# Deadpool. I mean, c'mon. Eww... He barely has lips. That's nasty. I'd be without words too.


But that Civil War II @#!#, nah that was still some straight up #!#@-ery.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 03, 2018, 09:08:06 AM
I dunno, I'll still buy today .... I had to stop going to CBR. I can't take it. And I really do want to judge for myself. LOL
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on January 03, 2018, 09:38:59 AM
Does this come out today???
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 03, 2018, 09:52:55 AM
Yes :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 03, 2018, 09:54:17 AM
Does this come out today???


Holy s***, it looks like it does. Completely flew under my radar. Good thing I'm going to my LCS to pick up Astonishing and Grand Design today anyways
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on January 03, 2018, 11:15:34 AM
Not thrilled how he continually wants her back but she tells him.to move on. Kinda degrading to the character.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 03, 2018, 11:20:14 AM
Soooo, I checked Rogue and Gambit #1.

This is my first impression. Maybe will change smth when will reread it.

Positive: Loved art. It was reeeeaaaalllyy good.Issue was fun and Gambit was fun in it.Gambit/Storm moment was cool.Loooooved page where Gambit told that Rogue gave up and he is lifting alone. It felt real. Like situation in real relationships. Favourite moment so far.Last page made me really laugh

Negative:Deadpool is a better kisser then Remy?Premise of mission is not the strongest but it`s ok. Scene with running kids reminded me some episode of Scooby-Doo.Gambit was forcing Rogue toooooo much.

Overall: It was fine issue. I would give 8/10It felt really short or maybe I was reading it too fast Excited for more and sure that next issues will be better.It is hard to read Romy book when they are mostly angry but I understand why book started from this point.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 03, 2018, 11:27:49 AM


Negative:Deadpool is a better kisser then Remy?


Ugh. That annoys me more than it should.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Spoonz on January 03, 2018, 11:54:21 AM
Soooooo, verdict for just a plain ol' Gambit fan?  I mean I liked their relationship in the past but I've been seriously over it for a long time.


I'm hearing mixed things about it.  Gambit fans are saying he's begging Rogue (I've heard it's the same old thing of he likes her but she says it's over blah blah blah, annoying repitition), but then Rogue fans are saying that he's not begging her, he's just pushing her buttons and flirting like he did in the 90's.  Not sure who to believe!

It doesn't get released in the UK till tomorrow, I found out when I went to the shop, so could somebody do me the kindness of PM'ing me just a scan or two so I can make a judgement call? Could save a few pounds if it doesn't tickle my fancy.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Dantay on January 03, 2018, 11:55:22 AM
i think the Deadpool kiss thing is more Rogue trying to get a rise out of Remy, the bits i liked are the Storm interaction and his powers in the danger room. His interaction with Rogue in the beginning while at first i hated it did remind me of their first kind of interactions ie. the basketball game which was fine then but not now, Remy is like a love sick broken record, Rogue has moved on he should too, so the advertising bubble on the cover a while back was true and going by the issue was written by Kelly Thompson.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 03, 2018, 12:21:58 PM
i think the Deadpool kiss thing is more Rogue trying to get a rise out of Remy


That...actually makes a lot of sense for Rogue
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 03, 2018, 12:53:13 PM
Soooooo, verdict for just a plain ol' Gambit fan?  I mean I liked their relationship in the past but I've been seriously over it for a long time.


I'm hearing mixed things about it.  Gambit fans are saying he's begging Rogue (I've heard it's the same old thing of he likes her but she says it's over blah blah blah, annoying repitition), but then Rogue fans are saying that he's not begging her, he's just pushing her buttons and flirting like he did in the 90's.  Not sure who to believe!

It doesn't get released in the UK till tomorrow, I found out when I went to the shop, so could somebody do me the kindness of PM'ing me just a scan or two so I can make a judgement call? Could save a few pounds if it doesn't tickle my fancy.


I think you need to check it. Some things you will like and some are not but it is not some cameo for Gambit.


Here 2 lettered pages that I found in interviews.


https://static3.cbrimages.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/rogue-gambit-page.jpg?q=35&w=864&h=1311&fit=crop (https://static3.cbrimages.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/rogue-gambit-page.jpg?q=35&w=864&h=1311&fit=crop)
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DSkndN_X4AA33tz.jpg (https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DSkndN_X4AA33tz.jpg)


But my favourite page that made this book for me is not here ;D 
Penultimate was my favourite in comics and last one made me really laugh.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 03, 2018, 01:20:17 PM
Soooooo, verdict for just a plain ol' Gambit fan?  I mean I liked their relationship in the past but I've been seriously over it for a long time.


I'm hearing mixed things about it.  Gambit fans are saying he's begging Rogue (I've heard it's the same old thing of he likes her but she says it's over blah blah blah, annoying repitition), but then Rogue fans are saying that he's not begging her, he's just pushing her buttons and flirting like he did in the 90's.  Not sure who to believe!

It doesn't get released in the UK till tomorrow, I found out when I went to the shop, so could somebody do me the kindness of PM'ing me just a scan or two so I can make a judgement call? Could save a few pounds if it doesn't tickle my fancy.


Nothing really happens in the book except Gambit wanting to be with Rogue and Rogue refusing.  Depending on your affection for Romy, you either hate it or think it is fun but either way, it literally is just Gambit wanting to be with Rogue and Rogue refusing.


As a Gambit fan, I would just tell you to get the scan of the Storm scene and the danger room scene (Pixie is kind of funny) but otherwise save your money.  Maybe see how issue 2 goes because again the majority of the story is Gambit wanting to be with Rogue and Rogue refusing.  That's literally like 70-80% of the comic.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on January 03, 2018, 01:49:40 PM

Nothing really happens in the book except Gambit wanting to be with Rogue and Rogue refusing.  Depending on your affection for Romy, you either hate it or think it is fun but either way, it literally is just Gambit wanting to be with Rogue and Rogue refusing.


As a Gambit fan, I would just tell you to get the scan of the Storm scene and the danger room scene (Pixie is kind of funny) but otherwise save your money.  Maybe see how issue 2 goes because again the majority of the story is Gambit wanting to be with Rogue and Rogue refusing.  That's literally like 70-80% of the comic.


Thanks for the info. I'll take a pass on love sick puppy version of Gambit. Makes me happy though Rogue probably wont be in the movie.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Spoonz on January 03, 2018, 02:07:51 PM
That's disappointing to hear, the danger room scene looks good but Dantay's right, it doesn't work with everything that's been happening over the last few years. 

Hopefully I'll be able to get the full scene somewhere and the one with Storm, then I'll wait for issue 2 and hope for the best!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on January 03, 2018, 02:21:13 PM
A pic from the scene with storm


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DSo3j2PVoAArOnB.jpg:large
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Dantay on January 03, 2018, 02:27:43 PM
https://www.cbr.com/rogue-and-gambit-interview-kelly-thompson/ an interview with the writer, she talks about the fist issue so kinda spoilers
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Dandesun on January 03, 2018, 02:48:25 PM
There is an uneven feel to the relationship that's been there for a long time because the guy writers that have grown up and are writing seem to have an aversion to Gambit while adoring Rogue. That doesn't always work out, though... I really haven't been a Rogue fan since Carey got his mits on her. And because Remy doesn't have the page time that Rogue does, she gets to have new relationships and flirtations (some of which happen completely off-screen... Rogue/Johnny Storm) whereas if Remy so much as hits on another woman, Rogue invariably shows up to be judgemental.


Talk about your double-edged swords. But, hell, that was set up ages ago on Utopia with Remy's speech about how he knows that he is Rogue's endgame but she's know so sure, so until she is, he's not going to be following her around. Then he disappears for years at a time and shows up to puppy dog eyes at Rogue while she snubs him. It's a boring trend and has been for a long time. About as boring as the "Ah cain't TOUCH yuh, Remy!" "Mebbe, mebbe not, cherie..." merry go round of angst that started in the 90s in the first place.


Their barbed banter has always been fun but if there's nothing to back it up, it's just empty.


That being said, Remy asking her not to bring up the fact that they're beyond repair in whatever therapy they're going to take part in was a vulnerable moment that I could appreciate. Rogue's defeatist attitude about their baggage being too much followed up by Remy saying he's the only one carrying it... well, that's all true. It has always seemed like Rogue loved being the object of Remy's attention and affection but none too eager to put in the actual work. She always has excuses but never just says 'Look... this just isn't going to work, I'm not as invested as you. I shouldn't be jerking you around like this.' Because she LIKES the attention. So, either fish or cut bait as the saying goes.


If they want to move forward with them coming together again then Rogue has to step up in a big way. And if they're not going to do that, then let Remy have an actual relationship that isn't a freaking joke in the books. For as much as he's supposed to be a ladies man, Remy is the most celibate Cassanova ever.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on January 03, 2018, 02:57:44 PM
How are his powers and skills portrayed?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 03, 2018, 03:11:30 PM
KT tweeted to my conversation with Don:


Just to be clear...there's NO WAY anyone is a better kisser than Gambit...and nobody knows that better than Rogue. Rogue just ALSO knows how to get under Gambit's skin...& is enjoying giving him a hard time for trying to police who she kisses. ;D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 03, 2018, 03:18:45 PM
KT tweeted to my conversation with Don:


Just to be clear...there's NO WAY anyone is a better kisser than Gambit...and nobody knows that better than Rogue. Rogue just ALSO knows how to get under Gambit's skin...& is enjoying giving him a hard time for trying to police who she kisses. ;D


Hahaha I love it. Glad that was cleared up
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Zoks on January 03, 2018, 03:55:11 PM
I haven't posted here in a while, but I've been silently lurking while reading up on everything.  I picked this up and I have to say I'm cautiously optimistic about the book.  I am open to accepting that Gambit still holds a torch for Rogue, because guys do tend to have greater difficulty getting over a relationship than ladies.  I also hope this book settles it once and for all whether Gambit and Rogue get back together.

How are his powers and skills portrayed?

We didn't get to see any significant action.  I suspect we'll see something in later issues.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 03, 2018, 03:55:25 PM

Hahaha I love it. Glad that was cleared up


Me too ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on January 03, 2018, 04:26:10 PM
Kellys Explanation as to why she wrote gambit the way she did

https://twitter.com/79SemiFinalist

"Here's the thing I don't get...and maybe you guys (since I know you have strong feelings about this) can help me out (I thought about posting in the forum, but I think maybe it's a bad idea)...Gambit is in love with Rogue. Period. 1/?

"I see the harbor speech brought up a lot - and with good reason - it's a good speech and a GREAT character moment for Gambit to me - but that speech is not about saying "I"m moving on/I'm not in love with you any more" - that speech is "I am in love with you forever." 2/?

"But that speech is the OPPOSITE of an ultimatum. And seeing it that way HUGELY DIMINSHES Gambit. Like...seeing Gambit as a guy who has to throw down a gauntlet "choose me" Rogue or else! Makes him FAR LESS of a character than the guy that is SO CONFIDENT in who he is..."

".. what he has to offer the world (including Rogue) that he says. "I'm in love with you and I'll be here when you're done doing what you've got to do." The latter is a far more powerful and interesting person than the former. And more fitting to Gambit's growth as a character"
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on January 03, 2018, 04:28:35 PM
Thanks Zoks, hopefully so
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Meliorist on January 03, 2018, 04:50:31 PM
I'm with you, Zoks, cautiously optimistic. Though, my tendency is definitely to give the benefit of the doubt.


So yeah, the entire Rogue/Remy interactions feels very 90s and it is probably supposed to, going by the 'if time is a circle' bit. More, it makes sense from my assumptions(!). I don't follow Rogue's character very much, so I don't know when she lost her powers and what she has been up to since but if DonPriceTag's forum signature is anything to go by, it is a huge change from when she had control of her powers. So her romantic options have dried up and there is Gambit, not only calling her his best friend(really though?) but also still interested in romance. Like Dandesun said, Rogue likes the attention, maybe craves it since she had to be so adverse to it for so long and now that she doesn't get it, she is feeling insecurity that is reminiscent of 90s Rogue. That could all be wrong because I haven't kept up with what Rogue has been doing.


While it definitely is Gambit putting in all of the work to maintain a connection, because from how it looks Rogue would have let the friendship die as well, it isn't one sided feelings but one sided effort. Rogue has given up, Gambit has not. Which had me thinking; Come on, Remy, let it go...go on a date with Sage or Psylocke...


I also think we deserved a better parting line on the cliff hanger
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on January 03, 2018, 04:55:27 PM
I'm with you, Zoks, cautiously optimistic. Though, my tendency is definitely to give the benefit of the doubt.


So yeah, the entire Rogue/Remy interactions feels very 90s and it is probably supposed to, going by the 'if time is a circle' bit. More, it makes sense from my assumptions(!). I don't follow Rogue's character very much, so I don't know when she lost her powers and what she has been up to since but if DonPriceTag's forum signature is anything to go by, it is a huge change from when she had control of her powers. So her romantic options have dried up and there is Gambit, not only calling her his best friend(really though?) but also still interested in romance. Like Dandesun said, Rogue likes the attention, maybe craves it since she had to be so adverse to it for so long and now that she doesn't get it, she is feeling insecurity that is reminiscent of 90s Rogue. That could all be wrong because I haven't kept up with what Rogue has been doing.


While it definitely is Gambit putting in all of the work to maintain a connection, because from how it looks Rogue would have let the friendship die as well, it isn't one sided feelings but one sided effort. Rogue has given up, Gambit has not. Which had me thinking; Come on, Remy, let it go...go on a date with Sage or Psylocke...


I also think we deserved a better parting line on the cliff hanger


It's intresting, Kellys argument is Gambit is actually showing great self confidence by being rejected by rogue yet not giving up on her. hmmmmm. I dont agree.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 03, 2018, 04:56:00 PM
Kellys Explanation as to why she wrote gambit the way she did

https://twitter.com/79SemiFinalist (https://twitter.com/79SemiFinalist)

"Here's the thing I don't get...and maybe you guys (since I know you have strong feelings about this) can help me out (I thought about posting in the forum, but I think maybe it's a bad idea)...Gambit is in love with Rogue. Period. 1/?

"I see the harbor speech brought up a lot - and with good reason - it's a good speech and a GREAT character moment for Gambit to me - but that speech is not about saying "I"m moving on/I'm not in love with you any more" - that speech is "I am in love with you forever." 2/?

"But that speech is the OPPOSITE of an ultimatum. And seeing it that way HUGELY DIMINSHES Gambit. Like...seeing Gambit as a guy who has to throw down a gauntlet "choose me" Rogue or else! Makes him FAR LESS of a character than the guy that is SO CONFIDENT in who he is..."

".. what he has to offer the world (including Rogue) that he says. "I'm in love with you and I'll be here when you're done doing what you've got to do." The latter is a far more powerful and interesting person than the former. And more fitting to Gambit's growth as a character"


LoL that's from her, Purp and I conversation...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on January 03, 2018, 04:57:16 PM

LoL that's from her, Purp and I conversation...


Great conversation. She was very clear how she approached Gambit.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 03, 2018, 05:03:00 PM
The thread on Twitter is pretty extensive. She gave a lot of things to look at and I think we were able to get some points across. I brought Gambit being the one pushing but I also acknowledged that he wasn't the same in the beginning and the end of the book. I also brought up the fact that Rogue is a natural runner and KT said it's confronted in the series along with several other burning topics. I think we're in for something interesting. I think we're going to get the Gambit losing his patience being able to just air it all out. At least that's what I got from the "carrying the load" comment. Dams do eventually break.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 03, 2018, 05:35:27 PM
The thread on Twitter is pretty extensive. She gave a lot of things to look at and I think we were able to get some points across. I brought Gambit being the one pushing but I also acknowledged that he wasn't the same in the beginning and the end of the book. I also brought up the fact that Rogue is a natural runner and KT said it's confronted in the series along with several other burning topics. I think we're in for something interesting. I think we're going to get the Gambit losing his patience being able to just air it all out. At least that's what I got from the "carrying the load" comment. Dams do eventually break.


I think next issue we will see sneces from their past.
I think after that Gambit will realiza how much effort he made into relationship and will kinda let it go. And Rogue will realize how much he was doing and how much she missed.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 03, 2018, 05:39:07 PM

And Rogue will realize how much he was doing and how much she missed.


I'm hoping so. It would be a nice change in character for her instead of her somewhat-dismissive attitude towards him
Great conversation. She was very clear how she approached Gambit.


Agreed. I really like how she took the time to explain her intentions and her POV of the characters
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 03, 2018, 07:46:12 PM
Kellys Explanation as to why she wrote gambit the way she did

https://twitter.com/79SemiFinalist (https://twitter.com/79SemiFinalist)

"Here's the thing I don't get...and maybe you guys (since I know you have strong feelings about this) can help me out (I thought about posting in the forum, but I think maybe it's a bad idea)...Gambit is in love with Rogue. Period. 1/?

"I see the harbor speech brought up a lot - and with good reason - it's a good speech and a GREAT character moment for Gambit to me - but that speech is not about saying "I"m moving on/I'm not in love with you any more" - that speech is "I am in love with you forever." 2/?

"But that speech is the OPPOSITE of an ultimatum. And seeing it that way HUGELY DIMINSHES Gambit. Like...seeing Gambit as a guy who has to throw down a gauntlet "choose me" Rogue or else! Makes him FAR LESS of a character than the guy that is SO CONFIDENT in who he is..."

".. what he has to offer the world (including Rogue) that he says. "I'm in love with you and I'll be here when you're done doing what you've got to do." The latter is a far more powerful and interesting person than the former. And more fitting to Gambit's growth as a character"


But that's just it.  She didnt write him as saying I am in love with you and I will be here when you are done doing what you've got to do.

She wrote him like Soule continually pestering her about a relationship which renders his whole speech bulls***.  If he really meant what he said he'd leave her the f**k alone and let her come to him when she is ready instead of continually begging her to get back together.

Gambit fans aren't upset that he loves Rogue.  We are upset that he was supposedly done chasing after her based on that speech, Liu's AXM, the solo and X-factor yet here we have him doing the very thing he said he would not do.


I am actually shocked she understand what that speech meant and yet completely ignored it in her writing thus far.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 03, 2018, 08:11:03 PM
So... Ignore her forever, then? Again, I get what you're saying. I told  her there were parts that made my cringe. If it continues on like we saw in the first half of the book then theres a disconnect here but I don't think that's what's going to happen. She's pretty frank about what her plans are and Gambit did not behave on page 19 as he did on 5. It isn't easy trusting authors but so far I'm on board. I wasn't a fan of the chase, but I also can't see past the dinner invitation/harassment. The book was more than that.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 03, 2018, 09:17:42 PM
No I assume Gambit is an adult and can have a conversation with Rogue without it having to end with him begging her to be together.  He did this fine in the solo.


Basically what Soule did and what KT continued in issue 1 was a complete betrayal of that speech which is why I had assumed she didnt read it.  The fact she did, understood the implications but still had Gambit begging Rogue instead of reiterating for example the message from that speech truly baffles me.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AnimatedPhil on January 03, 2018, 09:42:45 PM
I honestly don’t see the hate for this issue. And I don’t see how Gambit is begging...at all.


In fact, Gambit came across waaaaaay better than Rogue. Rogue seemed like a sniveling witch with lame excuses of why their relationship ends and her comment about having it on her shoulders. Gambit’s line about not having super strength was beyond perfect. It’s true. Gambit came off confident and caring and an amazing tease with Storm and Rogue. It’s actual growth for a character that has been long overlooked with shades of what made him so popular in the 90’s.


there is just too much negativity about this issue. I honestly enjoyed this more than any issue Asmus wrote which had Gambit be a physical punching bag for c list villains and have him fight a weird dragon thing.


And this is coming from a guy who hadn’t purchased a Marvel comic since Gambit #17.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on January 03, 2018, 10:00:15 PM
Okay. So I just finished it and...

....I'm fine for now. Except Remy acting too lovestruck. :-/ I've always  thought he got more out of the relationship than she did, so it makes some sense for him to still have Feelings for her...but...it's been a long time. Come on. I want him to get angry--Angry!Remy is one of my faves, and it's a shame we don't get to see him much, because we should. He forgives too easily.

I don't know.

Honestly, that's my kneejerk response. I gotta digest it.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Zoks on January 04, 2018, 12:03:17 AM
No I assume Gambit is an adult and can have a conversation with Rogue without it having to end with him begging her to be together.  He did this fine in the solo.


Basically what Soule did and what KT continued in issue 1 was a complete betrayal of that speech which is why I had assumed she didnt read it.  The fact she did, understood the implications but still had Gambit begging Rogue instead of reiterating for example the message from that speech truly baffles me.

I understand how it seems like he's begging her, but I think it's the opposite.  He's letting her know he is still interested but his patience is running out.  It'll only be a problem if it ends with no progression.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 04, 2018, 12:04:02 AM
Well Gambit's pension for forgiveness roots back to his inability to forgive himself. He still blames himself for the deaths of all those innocent Morlocks. The sins of those around him pale in comparison to what he feels. His self worth still hasn't been addressed properly and is still an issue for him as of ANXF. It may also have something to do with how much he thinks of the women in his life. He may not believe he measures up. It could explain as to why we've never really seen him go after any of these topshelf heroines that are constantly around him. Perhaps he doesn't feel worthy?


Oh. That's deep @&#&.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 04, 2018, 12:05:45 AM
I understand how it seems like he's begging her, but I think it's the opposite.  He's letting her know he is still interested but his patience is running out. 


Think the same and KT actually liked and commented on that notion during her, mine and purps conversation.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Meliorist on January 04, 2018, 02:55:07 AM
I think Gambit's self-loathing/ lack of self-worth goes deeper than the Morlock Massacre, yes it was a huge blow but not the first. As an orphan on the streets he stole to get by before he was adopted by thieves and when he meets up with Kitty and Storm after Antartica, he says; when all else fails, I'm a thief.
Despite how much fun he is shown to have on his capers, he doesn't hold his profession and peers in high regard. So it would seem for Gambit that he fails to measure up to the people/heroes around him, even at the most fundamental level. Every wrong decision, every wrong choice has been a validation of that opinion. It's made worse because no one displays the same faith in him that they do in Wolverine and Rogue (maybe Deadpool also?). Which also sets up an odd dichotomy for the readers because you get lines like Rogue's from this very book; People in jeopardy or not, Remy's not going to agree. Which shows they know that helping people is important to Remy but a belief that his self interest will win out

Ninja Edit; I am enjoying that Rogue is calling Gambit by name and not codename
Seems we have moved up from 'caught a bad case of Gambit'
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Spoonz on January 04, 2018, 04:44:38 AM
Wow guys, went over to CBR to see what people are saying over there, got reminded about why I never post on that forum.  People are flat out vicious! About comic books! Good to see everybody here is keeping it civil even though a lot of folk aren't happy :)

Anyway I think I'll pick it up.  If I hate it then I hate it, if I don't then I don't, but it's causing so much discussion and debate I want to see what it's all about.


Edit: Can anybody explain to me the line about Gambit carrying the baggage himself and what he means by that?  I've got that stereotypical male disability of not being able to read subtext and I need things explained to me in black and white.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 04, 2018, 08:39:38 AM
I read it, and let time go by. And I'm glad I did.

I don't hate the issue, I don't love it. Its okay at best. I don't like lovesick Gambit, and he shouldn't be acting this way imo.

Spoonz - I think Gambit is taking all the blame of their failing relationship. IMO - he is not all to blame but whatever.


What I liked about the issue was the art. The first few pages was a terrific reminder of other issues, of the relationship and the moments were in those issues of their relationship. It was done really well. Best part, no words to ruin those images. It was a fun stroll as it were.

I'm tired of self loathing/self blaming/lovesick Gambit. I don't want anymore of it, its fatiguing, its draining. There is no pay off. No thing to look forward to for him.

I don't know if he was begging or not, I think I see him as trying but after all the crap she's done, I don't know why he tries and I don't want him to try anymore. She isn't worth it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 04, 2018, 10:30:41 AM
Wow guys, went over to CBR to see what people are saying over there, got reminded about why I never post on that forum.  People are flat out vicious! About comic books! Good to see everybody here is keeping it civil even though a lot of folk aren't happy :)

Anyway I think I'll pick it up.  If I hate it then I hate it, if I don't then I don't, but it's causing so much discussion and debate I want to see what it's all about.


Edit: Can anybody explain to me the line about Gambit carrying the baggage himself and what he means by that?  I've got that stereotypical male disability of not being able to read subtext and I need things explained to me in black and white.


He believes that she's given up on them or at least it feels that way to him. That she abandoned the idea of "them" a long while ago. Which makes sense because... You know. She's been with other people, while he steals kisses from women and either gets slapped, blown up or they... Die.


And don't let volume fool you. Out of the several hundred to a few thousand folk that frequent CBR there might a dozen people that didn't like the book enough voice their disdain. It's just the same few having conversations with those who did. It's really all that surprising. The ones that I figured wouldn't like it, didn't like. Twitter is kind of overwhelmingly positive. Not just people repeating themselves but having conversations about what they liked and disliked, because you know, nothing is perfect. I liked the book but it wasn't without fault. I just don't let it effect me so severely. First issue. If things don't move, then it's an issue but from what I read and what's been said by KT on Twitter, I don't think that's going to be the case. The beginning part was cringey in terms of Gambit but the last couple pages... I mean the what the @&## was anybody expecting? I thought that part was pretty much in line with what we we're bound to get.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on January 04, 2018, 10:44:15 AM
Well, I read it and I can't say my worst fears for this series have been quelled. There were some moments I like, like when Gambit comments he's carrying the load alone. Because it's totally true and I just wish sometimes that Gambit would drop it and just tell her off.


I know people are commenting on how their banter is reminiscent of the 90's but I disagree and I don't think it works now. In the early 90's they'd go back and forth and it was fun because no matter what Rogue said, she'd sometimes smile or wink or something giving the audience a hint that she was attracted to him and was enjoying his advances. At this point, it comes off like she's always just treating him like a dirt-bag. He doesn't deserve verbal abuse from her. I feel like there is a lot of X-Men that seem to just treat Gambit like a dirt-bag. Hasn't he earned something from them at this point? I know people like the Storm moment but even she  came off like she was annoyed by him. And Rogue just comes off like she doesn't want to even be around him at all or deal with him in any way.  And it's not even because it seems like she still has feelings. She seems like shes moved on a long time ago and doesn't even really like him much. I don't know, I just feel like there is a long way to go from here to get me to start liking these two as a pair again. I kind of just wish Gambit would just tell her off and get over her. Gambit just starts to come off like an emotional masochist at this point.


So I still have my worries for this series and this first issue didn't do much to soothe them. Interviews or conversations with KT mean very little to me at this point until I see something. I'm still not convinced this is not just a series to portray a "strong" female and pump up Rogue to the detriment of Gambit. But we'll see. I'll read the whole thing and trust me, I do really hope this series turns out to be great.


Oh, and I really found the Deadpool conversation to be obnoxious on a few levels.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 04, 2018, 10:59:06 AM
Ahhh... I thought the Deadpool conversation was funny. But it's probably because the only thing I liked about the DvG book was he and Gambit's back and forth. Kind of made me take that into account. How annoyed by it Gambit probably was by the very idea of it.


I'm just happy to be able to talk about Gambit again. Between this, red, Astonishing and the movie, this place can have some life again. For better or worse.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 04, 2018, 10:59:25 AM
Wow guys, went over to CBR to see what people are saying over there, got reminded about why I never post on that forum.  People are flat out vicious! About comic books! Good to see everybody here is keeping it civil even though a lot of folk aren't happy :)



Because this place feels like home for Gambit fans :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 04, 2018, 11:03:35 AM

Because this place feels like home for Gambit fans :)

You sweetie!  :gambit: :gambit: :gambit:
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on January 04, 2018, 11:28:57 AM

And don't let volume fool you. Out of the several hundred to a few thousand folk that frequent CBR there might a dozen people that didn't like the book enough voice their disdain. It's just the same few having conversations with those who did. It's really all that surprising. The ones that I figured wouldn't like it, didn't like. Twitter is kind of overwhelmingly positive. Not just people repeating themselves but having conversations about what they liked and disliked, because you know, nothing is perfect. I liked the book but it wasn't without fault. I just don't let it effect me so severely. First issue. If things don't move, then it's an issue but from what I read and what's been said by KT on Twitter, I don't think that's going to be the case. The beginning part was cringey in terms of Gambit but the last couple pages... I mean the what the @&## was anybody expecting? I thought that part was pretty much in line with what we we're bound to get.


The reviews from comic sites are overwhelmingly positive. A lot of high praise from even people who don't care about either character or their relationship. I was really pleased to see that. 


I really liked it, but I understand some of the complaints from the Gambit camp. I too feel that KT needed to hold back on some of Gambit's flirting, but I expected it, hopefully it'll balance itself out and Remy will have some self-control...then again Rogue will be running around in a two-piece in the upcoming issues...so I'm not sure how he'll handle that :P


I'm treating it as a fun 5-issue romantic comedy, it's supposed to be a little cheesy, it was always going to be relationship-heavy, I think we all knew that going into it.









Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 04, 2018, 11:38:13 AM
Is what it is. Looking at it as a rom-com is probably best.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on January 04, 2018, 04:57:45 PM
A few more thoughts...

I read this thread before reading the issue and I was honestly expecting worse behavior from Remy...while I didn’t like it, it didn’t seem like he was begging. Really, I was (and am) confused, because the last time I saw them, he was sad-but-resigned about the relationship; now he wants to work on it as though they’re still in a relationship and have hit a rough patch. She’suninterested and he’s too eager.

And I agree with Don’s post about his feelings re. forgiveness stemming from the MM.

Someone needs to tell Remy that a best friend doesn’t treat you the way she has.

Also, I was really surprised to see the complaints about the Deadpool stuff—I do like that he was appropriately disgusted—since I thought it was plain she was trying to get under his skin.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on January 04, 2018, 07:08:48 PM
It's hard for me to just look at it like a fun little rom com considering the baggage between them. I just think it's high time that Gambit start being treated with more respect and dignity in these comics. Especially one with his name in the title. We'll see. Still early yet but imo it wasn't started wonderfully.


I know it's obvious to assume Rogue's comment was merely said to get under his skin. But why does he deserve that? That's really more my issue. Like has been said in here, Rogue has hooked up with and gotten physical with almost every man who's crossed her path over the last bunch of years. Without a seconds thought for Gambit. Any time Gambit gets into these situations he's made to feel guilty, or Rogue pops up to judge him, or the woman is killed. The comment just comes off like an attempt to hurt Remy or knock him down a few pegs which I don't feel is necessary at this point. She just comes off as cold and if they are going to get me invested in the re connection of their relationship then I have to see it from her too and not just on his end.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on January 04, 2018, 08:45:51 PM
I know it's obvious to assume Rogue's comment was merely said to get under his skin. But why does he deserve that? That's really more my issue. Like has been said in here, Rogue has hooked up with and gotten physical with almost every man who's crossed her path over the last bunch of years. Without a seconds thought for Gambit. Any time Gambit gets into these situations he's made to feel guilty, or Rogue pops up to judge him, or the woman is killed. The comment just comes off like an attempt to hurt Remy or knock him down a few pegs which I don't feel is necessary at this point. She just comes off as cold and if they are going to get me invested in the re connection of their relationship then I have to see it from her too and not just on his end.

My surprise was just that people took it so seriously, and I get why it wasn't liked. And I agree with you 100%--the problem with Rogue and Gambit hooking up with other people is not only that double standard, but also because writers and editors won't LET them be in relationships that are normal. Rogue has been put with every random guy and we're supposed to just deal with it, while Gambit hooks up with people off-panel, or has a rushed-awkward kiss or like you said, the lady dies. Her behavior in this first issue is why I'm currently a former Romy shipper. It's clear she doesn't want anything to do with him whatsoever. So him wanting to spend time with her and work on their relationship--a relationship that ended, what, over a decade ago?--so seeing him do that at the beginning didn't make sense. I've been out of the loop for a few years, but from what I understand, nothing significant has happened in my time away.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Zoks on January 05, 2018, 02:07:27 AM
Just a reminder for everybody commenting on the timeline of their breakup.  Marvel operates on a compressed timeline, so what has been 10 years for us is probably a year or two for them. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 05, 2018, 02:08:58 AM
Just a reminder for everybody commenting on the timeline of their breakup.  Marvel operates on a compressed timeline, so what has been 10 years for us is probably a year or two for them.

great point. Its why I dislike a few things,  LOL
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on January 05, 2018, 02:29:08 AM
I know—I kept editing my post and forgot I left that bit in.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on January 05, 2018, 08:02:18 AM
When I mentioned the years or Rogue hooking up with and getting physical with all the males she could, I was referring to what us the fans have had to endure.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 05, 2018, 09:22:57 AM
I've found myself reluctant to post, anywhere. I like analyzing and talking through points but I find that difficult with this &#[email protected] cloud overhead as if someone's puppy just thrown off of the rooftop in "Above the Rim" or "Juice"... Which would be traumatizing, and sad, and I don't want to talk about the puppy anymore (I miss you Roscoe...)


But here I go... If we recall it's revealed that Kitty spoke with Gambit first. Seeing as the time basically moved from one scene to the next it's obvious that Kitty's conversation with Gambit occurred before we even see him and Storm together in the Danger Room. Begs to reason that everything following that instance wasn't just him (for goodness sake) "harassing" her but kind of extending an olive branch because he knew they were about to be stuck in close quarters together.


Someone is going to take what I said as some sort of lame excuse. As if some sort of zealot, which cannot be proved by anything I've said outside of someones individual feels. Let me kill that by reiterating that I too wasn't really into the way Gambit was behaving at the mansion and have been saying that since Wednesday and said it personally to KT herself. But taking into account that Gambit had information Rogue didn't, it does explain why he even bothered.


Just a funny observation, if we're calling what he did in this issue harassment, chances are half you probably wouldn't have been born lol. But I get it, it's a cumulative thing. I too found it irksome. But I'm not a pessimist, so there's that. The story moved forward from that point, try not to get stuck on it until you see where it goes. Remember, until like issue 3 we we're pretty ok with DvG, and that was just a poorly written book unlike this.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 05, 2018, 01:04:23 PM
Too long in time for real people, and too short in time for the characters but long enough for change. Gambit has not progressed while Rogue is out having a great time. I will reiterate - Gambit has not progressed.

Lets take time as a factor as pointed out earlier. Even if we say its 1 or 2 years for the characters. Rogue has clearly moved on. Gambit has not and should have, I don't want to read him in the same state as Xmen Legacy.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on January 05, 2018, 04:20:28 PM
I'm gonna keep this short... because a line has been crossed that I didn't really expect.. But KT gave us fair warning for what to expect in this issue. With that in mind, I enjoyed it. A lot actually. I do understand that a lot of people may never have had the opportunity to see or hear what KT has told us, and I can understand why they maybe wouldn't come back for a second issue. But for me personally, with the knowledge I have on the book, I'm in for the whole mini.


And the art was great.


And Gambit's actions are being blown way out of proportion.


*Ducks and covers*
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on January 05, 2018, 07:56:06 PM
I do agree that the dialogue in it wasn’t 90s era level, because of Rogue; before, it was like the back-and -forth of a tennis match—this time, it felt more like someone throwing a tennis ball against a wall.
The more I think about the issue though, the more at peace I’m becoming. I admit, I loved how Perez set up the the Romy moments at the start.

Also, we know tension is on its way, which I’m excited to see.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Meliorist on January 05, 2018, 11:52:54 PM
As (maybe?) the only person that said they dialogue was akin to the 90s, I said reminiscent and not an exact copy. For me it had similar shades but with the difference that it seems like Rogue doesn't even feel inclined to maintain the friendship. Sort of like going through the motions instead of the desire of the 90s, if that clears up what I meant when I said, 'reminiscent of the 90s'
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on January 06, 2018, 01:53:49 AM
So this is the first comic I've bought in... over a year, definitely. Probably two, maybe longer.


I figured I'd just go into it and read with an open mind and no expectations. Doing that, I thought it was pretty interesting, and had some spots that made me chuckle too. The art though, was absolutely stupendous, and definitely made me enjoy it more than I might have otherwise.


I sorta forced myself to get 'over' Romy after the end of X-Treme, when Gambit was essentially gutted as a character and became Racky. I'm really just hoping this series puts a period at the end of everything that came before, so if they do decide to 'start over', it really is that - starting over.


Of course though, with Gambit now being in X-Men Red, (and potentially more as his movie debut finally moves up) who knows what Marvel is going to get up to. Oh well.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 06, 2018, 10:16:55 AM
I do have a question and I'm really asking .... because I'm not going to do the research to find out. LOL

Did KT say in an interview or on twitter that she was doing a different take on the relationship?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 06, 2018, 01:03:07 PM
Finally got around to reading this last night and I ended up really liking it. I'm a Romy fan anyways, so I'm interested to see how the next few issues play out. The art was great (the double page splash with all the bits of their history laid out was really cool) and there were some funny bits (I chuckled quite a bit at Gambit saying 8 people called him about Rogue and Deadpool). I'm also legitimately interested in the actual story with the disappearing mutants.


Gambits actions were weird but I like Don's reasoning for them. I do wish he'd back off with that stuff a little but it's not the creepiest stuff that's ever been in an X-Men book (I think a lot of Fanto's behavior in UXF was worse tbh). I'm personally hoping this mini will help fix some of that behavior - not necessarily to make him more PC but to see him grow a little more as a character.


The only other negative thing I have to say about the book is I wasn't a fan of the scene between Kitty and Rogue. I'm not actually a fan of Kitty in general (I know that's heresy in the x-fandom) but I just thought it was weird how she handled telling Rogue about the mission.


Anyways, I give it 8/10. Not perfect but I think KT has a good thing going. Even if they don't get back together, I hope this mini solves their issues BC I think everyone is sick of that stuff haha
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on January 06, 2018, 01:20:55 PM
I wonder who the 8 people were that called Gambit lol
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 06, 2018, 02:46:05 PM
I think it's safe to say one was Deadpool himself haha
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on January 06, 2018, 03:26:24 PM
I do have a question and I'm really asking .... because I'm not going to do the research to find out. LOL

Did KT say in an interview or on twitter that she was doing a different take on the relationship?


From everything I have seen and read, I know she has said we're going to go over some old stuff, clear the air, take the dirty laundry to the cleaners, etc.


She's left what will happen after that up in the air, only hinting that they'll return to their 90's teasing days - which there was already a small example of in this issue.


It's also been hinted that if this series sells well it may be able to go beyond a 5 issue mini, so perhaps she has a pitch should the series continue, but most of me is of the belief that she's going to leave them at 'good friends, blank slate' status unless there are some big shakeups in issue 2, or 3 at the latest. I'd hate a legit relationship to be restarted at the end of the last issue, unless the others start obviously leading up to that point.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 06, 2018, 04:08:53 PM
Okay - Thanks Paradox Jast. That actually helps a little for my view of the book, or why I felt it was "old" as it were.

I guess you gotta start somewhere. Clearing the air would be good, its just so late in doing so that its jarring or at least for me. LOL
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on January 06, 2018, 06:44:17 PM
I think it's safe to say one was Deadpool himself haha


LOL for sure!!


8 people Rogue! Eight! INCLUDING Deadpool!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 08, 2018, 09:51:47 PM
I don't watch that guy, but Marvel has systematically wiped their long term couples, I will agree with that.About Gambit 'harassing' rogue because she's clearly not interested... that second part just isn't true. The mini where some are complaining about was not trying to show that. And even before that in other  titles it wasn't true. In UA, she was hitting on fake/ RSgambit, and she told him that. Sure Dugan was only writing that to troll the Gambit fans, but it was still there. In Astonishing, on the astral plane, she didn't turn him down, she said I'm not sure if I can take getting my heart broken again, but ok, then we'll save the day, but then Xavier swiped her away. In the mini, when they wind up on the floor of the danger room, she literally stays there underneath with her arm around him while pixie and Betsy talk about them, when kitty is talking about the mission, she says they need a couple, and rogue says that they are in flux, not over and she's moved on and not interested any more. And again on the beach, she's not sure if they can fix their relationship, not she's not interested.If you don't like that because you think he should be done with her nonsense, fine, that's a valid opinion. But you don't need to agree with the haters that he's being a creep, going after a girl whose not interested. She shown that she's 'interested' but then gets cold feet, not the same thing.



Rogue is a runner by nature. She doesnt stick around when things get real. When I said this to KT, she agreed. Then Xel over at CBR quoted me and said "I'm wrong"... because he's Xel and hes one of those uber fans (Gambit has them too) that believes Rogue cant do wrong and by even suggesting it is an insult. Let's count the ways she's "run"


1. Ran away from home after her powers emerged.
2. Left the Brotherhood following her attack of Ms Marvel
3. Ran from X-Men (1) after absorbing Gambit before/after/during AoA (time man...)

4. Without talking to Gambit regained her powers and tricked him into doing the same during XXM, essentially running from their new life, back to a more uncertain one.
5. Ran from Gambit once gaining control of her powers saying "she wasn't ready"
6. Ran from Gambit after the harbor speech, basically saying to her: "balls in your court". So she bounced to Mags.
7. Ran clear cross the country from Mags
8. Broke it off from Mags when he tried to get serious
9. For the most part, left the X-Men when Xavier died. Only coming back for small stints


Think I got them all...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Meliorist on January 08, 2018, 10:04:58 PM
See? Not running at all! More a strategic retreat...forever >.>
Yeah, she has a history of it. Probably other examples in Uncanny Avengers, not that we need more


I also had to copy your post and enlarge it in word processor haha
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 08, 2018, 11:14:33 PM
I do have a question and I'm really asking .... because I'm not going to do the research to find out. LOL

Did KT say in an interview or on twitter that she was doing a different take on the relationship?


She did at one point but I presume she meant over the course of the mini.  Although not seeing how this will be different as seems fairly standard romantic comedy type fare at this point.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 08, 2018, 11:51:32 PM
See? Not running at all! More a strategic retreat...forever >.>
Yeah, she has a history of it. Probably other examples in Uncanny Avengers, not that we need more


I also had to copy your post and enlarge it in word processor haha


Yeah I fixed that... Not sure what happened.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 09, 2018, 08:24:30 AM
I was going to post this in Gambit watch, we seem to be crossing some between that and this thread.


If you are enjoying the book, great. Buy it, buy more than one copy if you can. Give it all the support.

I've done my buy and see thing and this is not the book I wanted nor the Gambit I wanted. The one thing no one can point a book to or choose continuity to address is the complete lack of progression on Gambit's part. He is still doing the same thing he has been doing since being hooked up to Rogue in the 1990s whenever in a book with Rogue, he is always in pursuit. And if you love that, great.

Clearly there is nothing more to Gambit than Rogue.
edit: And Gambit's pursuit of Rogue. It's incredibly disappointing for this fan of Gambit.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 09, 2018, 09:23:05 AM
So that's the line now? Love it or hate it? I think life is so much more than that. I think that kind f thinking can be toxic. I see it a lot in the Rogue threads. Heck, I don't even like the idea of "appreciation" threads where you can only be positive like people need some sort of safe space. I don't think this "in or out" way of thinking is healthy for the fandom. Any fandom. Look what it's done to Star Wars and DC (movies). It's ok to have varying degrees imo. If you're too rigid, you'll snap... I don't want you to snap boss-lady... Be like the water.


 ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 09, 2018, 09:26:32 AM
I think we have a healthy fandom. We talk about Gambit  failings. It what makes him a great character.  Better than Rogue imo, at least deeper. Writers seem afraid of letting her fall, so they don't and they've conditioned the fans to not be able to accept the idea of her being anything less than "totally awesome". Let's not go down that dark path of tribalism.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 09, 2018, 09:51:25 AM
I don't think it is tribalism at all.  We all like what we like.  Gambit fans have never tried to tell other fans what they should like.  The conflict comes in the fact that we are being told we shouldn't feel the way we do which I find odd.  There is nothing toxic about not liking something.  It is just personal preference.  The toxicity comes in not just accepting we are different people with different tastes and getting worked up by it.


Not you because you generally have a level head.  But you go to CBR and the minute someone expresses dislike for something, the people that like it are like Vultures circling a corpse.  They sit there trying to preach to you how wrong you are for not liking what they like.  It is almost to the point that it is a mob mentality.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 09, 2018, 09:58:38 AM
I didn't say "like" I said "love" and "hate". That creates a toxic environment of people taking sides and getting all wrapped in stuff that at the end of day is nonsensical, as I said similarly to what I've seen with star wars and DC fans as they defend their preference.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 09, 2018, 10:18:59 AM
It is only toxic when people can't accept that we love and hate different things.  Have I ever gone after someone for liking Romy?  Not sure why Romy fans feel the need to try and convert me and it is not my fault if they do.


You can't police other people's preferences.  If I hate a story, I am going to say I hate it and people need to learn to simply accept that.  We can debate the story but you don't see me throwing insults and the like yet there are always the angry Romy fans that resort to name calling and such.


So if it is toxic, that needs to be addressed to the people that make it toxic which is certainly not people like Neko or me as we have never attacked or been disrespectful to others.  We simply don't like a story.  There is no crime in that which requires the kind of animosity it seems to generate particularly on CBR.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 09, 2018, 10:28:05 AM
@Don - thanks, I won't snap. And I'll do my best to not be rigid as you say, and be more like water.  :D

Next comment is not directed to those here, its an awareness thing:

There is a whiff of "suck it up buttercup" or "be happy Gambit is in something" - the mentality being, if you are a Gambit only fan too bad. That Gambit fans are horrible fans because they don't like anything and complain all the time.  Which leads to further assumptions that its the Gambit's fans fault for whatever reasons, book ending or not getting an ongoing (you know thats coming, right?) and why? For not embracing something they didn't like, despite their favorite being included in a book. The Gambit fan should just spend the money and shut up. It's a depressing thing when you think about it.
Again above comment is not directed to those here.

This pairing is polarizing at best. Either you love them or hate them, those in the middle don't care.

In the end, I think a different approach from the one used might have been better, I dunno, I have no clue where or what the writer was thinking or plans on taking the pairing.  All I know is what is in print is not what I wanted to see, and I know, its on me. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on January 09, 2018, 12:58:29 PM
K, I'm only going this about the harassment angle again, not making 'exceptions' for my favorite character. The last two intereaction they had were 1- her hitting on 'him', at work 2- him hitting n her, at work, and her reciprocating. It's hard to argue Gambit thought his attention would 'unwanted' under those circumstances.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 09, 2018, 04:18:51 PM
K, I'm only going this about the harassment angle again, not making 'exceptions' for my favorite character. The last two intereaction they had were 1- her hitting on 'him', at work 2- him hitting n her, at work, and her reciprocating. It's hard to argue Gambit thought his attention would 'unwanted' under those circumstances.


Not sure what you are referring to.  In AXM, Gambit is trying to convince Rogue to be together and she does not want to.  In R&G, Gambit is on top of Rogue and he says something and he pushes/slaps him away.  Then he comes up behind her and grabs her shoulders and she walks away.  Then on the whole plane ride he is trying to convince her and she keeps giving him reasons why it won't work.

Not sure where in the above Rogue hit on Gambit and getting pushed/slapped as well as a girl walking away when you touch her makes it obvious the attention is unwanted.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Rakkner on January 09, 2018, 05:02:17 PM
I don't have any problem with Gambit's actions. Idk why it's getting this much attention in the first place.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on January 09, 2018, 06:03:24 PM
I don't have any problem with Gambit's actions. Idk why it's getting this much attention in the first place.


Because for some it's more of the same and seen as regression of the character. Others don't mind. Nobody's right. Everyone has a right to feel the way they want. Both sides are rational... for the most part.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: albahan888 on January 10, 2018, 01:38:48 PM
I think the 'problem' with this series is that even if KT wrote the perfect 5 issues that addressed and fixed all of the recent and not so recent problems with Rogue and Gambit and Romy and got them back together in the perfect way Marvel doesn't care and some of y'all don't care. Jim Zub will put her with the Human Torch or someone else will put her with whoever else because Marvel doesn't seem to care about continuity anymore especially in regards to relationships and some of you just don't like the pairing which is fine. I just miss character continuity and consistency and that hasn't been a thing with Gambit and Rogue since Milligan at least... or at least it's been the wrong sort of consistency.

I mostly just would like to see Gambit be a hero again because he is one. I don't buy Marvel anymore so I don't really have an opinion on the series as such but I'm probably never gonna not be a big Gambit fan so I'd like to see him treated well and not like a bumbling failure thief at least since he's supposed to be one of if not the best one. Just wanted to get some thoughts out there even though like I said I haven't read this and I probably won't be seeing any more about it than spoilers posted here and elsewhere because I don't give Marvel my money anymore.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 10, 2018, 02:14:49 PM
I hear ya albahan888. I would love for Gambit to be written the way you've described, it would be nice to see again.

And I also agree that no matter what happens that Rogue will be paired with a writer favorite for whatever book she is in and that has been the case for years.

Yes, continuity is hand picked or ignored completely. I don't know why, maybe because there is so much of it? Why not have an editor help with that, they don't have to read everything. Just get up to speed and go, but it seems now that character histories and backgrounds is no longer desired. Writers want to put characters in situations for whatever story idea and run with it.

Glad to see you post. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on January 10, 2018, 08:18:25 PM
In the west its all about chasing those dollar signs over anything else, so if that includes ignoring continuity, then so be it. Or maybe they figure there are only so many stories you can tell over so many years?


I think that's why as I got older I shifted more towards eastern manga/manwha, because they consist of a set stable of characters in a story or stories that can persist over the course of a decade or more (obviously based on a number of popularity factors, but that doesn't make it any less true). You gain a sense of understanding and attachment as you learn about the characters.


Nowadays with Marvel comics (and probably DC) its just to see who can throw out the shiniest object at the moment until the next one comes along, with the person polishing the objects getting to decide how much polish to use when buffing.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 10, 2018, 08:53:16 PM
We are in a post "continuity lite" world. I mean we have a place for that. They were Max titles, graphic novels, and "What If?" The main titles are all about continuity, or should be. It's the whole point of having a universe. I remember someone saying that the new Marvel will be a place where "story trumps continuity". That sounds more like fan fiction to me. But that was said under the old regime. I'm hoping for a new approach.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 11, 2018, 03:31:29 PM
In the west its all about chasing those dollar signs over anything else, so if that includes ignoring continuity, then so be it. Or maybe they figure there are only so many stories you can tell over so many years?


I think that's why as I got older I shifted more towards eastern manga/manwha, because they consist of a set stable of characters in a story or stories that can persist over the course of a decade or more (obviously based on a number of popularity factors, but that doesn't make it any less true). You gain a sense of understanding and attachment as you learn about the characters.


Nowadays with Marvel comics (and probably DC) its just to see who can throw out the shiniest object at the moment until the next one comes along, with the person polishing the objects getting to decide how much polish to use when buffing.


Agree on manga/manwha.  Just better storytelling with a focus on the characters.  Of course, that is a bit easier because it is usually one writer so it's a singular vision but it seems Marvel no longer knows how to tell a coherent story across all the writers it now employs.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: M on January 12, 2018, 05:57:18 AM
OKayz, I guess I missed this drop...


alot of this is just about issue 1 of a mini series? right? right?


Also KT as the author has and should be a questionable choice...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 12, 2018, 08:12:04 AM
OKayz, I guess I missed this drop...


alot of this is just about issue 1 of a mini series? right? right?


Also KT as the author has and should be a questionable choice...

heh heh, all about issue 1, 4 more issues to go.

I agree about KT as a questionable choice, especially based on her prior or other projects with Marvel.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 12, 2018, 09:16:28 AM
heh heh, all about issue 1, 4 more issues to go.

I agree about KT as a questionable choice, especially based on her prior or other projects with Marvel.


Hawkeye? What else did she do with Marvel? The only concern I had/have with her was how much of a self proclaimed Rogue fan she was. She hardly ever brought up Gambit prior to the books announcement. So to be writing both made me a bit apprehensive. So far, it's ok. I don't think we've seen the Lions share of what she has in store but if the rest of the run is exactly like the first issue in terms of her handling of Gambit, then we might have a problem. But I argue that Gambit in the beginning of the book is different than at the end. I think the same will carry on through out the mini. I hope at least.


However, she did beat me in a small discussion involving issue numbering. At the very least she's knowledgeable of early 90s Gambit lore. I think I was out of my depth. I'm sure Dantay would have taken her ;)


Oh right, she did A-Force! Wasn't a big fan of that but I'm sure I wasn't the target audience for that. I guess if we're concerned about equal time, it's more likely she'd lean towards the female role. But that might be more Marvel's old practice of making writers write only characters they have something in common with. Women write women books, Muslims write Muslim characters, Black people write black characters. It's pretty dumb. I see the cause for concern better... But issue 1 was ok with me for the most part.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 12, 2018, 10:22:29 AM

But issue 1 was ok with me for the most part.


Same here, which is saying something because I was nervous about the book when it was first announced.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 12, 2018, 10:59:01 AM
Don't know about her comic book work but I was concerned regarding her reviews particularly of the Asmus solo.  I could tell that her vision for Gambit wasn't necessarily the same as mine as she was very critical of the premise of the book claiming it was treading the same ground.  This was incredibly odd at the time as we were coming off of Racky LeBeau so it really was ground that needed to be tread.  As the below illustrates, her reviews of the solo were consistently lower than a lot of the other reviews.  I remember at the time wondering if she was reading a different book than I was.

https://comicbookroundup.com/comic-books/reviews/marvel-comics/gambit/1 (https://comicbookroundup.com/comic-books/reviews/marvel-comics/gambit/1) 

Now looking back, it seems her love of Rogue and Romy impacted how she viewed the book.  It is interesting she was concerned about the solo treading the same ground yet that is exactly what she is doing in her mini.  Guess it is ok to tread the same ground when that ground involves Rogue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 12, 2018, 11:47:26 AM
Good find, remydat. I didn't read all of her reviews (mostly just looked at the first and last), but I definitely had some disagreements with her (especially around her critique's of Mann's art). I did agree with her initial statement that Asmus had a good handle on Gambit's voice, which I always think is important for him.


I disagreed with her final statement in the last review about how Asmus and Mann didn't "pull [the series] together". IMO, it had some rocky parts but it was a fun book and probably my favorite of Gambit's solo series.


Idk. I need to read more of these, but it kinda makes me nervous
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 12, 2018, 11:50:39 AM
I don't feel like quoting, you know who you are. LMAO

I was concerned for Gambit under her pen because her prior work is female oriented. Which is fine if that is what Marvel wants to do for those books she was given. However, in addition to that slant, she's also listing herself as a feminist on her twitter. So ..... I question equality for the sexes because of her lean and her prior history with the books. I do not expect Gambit to be treated fairly. It will be about how great Rogue will look and whatnot.

I am also in agreement that her reviews of the Asmus solo were particularly harsh and without merit. Clearly only certain people can retread ground while others can't. But she is doing exactly as she complained about with Asmus book, same old ground only she is the writer and that makes it okay. The concern really is ... Gambit is only a love interest and nothing more.

My expectations are low, Rogue will be the precious princess and Gambit will be the scumbag. I want the cycle to end, I don't know why that is so hard for Marvel to do.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 12, 2018, 11:56:18 AM
This also illustrates an interesting point.  The internet never forgets, lol.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 12, 2018, 12:16:02 PM
And once its out there, you can't take it back. You can delete but  some will remember anyway.  LOL
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 12, 2018, 01:10:40 PM
I want the cycle to end, I don't know why that is so hard for Marvel to do.


My guess is for reasons similar to why they're pushing a Black Widow movie: there's a huge feminist movement right now. If they give Rogue, who they've been pushing as the leader of the Avengers, any kind of faults and put Gambit, a known womanizer, in the right, people will see Marvel as sexist. Not that that's what would actually happen. But I could see Marvel thinking it would
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: M on January 12, 2018, 03:19:17 PM
lolz I guess I need to buy this ASAP.... If just for the hype now.


ROMY gotchya' like....  :crazy2: :gambit: :laugh: :P :gambit:
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 14, 2018, 01:38:45 AM
I don't think it's quite that simple as she admitted to me that she wasn't a fan of XXM either. I think she's in search of a specific theme outside of what we've seen so far in large quantities, anyway. I'm not going to swear by her or anything like that, but hey, at least I got something to read and talk about.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 15, 2018, 10:04:44 AM
I haven't listened yet, but Kelly Thompson was interviewed on Battle of the Atom about R&G: http://www.xavierfiles.com/2018/01/15/battle-atom-episode-24-kelly-thompson-20-year-grudge-lila-cheney/
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: andresa on January 15, 2018, 12:58:19 PM
Just finished listening. There’s nothing really new if you follow her on tumblr and twitter tbh except for the “classic x-men meets eternal sunshine of the spotless mind” comment around 28 min.

You know, she's always struck me as a Rogue fan who happens to be also a Gambit fan and listening to this just reinforced this image.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 15, 2018, 01:15:54 PM
On point way of looking at it. I'd say pretty much the same. It is very much everything she's said but for those who haven't bothered it's a good way of getting to see her standpoint. Not a bad podcast, bit too hipster-stereotypical for my taste ("one true Wolverine" "one true Hawkeye", statements referring to Laura and Kate). The other host needs to adjust his low end and mids... That or take the mic out of his mouth.


However she did address her review of the Asmus Gambit series. Basically saying she was too judgemental of it after going back and re-reading the series and her subsequent reviews of it. That was able to better understand what was going on now that she was in the business now. So there's that.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 15, 2018, 01:46:50 PM
Not a bad podcast, bit too hipster-stereotypical for my taste ("one true Wolverine" "one true Hawkeye", statements referring to Laura and Kate). The other host needs to adjust his low end and mids... That or take the mic out of his mouth.


Yeah, Jenkins especially can be super polarizing about his opinions (well, the same can be said for Jay and Miles which is why I can only listen to them in small doses).
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 15, 2018, 03:06:00 PM
Just finished listening. There’s nothing really new if you follow her on tumblr and twitter tbh except for the “classic x-men meets eternal sunshine of the spotless mind” comment around 28 min.

You know, she's always struck me as a Rogue fan who happens to be also a Gambit fan and listening to this just reinforced this image.


I got that feeling early on though, and without this podcast. Based on her statements and her "leans" and projects she's been given, had already lead me to believe that it would be Rogue first as it were.

On point way of looking at it. I'd say pretty much the same. It is very much everything she's said but for those who haven't bothered it's a good way of getting to see her standpoint. Not a bad podcast, bit too hipster-stereotypical for my taste ("one true Wolverine" "one true Hawkeye", statements referring to Laura and Kate). The other host needs to adjust his low end and mids... That or take the mic out of his mouth.


However she did address her review of the Asmus Gambit series. Basically saying she was too judgemental of it after going back and re-reading the series and her subsequent reviews of it. That was able to better understand what was going on now that she was in the business now. So there's that.


Sure, she can say that now but damage was already done and the solo is gone. We knew she was being too judgemental and saying she was now because of being in the industry doesn't really help.  She has perspective now, I suppose that is nice. Her mind was closed back then, how open is it now? Just a thought.

She will most likely make this book more about Rogue and Gambit being a romantic interest (or Rogue's purse, however you want to look at it) not being an equal in the book. And those comments are valid.

My expectation is low. I'll buy the next issue but she has said nothing to convince me that this will be good for Gambit, in general.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on January 15, 2018, 05:22:33 PM
I'm just going to wait and see what she does.

Her mention of Eternal Sunshine has given me an idea that their memories of their relationship are going to ultimately be erased, causing them to go back into infatuation mode, a la the couple they met. If that''s the way it's going, that was similar to a plotbunny I had for a fic awhile back.

And by the way, I'm so sick of hearing the same complaints about Remy either being 90s cliches rolled into one or what "an 11-year-old would think was cool". Nobody ever seems to elaborate on what exactly that last one *means*. And even if that's so, isn't that true of most superheroes?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 15, 2018, 05:40:45 PM

And by the way, I'm so sick of hearing the same complaints about Remy either being 90s cliches rolled into one or what "an 11-year-old would think was cool". Nobody ever seems to elaborate on what exactly that last one *means*. And even if that's so, isn't that true of most superheroes?


Ha, that's a really good point (I mean, just look at Shazam/Cap Marvel). So sick of hearing that criticism.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 15, 2018, 05:59:32 PM
Not to mention, that XTAS Gambit and comic book Gambit have little in common in terms of personality. So the version people talk about doesn't really exist. And the whole "creepy" thing is head canon as he hasn't been romantically connected with ANY OTHER CHARACTERS outside of his ex-wife and Rogue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 15, 2018, 06:01:38 PM
I got that feeling early on though, and without this podcast. Based on her statements and her "leans" and projects she's been given, had already lead me to believe that it would be Rogue first as it were.

Sure, she can say that now but damage was already done and the solo is gone. We knew she was being too judgemental and saying she was now because of being in the industry doesn't really help.  She has perspective now, I suppose that is nice. Her mind was closed back then, how open is it now? Just a thought.

She will most likely make this book more about Rogue and Gambit being a romantic interest (or Rogue's purse, however you want to look at it) not being an equal in the book. And those comments are valid.

My expectation is low. I'll buy the next issue but she has said nothing to convince me that this will be good for Gambit, in general.


I... I was just talking about the podcast. Just added that to reflect "new" developments as most of what she spoke of was retread. I'm kinda done "advocating" at this point.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 15, 2018, 06:42:11 PM

I... I was just talking about the podcast. Just added that to reflect "new" developments as most of what she spoke of was retread. I'm kinda done "advocating" at this point.

All good, I'm done in general. Wait til next issue and see how it goes. :)
Apologies if I offended in anyway. 

edit:
Look .... I will say again. If this book is your thing and you enjoy it. BUY IT. It really is that easy, don't let anyone here sway you in either direction. You love it, buy it. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 15, 2018, 06:57:25 PM
Just finished listening. There’s nothing really new if you follow her on tumblr and twitter tbh except for the “classic x-men meets eternal sunshine of the spotless mind” comment around 28 min.

You know, she's always struck me as a Rogue fan who happens to be also a Gambit fan and listening to this just reinforced this image.


I would say she is like Rogue's BFF and Gambit just happens to be the boyfriend that she gets along with.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 15, 2018, 06:59:21 PM
However she did address her review of the Asmus Gambit series. Basically saying she was too judgemental of it after going back and re-reading the series and her subsequent reviews of it. That was able to better understand what was going on now that she was in the business now. So there's that.


Well at least she recognizes it now as yeah back then I remember thinking she was reading a completely different series than I was.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on January 15, 2018, 08:03:58 PM
Not to mention, that XTAS Gambit and comic book Gambit have little in common in terms of personality. So the version people talk about doesn't really exist. And the whole "creepy" thing is head canon as he hasn't been romantically connected with ANY OTHER CHARACTERS outside of his ex-wife and Rogue.

*the highest of fives*

YES. That's the problem with XTAS--it introduced people to the X-Men...but if you weren't Wolverine, Prof. X or Magneto, you didn't get much in the way of characterization. And it's so frustrating as a Gambit fan, because imo, he was one of the least-fleshed out.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 16, 2018, 10:41:33 AM
*the highest of fives*

YES. That's the problem with XTAS--it introduced people to the X-Men...but if you weren't Wolverine, Prof. X or Magneto, you didn't get much in the way of characterization. And it's so frustrating as a Gambit fan, because imo, he was one of the least-fleshed out.


And what makes it even more frustrating is that's the most he's appeared in a cartoon by far. I liked him more in WatXM (although I wasn't a huge fan of Lamaar's voice for him), but he was only in 2 episodes.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on January 16, 2018, 06:50:56 PM
Okay that's enough trashing of X-Men TAS.  ;)  Just kidding. But seriously, X-Men TAS is considered one of the greatest superhero/comic book children's cartoons ever created for good reason. They only had 20 minutes per episode and managed to balance a slew of characters(heroes and villains) many different themes and a bunch of different types of stories. Aside from Wolverine and I guess Xavier and Magneto most of the characters are played at their surface level. Which isn't surprising considering it's a kid show. But along the way you got little hints and insights into their characters which I feel they did for all the characters pretty well. Nice little subtle things too. The best thing the show did was get kids to check out the comics for further material on these characters.


To say Gambit's personality in XTAS has little to do with the comics is a bit off imo. It's just very surface level. The first couple of seasons of XTAS was still pretty early in Gambits creation  and he was still very mysterious. Would I have liked to see more done in later seasons, sure, but let's not forget either that Gambit along with Jubilee appeared in roughly half the episodes that most of the other characters appeared in. But the cartoon spiked the interest. Once you got into the comics Gambit was even cooler, more bad ass, and had more depth and that's where the fandom really began. Gambit is definitely memorable in the cartoon but he really grabbed the fans who picked up the comics.


That's why I get so annoyed with modern day haters who say, "He's more of a side character" "He has lame powers" "He's just a 90's cliche" "He couldn't hold his own movie" etc. To me, these are people who's total knowledge of Gambit is from that cartoon. You could say that about all the characters pretty much in some way. They're all some type of cliche. Aside from Wolverine, Gambit and Rogue are probably the biggest standouts from the show in part due to look and the best voice acting on the show. Unfortunately Gambit's character has suffered a ton of awful writing over the past bunch of years in the comics so considering how popular he was, hate has eventually taken place. Calling him a "90's cliche" is just straight up hate and no one can actually explain what that means. It's just nonsense people spew and can't back it up with any coherent argument.


The episode Aces and Eights from WATXM is a terrific Gambit episode. Though I agree Phil Lamarr's awful voice acting almost ruins it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 17, 2018, 01:23:08 PM
There was the part of the podcast that said (she says might a spoiler) that she drew upon the movie Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind. I have to say I was late to the game on that movie. Probably didn't see it until a year or so ago. It was good. A little trippie and the idea of that being some sort of inspiration is kind of scary, but at the same time supports my original theory of why this book even exists. Ironically it might make a couple of you really happy lol.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 17, 2018, 01:32:04 PM
It's just very surface level. The first couple of seasons of XTAS was still pretty early in Gambits creation  and he was still very mysterious. Would I have liked to see more done in later seasons, sure, but let's not forget either that Gambit along with Jubilee appeared in roughly half the episodes that most of the other characters appeared in. But the cartoon spiked the interest. Once you got into the comics Gambit was even cooler, more bad ass, and had more depth and that's where the fandom really began. Gambit is definitely memorable in the cartoon but he really grabbed the fans who picked up the comics.



Don't get me wrong, I love XTAS. I was a kid when TAS came out and it was my first exposure to the character (and then I got more interested in him when I got into the comics, kinda how you're describing). But, like you said, it was on early in Gambit's history, so he wasn't fleshed out well, which makes it so the show doesn't do him the justice he deserves. Nothing against the show because I still enjoy watching it - it just wouldn't be something I would recommend (at least not right away) to someone who is interested in the character but knows nothing about him.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 17, 2018, 01:39:01 PM
There was the part of the podcast that said (she says might a spoiler) that she drew upon the movie Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind. I have to say I was late to the game on that movie. Probably didn't see it until a year or so ago. It was good. A little trippie and the idea of that being some sort of inspiration is kind of scary, but at the same time supports my original theory of why this book even exists. Ironically it might make a couple of you really happy lol.


Yeah, I'm a fan of the movie as well. It'll be interesting to see how she implements some of those ideas. Either way, hopefully she means that she'll use the ideas to end their weird bickering/drama. Even if they don't get back together, it would just be nice for them to have some respect for one another's lives outside of one another, if that makes sense.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on January 17, 2018, 02:45:49 PM
I have an idea of what's going to happen based on her mention of the movie...and what I'm thinking is kind of bittersweet. It'll be an ending *and* a beginning.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 17, 2018, 03:13:13 PM
I think it's all really interesting and has a distinct double edge to it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 18, 2018, 09:49:22 AM
and what I'm thinking is kind of bittersweet


I think it's all really interesting and has a distinct double edge to it.


Agreed with both. Which, if it happens (and she pulls it off well), I think could make everybody happy. Keep their relationship open-ended in the end.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 18, 2018, 11:06:33 AM
I'm not too concerned about that part more than I am of selective memory erasing that's not embraced by the rest of the company. It'd be yet another major development ignored by everyone else not involved with the book.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 18, 2018, 11:20:08 AM
That's...a very good point. Especially with how crappy Marvel's editor's have been lately continuity-wise.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 18, 2018, 01:01:03 PM
I am a huuuge fan of that movie. Lovie it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 19, 2018, 10:01:19 AM
I'm in the minority but I don't like the premise of the movie for which inspiration is being drawn. I think I should stop while I'm ahead. This is clearly not for me.

Memory erasing? Really? I don't know.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 19, 2018, 10:04:06 AM
Yeah that would be a huge cop-out IMO and run counter to the whole "Well I had to respect continuity."  Right let's respect the continuity that came before by having the characters not remember it, lol.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: andresa on January 19, 2018, 10:35:08 AM
Maybe she meant more like them reliving those memories in a sense and not really getting them erased.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 19, 2018, 10:43:54 AM
I am sure memories won`t be erased or they would start without memories in #1, already.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 19, 2018, 10:52:10 AM
I am sure memories won`t be erased or they would start without memories in #1, already.


Did you mean to post this for the R&G thread?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 19, 2018, 10:55:29 AM
Maybe she meant more like them reliving those memories in a sense and not really getting them erased.


That's what I'm thinking (because that happened a lot in the movie). Still be able to respect the history while also giving some room for a reset of sorts. How she'll do it is another story.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 19, 2018, 03:04:08 PM
I fixed that, I think Purp did mean this thread.  :D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 19, 2018, 03:58:53 PM
I'm in the minority but I don't like the premise of the movie for which inspiration is being drawn. I think I should stop while I'm ahead. This is clearly not for me.

Memory erasing? Really? I don't know.


If anything like what happened in that movie happens here, this isn't going to be a story you can just bail on boss... Like I said this is scary, but interesting. I don't think think we'd be able to ignore it away. It's getting kind of funny now.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 19, 2018, 03:59:42 PM
Maybe she meant more like them reliving those memories in a sense and not really getting them erased.


Yes that would make more sense.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 19, 2018, 04:38:00 PM

If anything like what happened in that movie happens here, this isn't going to be a story you can just bail on boss... Like I said this is scary, but interesting. I don't think think we'd be able to ignore it away. It's getting kind of funny now.

I suppose but if its like the movie, isn't it rehashing? I've never seen the movie, I am basing my opinion on the wiki and whatnot.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 19, 2018, 04:44:59 PM
Kelly Thompson is now exclusive w Marvel: https://news.marvel.com/comics/83263/marvel-announces-exclusive-agreement-kelly-thompson/
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 19, 2018, 05:54:01 PM
Yeah saw that over at CBR. I may disagree with her vision of Gambit but by all accounts she does her research and engages with fans so congrats to her. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 19, 2018, 06:06:15 PM
Agreed, I saw it on twitter. Good for her! I hope she does well with her exclusive with Marvel, even if I don't like her take on Gambit.  ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 19, 2018, 09:32:15 PM
I fixed that, I think Purp did mean this thread.  :D


Thanks. Yeah, it seems I posted in wrong thread:)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 19, 2018, 10:06:36 PM
Yeah I think its a smart move on their part. Seems like she's been pretty well received and, aside from here, the majority of feedback I've been hearing about R&G has been positive. Makes me wonder if they'll give her an ongoing X-book
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 20, 2018, 11:16:28 AM
*chuckles* well "here" is very specific for one character, while "there" has more interest in other characters with specifics thrown in. 

If you are not as vested in Gambit and are just reading the book for whatever reason, then I'm certain its okay - clearly its getting good reviews but I would say those reviewing aren't necessarily vested in one or the other. They're just commenting on what they feel is a "good" story. Nothing wrong with that. :)

It's vestment where the passion comes from - those not really caring all that much about either character have an easier time with the story. IMO.

edit: added thought

For example, when as a group of Xmen fans looking at Astonishing Xmen, we've pretty much agreed its a well written book. Soule has crafted an interesting story. As a Gambit fan, there isn't much. For me, I've dropped the well written book because my favorite isn't really doing anything.

Here with this book or at least with issue one, I don't think Gambit is shown in a positive light, he's not being portrayed as I would have wanted. And that is on me and I'm alright with it. Others don't mind for whatever the reason. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 20, 2018, 01:39:07 PM
Well, I get your point, but even the other Gambit fans that I know in other communities liked R&G - it just comes down to personal opinion in the end (like you pointed out). My point is just that KT being a Marvel Exclusive is still a good move on their part. She may not have the name recognition but she's a fairly new writer and it seems like a lot of people like her stuff.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 20, 2018, 03:36:05 PM
I'm not knocking her or her job or exclusive contract with Marvel. I did say in an earlier post, good for her. It's a deal she wanted, Marvel wanted and good for her.


Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 20, 2018, 09:46:08 PM
With her and Rosenberg, they are probably cheaper than signing a Bendis to an exclusive deal and hopefully they introduce some consistency and continuity across the X-books.  That is where the X-men have fallen off.  There are so many different writers and editorial just lets them write damn near anything they want continuity be damned. 


Personally if I were any comic book company, I would want to have a stable of exclusives whose focus is on my sh*t and my sh*t alone as it helps to ensure the writers are invested in these characters as well rather than just the paycheck.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 21, 2018, 12:12:56 AM
Well how I see it, supporting continuity helps encourage readers to venture outside of the book their reading to explore other titles and even dip in back issues and trades. Once everything is basically a one-off story, then you hurt return reader/customer opportunities. Essentially kneecapping sales.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on January 21, 2018, 08:08:10 AM
Well how I see it, supporting continuity helps encourage readers to venture outside of the book their reading to explore other titles and even dip in back issues and trades. Once everything is basically a one-off story, then you hurt return reader/customer opportunities. Essentially kneecapping sales.


That's a really great way of looking at it
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 21, 2018, 01:11:19 PM
Alright - now that I've given this a ton of thought.

Lets recognize that the Gambit fan base is not a united fanbase. They have their likes and dislikes and are not all in on everything Gambit.

Those Gambit fans who romy will have praise for this book because love interest Gambit is important to them.

Those Gambit fans who don't romy, will not be fond of this book because they are not interested in the relationship.

Which means, things that don't bother the romys will bother the non romys, which is also true in reverse.

I hope that makes sense. It's not a united group and never will be. The divide has been around for a long time.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 22, 2018, 03:51:57 PM
Alright - now that I've given this a ton of thought.

Lets recognize that the Gambit fan base is not a united fanbase. They have their likes and dislikes and are not all in on everything Gambit.

Those Gambit fans who romy will have praise for this book because love interest Gambit is important to them.

Those Gambit fans who don't romy, will not be fond of this book because they are not interested in the relationship.

Which means, things that don't bother the romys will bother the non romys, which is also true in reverse.

I hope that makes sense. It's not a united group and never will be. The divide has been around for a long time.


Holy-random-post, boss  ;D ! Feel like I missed a post somewhere..? Either way, I don't fit into either of those categories. I couldn't care less if Gambit has a love interest or not, but the relationship with Rogue doesn't repulse me either. As long as it's done in a interesting, skillful way, which has been done in the past (like twice or thrice). The abhorrence for it seems to come more from the character he's being attached to than what actually happens (well I guess what happens in response to her presence). That coupled with how he's been portrayed around her in team books (because I thought his interactions with her in the Mackie, Asmus and Fabian books were fine. Didn't think Claremont was an issue either in XXM.) creates a really bad look for him more oft than not. Just my view.


I will say every interaction they've had in a team book following XXM has been horrid. But that does make sense... When Gambit is written by someone that wants to write him its typically been in a solo. The author likes the characters and puts his best foot forward when dealing with issues. In a team book it's a crap shoot. I'd believe that more authors are interested in writing X-Men and Gambit just happens to be there. They may not "dislike" Gambit, but they have seemed to have more interest in Rogue, and as we've seen recently, pairing her with their favorite mouthpiece, avatar, character. It may simply go back to writers not being as good as they think they are. They should be able to at least mask their preference, but more times than not, they are obvious. Heck, even when she's not around. Willow G is the one that wrote Gambit at Burning Man (wearing clown pants) and Rogue was nowhere to be found at the time. I believe she used the word "skeevy". I think we're in for an uphill battle no matter what. Gambit's in Red. Doesn't mean he's going to be the Ragin' Cajun I want. I cant think of anyone on that team I'd honestly expect him to have more panel time than. Because he's been so under utilized I suspect he'll be far from top-billing anywhere he goes unless a creator deliberately pulls him for use. He didn't even make the books debut cover...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 22, 2018, 05:50:37 PM
I thought he didn't make the cover for Red because he joins later in the series?  Could be wrong.


What gives me a small sliver of hope for Red is the fact there are younger mutants there.  I think Gambit stands a better chance of being written well when there is less opportunity for drama and less chance of that with younger characters.  In addition, his swagger, carefree attitude, etc. comes off as endearing and playful for a younger character rather than immature and pervy for an adult.  He is after all a personification of what a 90s kid thought was cool.  I think that is why his relationship with Storm always worked and why his relationship with Laura worked.  There was something about him from the perspective of a kid/teenager that was more authentic than what they generally heard from adults.


I think that is also why a lot of writers don't like him.  If you came to Gambit as a kid then you identified with him because he represents what a kid thinks is cool about an adult.  For people that came to him when they were already adults, I don't think they quite grasp the appeal and consider him superficial and immature.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 22, 2018, 07:07:51 PM
 *chuckles* at Don. Its not a random post as its a response but I didn't feel like quoting nor did I want to create a huge debate but wanted to say what I thought without it coming across argumentative. The whole community thing and and how the book is seen thing – the like of it and praise of the book. It is all opinion after all. LOL

Its a small point – that was missed, and I'll not quote but paraphrase - “Gambit fans in other communities liked R&G”.

Other communities – well, there aren't a lot of them so its not hard to guess where they are. Liking this book, you'd have to romy to like this book. “Those” Gambit fans liked this issue and will most likely enjoy the story.

This place is not the be all and end all of Gambit fans nor is the other communities. The view is unique as each individual is unique. Fans like Gambit with their own bias, its not defined or exclusive. None of it has impact on the writer. NONE of it.

Not all Gambit fans think the same is my point. Remydat and I will always be in the camp we are in (didn't mean to drag you in bro - but its true), we don't like Rogue, and we don't romy. Whereas I can list others who enjoy romy and see value in it and all of it. Nothing wrong with it either.

Its an understanding that its more complex, more diverse, more divided and there is nothing wrong with any of it. None of it has anything to do with the fiscal part for KT, she is getting paid regardless.

@Remydat – I hold hope for Xmen Red because I want a better Gambit then we're getting. You may be right on how people see Gambit based on when they encountered him.

 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 22, 2018, 07:14:33 PM
He does join later but a variant wouldn't have hurt if he is indeed part of the book beyond an appearance. It's not like Marvel cares about time and sense. They debuted that cover before Jean was even alive. I would think Tom has the track in place that leads to Gambits debut by the end of the book. Hey, they put Mystique on the cover of Astonishing before she was introduced to be Beast (still don't understand that entire concept).
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on January 22, 2018, 07:20:01 PM

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DULfMsKXkAA5s5t.jpg:large)


R+G #2
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 22, 2018, 07:36:19 PM
Pleasantly surprised how much art talent Marvel's been throwing around lately. Got use to a lot lower standard.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 22, 2018, 08:04:17 PM

Don,

I guess I don't mind as much since he got his own cover in 3.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on January 22, 2018, 11:26:20 PM
I guess I fall into the "I'll read Gambit any way I can get him." camp.


Well, minus Racky. But then, Racky isn't -really- Gambit, so it's okay.


*deep breath* Yes, it's okay.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 23, 2018, 01:58:12 AM
Pleasantly surprised how much art talent Marvel's been throwing around lately. Got use to a lot lower standard.


Yeah. Overall artists at x books are better now.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Luna Croft on January 23, 2018, 06:47:53 AM
I definitely fall into the 'I will read aything with a panel of Gambit' camp.  And, I have enjoyed Rogue and Gambit, although I am not a fan of Rogue x Gambit.  That is also the reason why I wish he wasn't pushing Rogue so hard, but eh, I already know my hopes of them staying apart is unlikely.  I'll get over it if it means the success of this mini-series gets me more Gambit down the line. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 23, 2018, 08:46:27 AM
I bailed on the anything with Gambit in it after Xmen Legacy. Carey knew the character and could talk the talk about him but his interviews and knowledge never translated well for Gambit in the book. Which is why I'm not bothering with writers and their words anymore.

I bought up to issue 5 of Astonishing Xmen for Gambit and then dropped the book. I still haven't read 4 or 5 of the series, I've read enough reviews to know that Gambit is useless in the book. Not going to spend money on useless Gambit.

I went all in for All New X-Factor - despite the writer losing interest in Gambit by issue #5, then that writer blames the character and not his own work for the books demise.

I'm buying this book and giving it a shot, and the art is nice. Kudos on that, but creepy Gambit is not a good Gambit. It's hard to overlook if you don't romy.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 23, 2018, 10:17:39 AM
I guess I fall into the "I'll read Gambit any way I can get him." camp.


Same here. Or I'll at least give it a shot at first. If I still don't like it after a couple issues I'll drop it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 23, 2018, 10:30:14 AM
I bailed on the anything with Gambit in it after Xmen Legacy. Carey knew the character and could talk the talk about him but his interviews and knowledge never translated well for Gambit in the book. Which is why I'm not bothering with writers and their words anymore.

I bought up to issue 5 of Astonishing Xmen for Gambit and then dropped the book. I still haven't read 4 or 5 of the series, I've read enough reviews to know that Gambit is useless in the book. Not going to spend money on useless Gambit.

I went all in for All New X-Factor - despite the writer losing interest in Gambit by issue #5, then that writer blames the character and not his own work for the books demise.

I'm buying this book and giving it a shot, and the art is nice. Kudos on that, but creepy Gambit is not a good Gambit. It's hard to overlook if you don't romy.


Yeah I am done buying Marvel comics at this point.  I just go to my buddy's comic book store, flip through anything with Gambit and then put that sh*t back on the shelf and go buy something else.  If it ends up that a story is good then I will go back and get it in trade or buy the back issues digitally.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 23, 2018, 12:09:06 PM

Yeah I am done buying Marvel comics at this point.


I say I am and then I go out and buy R&G and Astonishing and I'll get Red when it comes out haha. But they have been dropping the ball hard in a lot of aspects. Hopefully things will change soon though since they've been making some changes with the higher-ups.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on January 24, 2018, 03:25:24 AM
ROGUE & GAMBIT #4 (OF 5) KELLY THOMPSON (W)PERE PEREZ (A)Cover by KRIS ANKA• It’s ROGUE versus GAMBIT in a BATTLE ROYALE the likes of which you’ve never seen before!• But when saving the day means letting go of everything you just fell in love with all over again, can Rogue and Gambit do what must be done?!• Making out! Memory loss! Power swapping! Witty banter! Emotional manipulation! Monologuing Big Bads! Doppelganger Golem Clones! You want it? We got it!32 PGS./Rated T+ …$3.99


(http://i67.tinypic.com/6zofps.jpg)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 24, 2018, 10:05:17 AM
I'm digging the cover. I'm guessing from the description it's symbolic for them walking in each other's shoes or at least gaining perspective on one another? I'm also definitely starting to see where the Eternal Sunshine parts are starting to come in.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Madgarena on January 24, 2018, 05:37:44 PM
Awesome cover, but I gotta say IMO she looks way better dressed as Gambit than he does dressed as Rogue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on January 24, 2018, 07:10:43 PM
I think it's a miserable cover, honestly.


See? I can say bad things about books Gambit's in too.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 24, 2018, 07:13:35 PM
edit:

I think it's a miserable cover, honestly.


See? I can say bad things about books Gambit's in too.


whaaaaa??? I can't believe it. LMAO

Overall the cover is fine but not what I would like though... I'm sorry gang the lean on that movie is disconcerting. Guess we'll see how it goes.

I'm in good spirits though - just not hopeful. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on January 24, 2018, 08:32:12 PM
*looks to see that the coast is clear*

[whisper]Kris' art has never appealed to me. I just don't like the style.[/whisper]

So now with that cover I've decided that they sort of switch bodies/viewpoints so Rogue sees the happy parts of their relationship, while Remy gets reminded about aaallllll the crappy moments.

It *could* be interesting, but I'm still unsure. We'll see.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 25, 2018, 09:57:45 AM
*looks to see that the coast is clear*

[whisper]Kris' art has never appealed to me. I just don't like the style.[/whisper]

So now with that cover I've decided that they sort of switch bodies/viewpoints so Rogue sees the happy parts of their relationship, while Remy gets reminded about aaallllll the crappy moments.

It *could* be interesting, but I'm still unsure. We'll see.


I can see where you're coming from. Some of his stuff can be kind of flat and almost cartoonish imo. I think he's best at re-designs
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 25, 2018, 11:42:39 AM
*looks to see that the coast is clear*

heh heh .....

[whisper]Kris' art has never appealed to me. I just don't like the style.[/whisper]

He would never be to everyone's liking. I don't mind his covers. He sort of reminds me of the guy that was on Astonishing with Liu writing it. Walta I think. It's a different style. Takes getting used to and sometimes it really needs to be the right style for a book too.


So now with that cover I've decided that they sort of switch bodies/viewpoints so Rogue sees the happy parts of their relationship, while Remy gets reminded about aaallllll the crappy moments.

It *could* be interesting, but I'm still unsure. We'll see.

This solicit leads to the belief of being closer to that movie than I would like - while I know this is all speculation and you can't really trust solicits. But if what you are speculating happens, I won't be happy.

But, I suppose we won't know til we see it. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on January 25, 2018, 12:06:17 PM
Well the switch could work if afterwards Rogue finally understands and decides to commit to Gambit.


Of course, I would then want Gambit to understand how Rogue felt all these years and tell her to take a hike  >:D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 25, 2018, 12:16:22 PM
awww, Remydat .... you sweetie. LOL
edit:
You made me laugh. Thanks!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 25, 2018, 03:26:11 PM
R&G #2 Feb 7th, 2018.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on January 25, 2018, 07:02:58 PM
That cover is so much nicer. Anka is incredibly hit and miss, huh?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 26, 2018, 08:07:56 PM
Yeah, Anka is hit or miss but I think overall, he's not too bad. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: dieCG on January 27, 2018, 12:50:41 AM
I'm fond of the covers, premises and summaries. But reading some of the reviews of the first comic, I'm wary. Still haven't picked it up. I am so fond of 90s Remy. Where he was smart, keen, humorous, but dark, too. Everything I have picked up seems to forget he wasn't always nice and was quite clever.

I have yet to see someone write him in such a complex manner in the last 15 years.  :-[
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on January 27, 2018, 10:27:48 PM
I like #2 cover but not #4. I will continue to buy this but I don't think it looks too good for our Gambit moving forward.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 30, 2018, 08:37:32 AM
Issue #1 sold out, and it going for a second print with release on 2/28.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 30, 2018, 09:53:38 AM
Wow, I knew a lot of people were buying it but I didn't realize it was that popular. That's pretty cool
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on January 30, 2018, 11:05:47 AM
There is the allure of an issue with the #1 on the cover. Those in general do better its the drop off between that issue and the rest that changes things. Still its good for the book and the creative team.  ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Spoonz on January 30, 2018, 11:48:48 AM
Well, let's hope that as KT finds success with Marvel she holds on to Gambit and not just Rogue. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on January 30, 2018, 12:43:36 PM
I do hope this series does very well. I just hope all the credit doesn't just go to Rogue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on January 30, 2018, 01:07:26 PM
...I just hope all the credit doesn't just go to Rogue.


Your sweet to hope that.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on January 31, 2018, 08:49:51 AM
Lol, they gotta giving him a little credit at least...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on January 31, 2018, 09:51:27 AM
Lol, they gotta giving him a little credit at least...


I'm sure he'll get a little, but I could definitely see Rogue getting most of the credit. Idk, though. I have faith in KT. Hopefully we'll get a better idea when issue 2 comes out next week.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on February 02, 2018, 02:35:52 AM
R&G #2 Preview


http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/exclusive-preview-kelly-thompson-sends-rogue-and-gambit-into-couples-therapy
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 02, 2018, 08:47:47 AM
R&G #2 Preview


http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/exclusive-preview-kelly-thompson-sends-rogue-and-gambit-into-couples-therapy (http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/exclusive-preview-kelly-thompson-sends-rogue-and-gambit-into-couples-therapy)

Quote
Despite previous attempts to make their relationship work, Rogue and Gambit have never quite managed to perfect their bond. And yet they keep gravitating back to each other. "Rogue and Gambit have an absolutely magical chemistry together," noted Thompson. "That, plus literal decades of will they/won’t they stories, have kept this pairing more interesting than most.

For this fan no. That is not interesting, in fact it got irritating. IMO

That said -

Art looks good, hashing things out is long over due but I think is good. I guess 20 some years late is better than never. LOL

Release date for #2 2/7/18. (same as Red).
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on February 02, 2018, 09:52:16 AM
Gotta admit, I laughed at their brief pause, then explosion, and how it was done in speech balloons was creative.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on February 02, 2018, 10:38:49 AM
I liked preview. It was fun :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Meliorist on February 02, 2018, 02:08:04 PM
How would a couple therapist resolve 'Left me to die in Antartica' and 'Died with me' and 'Pulled me away from Heaven'  ???
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on February 02, 2018, 02:37:26 PM
That's what I was thinking.

Gonna need more than a cool layout to address their baggage, tho.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on February 02, 2018, 02:54:07 PM
How would a couple therapist resolve 'Left me to die in Antartica' and 'Died with me' and 'Pulled me away from Heaven'  ???


Awesome post! So true
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 02, 2018, 03:50:32 PM
How would a couple therapist resolve 'Left me to die in Antartica' and 'Died with me' and 'Pulled me away from Heaven'  ???

true, gonna guess it might not get addressed. LOL
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on February 02, 2018, 10:36:46 PM
Well, there was actually an Antarctica 'bubble' in one of those preview pages, so I guess that means it gets 'sort of' addressed. Something tells me that is how a lot of things are going to be rehashed, especially if you consider 'a picture is worth a thousand words'.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on February 05, 2018, 08:35:35 PM
I want the Storm kiss addressed. There is no explaining that and has to result in chaos. As it did in my short story. Nothing else would be acceptable.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on February 07, 2018, 09:02:32 AM
Looooved it! Much, much better then first issue. Flashbacks how Gambit and Rogue first met from both point of view were awesome!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on February 07, 2018, 09:35:25 AM
I'm very interested in this second issue. I'll be picking it up later.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on February 07, 2018, 10:04:51 AM
Glad to hear it! Can't wait to pick it and Red up tonight
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 07, 2018, 10:38:32 AM
This was definitely much better than the first and more balanced in terms of the dynamic between the two. KT does write a good Rogue and Gambit as the chemistry between the two was definitely reminiscent of happier times. I also thought their first meeting pretty much was a microcosm of the relationship as it stands now with Rogue not wanting to remember their first kiss because she feels they were not in control and Gambit saying the only thing that could break through the SK's control was Rogue. Control and the lack thereof has always been a big sticking point for Rogue as a character and Gambit has always seemed to throw caution to the wind and allow himself to experience the world as it comes to him and not get hung up on the details. Thought that was nicely done.There is still the obvious elephant in the room of how to bridge the gap in all that history which I still am not sure KT can do to my satisfaction but for an issue at least, I almost liked Romy. I'll see how she closes this out before deciding whether it is worth picking up in trade.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Toadman005 on February 07, 2018, 12:16:19 PM
Hmmn, I might have to check this title out.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: X-fan73 on February 07, 2018, 03:17:13 PM
Issue #2 was really well done. After years of anti Romy politics at Marvel, Kelly Thompson shows how effortless it is to make the rogue and gambit dynamic interesting. I like how their baggage isn't swept under the rug or exaggerated as some sort of break point. They are a comic book couple after all.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 07, 2018, 04:42:47 PM
Better than the first issue, the art is nice. Good action scenes. Agree with Remydat that it was more balanced between the two characters.

I don't know who the villain is but whatevs.

It was good, thats all I got for it.

Gambit using his powers always looks cool on the page. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on February 07, 2018, 05:49:16 PM
Liked it. I forgot how much I like seeing them work together.

But again, I'm gonna need the Magneto thing to be addressed in speech, not just a picture.

Also, "y'all" is plural. I already told her--she said she disagreed (*eyeroll*), but said her editor really wanted her to change it. Shoulda listened.

Oh, and did anyone else spot the dreaded Third Person bit? Rrrrrrrrr
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 07, 2018, 06:27:17 PM
I did notice the dreaded third person speech. I tried not to say anything about it, at least it wasn't constant and only occurred once.

There is plenty that should be addressed, saying they feel better or lighter despite not really talking about the stuff that is in their baggage won't be good enough to clear the air between them. IMO.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on February 07, 2018, 06:39:53 PM

There is plenty that should be addressed, saying they feel better or lighter despite not really talking about the stuff that is in their baggage won't be good enough to clear the air between them. IMO.

That also. I hope this isn’t the end of them discussing things though....
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Meliorist on February 07, 2018, 06:44:06 PM
It seems like we will not get anything that is cathartic for the readers and that the 'feeling lighter' will probably have something to do with what the villain is doing but I could be wrong.


As far as "y'all" goes, while it is 'you all' shortened, the few people I've met from Mississippi used it as singular and plural. Could be regional but they did grow up in the Nashville area.

Edit: I meant Tennessee, not Mississippi. A sleep addled brain is not the keenest haha
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on February 07, 2018, 07:31:10 PM
It seems like we will not get anything that is cathartic for the readers and that the 'feeling lighter' will probably have something to do with what the villain is doing but I could be wrong.


As far as "y'all" goes, while it is 'you all' shortened, the few people I've met from Mississippi used it as singular and plural. Could be regional but they did grow up in the Nashville area.

No, we probably aren't getting actual catharsis--damn.

Didn't know that it's used singularly--everyone in the Carolinas (that I've heard anyway) says it plural. Interesting.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: dieCG on February 07, 2018, 08:55:31 PM


Didn't know that it's used singularly--everyone in the Carolinas (that I've heard anyway) says it plural. Interesting.

Y'all is also used singularly in Arizona, New Mexico and Texas. Not quite deep south. But there are places that do it. Yay for English vernacular! 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on February 07, 2018, 09:42:35 PM
Wow. I have to say i thought this issue was really good. I thought Gambit was actually done really well and even Rogue showed some likability. I think this is definitely going to go a bit deeper with them. They only covered the first meeting(which I really liked) and with three issues left I doubt they're just going to leave it on these warm feelings. Who knows how deep they'll go but for the first time in a long time Gambit and Rogue were fun to read again. Again, I thought Gambit was handled well and I didn't think that was going to be the case after the first issue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on February 07, 2018, 11:09:51 PM
Definitely better than the first issue.


I was actually surprised when reading when Gambit actually pushed on a point or two... and Rogue actually *gasp* agreed! Didn't run, didn't get into a messy blow-up, she actually agreed but gave legit reasons as to why she didn't like it.


Now for the last few issues we'll see how this plays out of course, will it be a 'two steps forward, one step back' deal, or a 'one step forward, two steps back'? I guess we will have to wait and see.


Oh, art was really good too. Thought it was amusing too, the first panels of the 'flashbacks' also emulated the art style of the time. That was rather impressive. Same thing happened with the 'image bubbles' as well.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on February 08, 2018, 03:24:46 PM
I’m really liking it so far and yeah #2 is better than #1. We’ll have to see if #3 can keep up the pace.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on February 09, 2018, 10:07:58 AM
Got around to reading this last night. Really really enjoyed it. Just wanted to echo a couple points:


Really hoping that this isn't the end of them talking through things (although I have a feeling it won't be since this is only issue 2).


Just to build off of remydat's comment about their first meeting: I liked the juxtaposition of their memories of their first meeting. Felt like a good distillation of how they view their relationship. Gambit's, even though they weren't in their right minds, seemed to be more about passion and, of course, ended with a kiss. Rogue's was a little more personal but it just had to end with her leaving Gambit high-and-dry to go talk to the professor about her powers. Basically, they both need to take a step back from their relationship for different reasons to see why their view of their relationship is flawed.


Art was fantastic. Loved the splash page of their therapy. I really like how KT has a foot in nostalgia while still moving the story and their relationship forward.


And I live in the midwest and we all use "Y'all" interchangeably for singular or plural, but I could see it varying depending on what part of the region one is from
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on February 10, 2018, 03:58:51 PM
I did notice the dreaded third person speech. I tried not to say anything about it, at least it wasn't constant and only occurred once.


haha...I noticed both their heavier accents or old traits were only in the flashback scenes. The accents were toned down in the present. :) I think KT did that on purpose.



Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on February 10, 2018, 04:13:54 PM
Also, if you hop onto KT's blog, she answers a question about the Magneto situation. She says it'll be addressed in #3, where Rogue explains her past decisions, but it won't be a focal point, she explains it better in her blog...
It really only needs a panel or 2 for it to be addressed, nothing more. If half the issue was based on the Magneto stuff, it'll end up sucking the fun out of the book and derail the audience (especially new readers).





Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on February 10, 2018, 10:00:03 PM
Also, if you hop onto KT's blog, she answers a question about the Magneto situation. She says it'll be addressed in #3, where Rogue explains her past decisions, but it won't be a focal point, she explains it better in her blog...
It really only needs a panel or 2 for it to be addressed, nothing more. If half the issue was based on the Magneto stuff, it'll end up sucking the fun out of the book and derail the audience (especially new readers).


I'm interested to see how that plays out. Personally, I never understood that relationship - and I say this with my Romy hat off
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on February 11, 2018, 08:12:28 PM
Well, aside from the obvious fact that mags has became the self insert for middle aged males, fans and writers, there's...wait...there's nothing else.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on February 12, 2018, 09:28:18 AM
Oh god, I hadn't even considered that. It makes it much weirder haha
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on February 12, 2018, 10:37:18 PM
That sounds very interesting. I'm glad someone has the chops to make sense out of all that.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 13, 2018, 01:58:27 AM
Well, aside from the obvious fact that mags has became the self insert for middle aged males, fans and writers, there's...wait...there's nothing else.


Interestingly I get a similar vibe from KT just Rogue is the insert for her affection for Gambit. Esp how she shuts down any discussion of Gambit in other ships...


Also explains her express dislike for Joelle
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on February 13, 2018, 04:46:21 AM
Well, it is true that KT likes Rogue and Deadpool and maybe even Mags and Rogue (Ughhh) but at the same time she likes Gambit only in pairing with Rogue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 13, 2018, 06:47:10 AM
Well, it is true that KT likes Rogue and Deadpool and maybe even Mags and Rogue (Ughhh) but at the same time she likes Gambit only in pairing with Rogue.


I think she doesnt see them as threaghts to Romy also much like Carey I am sure he could see others with Mags but realy Rogue with others hence the massive stomp on Romy.


It was also interesting to include joelle over the like of Lili or any of the other things like say a foursomw with a rogue look a like.


It was telling in her reviews how she feels about Gambit esp with the intrductiom of a real competitor to Rogue in Joelle. She took pieces out of that character. Though she has softened on her view of that run. I think she didnt like how far asmus pulled them apart. Carey kept Gambit hooks at least there it had completely broken down. I wonder if KT would address the thief ststement who caanot be teusted made in thag dossier.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on February 13, 2018, 07:40:55 AM

Interestingly I get a similar vibe from KT just Rogue is the insert for her affection for Gambit. Esp how she shuts down any discussion of Gambit in other ships...


Also explains her express dislike for Joelle


Gambit doesn't have any other "ships". The only actual character that exists outside of background art or issue/book exclusive was Bella Donna, Frenzy and Storm. Bella is his far behind ex-wife, and Frenzy was off panel and one embarrassing kiss. Storm seems to be only sticking point but I think that would effect them both. I think I'd be a huge revelation if this turned into an ongoing with them giving each other a clean slate just for it to be revealed later on that he and Storm had a "friends with benefits" relationship for a period. Possibly before or a little after Gambit started officially courting Rogue. Itd explain the origin of the infamous waterfall kiss between the two.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 13, 2018, 08:41:10 AM

Interestingly I get a similar vibe from KT just Rogue is the insert for her affection for Gambit. Esp how she shuts down any discussion of Gambit in other ships...


Also explains her express dislike for Joelle

Agreed, especially with her harsh criticism of Asmus solo. Yeah, I know, she acknowledges NOW she was harsh. Too late for the book (then/now - Asmus solo).

As for Magneto in general ... I don't have an issue with his age. Rogue is old enough to decide and the writer did. Is what it is.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on February 13, 2018, 09:53:01 AM

As for Magneto in general ... I don't have an issue with his age. Rogue is old enough to decide and the writer did. Is what it is.


That wasn't really an issue for me either. My problem is that the relationship feels forced at times and maybe a little hypocritical at other times (Rogue seems to be more forgiving of Magneto's sins/secrets, which are worse than Gambit's imo). TBH, I'm also just not as big of a fan of Magneto, which I hesitate to even say as everyone (not necessarily here) touts him as the best villain ever created.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on February 13, 2018, 10:17:13 AM
I think what makes Magneto a great villain is the fact that he doesn't see himself as one. He's willing to be the seen as a bad guy but only because he believes everyone around him is misled in their opinions of his actions, which he sees as noble and right. Everything he does he sees as necessary. He's not cruel for cruelty's sake, but does it as a means to an end... Accept that one time he imprisoned, tortured and filmed various X-Men being intimate, ultimately as a distraction. Completely personally forgiveable. Friends and lovers do that to each all the time.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on February 13, 2018, 10:36:05 AM
You make fair points and I don't dislike Magneto. I've just never been huge on him as a character and I got tired of him being in so much.


Accept that one time he imprisoned, tortured and filmed various X-Men being intimate, ultimately as a distraction. Completely personally forgiveable. Friends and lovers do that to each all the time.


Also, what do you mean by this?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 13, 2018, 11:45:32 AM
You make fair points and I don't dislike Magneto. I've just never been huge on him as a character and I got tired of him being in so much.

Also, what do you mean by this?


During the trial of Gambit, Mags was taping Gambit and Rogue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 13, 2018, 11:48:53 AM
Agreed, especially with her harsh criticism of Asmus solo. Yeah, I know, she acknowledges NOW she was harsh. Too late for the book now (solo).

As for Magneto in general ... I don't have an issue with his age. Rogue is old enough to decide and the writer did. Is what it is.


Yep, I have to admit, I was quite happy to learn that Gambit #1 outsold Rogue and Gambit #1 mainly because of her reviews of Asmus.  Sweet vindication for an issue at least.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on February 13, 2018, 12:13:45 PM

Durry the trial of Gambit, Mags had was taping Gambit and Rogue.


Ah, thanks. Didn't even know that happened
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 13, 2018, 12:46:13 PM

Yep, I have to admit, I was quite happy to learn that Gambit #1 outsold Rogue and Gambit #1 mainly because of her reviews of Asmus.  Sweet vindication for an issue at least.

Didn't know that but also makes me feel good as well. Sweet vindication is nice. And #1's are suppose to outdo the others. If R&G goes against the grain of that, good for it, says something for the writing and art. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 13, 2018, 12:52:38 PM

I think she doesnt see them as threaghts to Romy also much like Carey I am sure he could see others with Mags but realy Rogue with others hence the massive stomp on Romy.


It was also interesting to include joelle over the like of Lili or any of the other things like say a foursomw with a rogue look a like.


It was telling in her reviews how she feels about Gambit esp with the intrductiom of a real competitor to Rogue in Joelle. She took pieces out of that character. Though she has softened on her view of that run. I think she didnt like how far asmus pulled them apart. Carey kept Gambit hooks at least there it had completely broken down. I wonder if KT would address the thief ststement who caanot be teusted made in thag dossier.

While we don't need to rehash - your view reminds me that KT looks at Gambit as a "love interest", not as his own character. Otherwise, why worry about a Joelle. IMO.

Good to see you posting again AeroSennin :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: X-fan73 on February 13, 2018, 01:33:06 PM
Overall I am more concerned about critical reception than overall sales numbers.Highest selling X-book is only 50k? Golden boy Cable only at 19k.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 13, 2018, 03:58:45 PM
While we don't need to rehash - your view reminds me that KT looks at Gambit as a "love interest", not as his own character. Otherwise, why worry about a Joelle. IMO.

Good to see you posting again AeroSennin :)


Thank you. On the positive side it shows how much she likes him that she didnt park it all on him.


I am interested in Marvel looking this with a low expectation it only sold almost 40k before selling out. So they must have expected less sales. I wonder what the agenda was were they testing out the reception in anticipation of something?

edit: took out tags not needed and guessed at a word. N
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on February 13, 2018, 05:23:56 PM
Overall I am more concerned about critical reception than overall sales numbers.Highest selling X-book is only 50k? Golden boy Cable only at 19k.
50K and that was only because it had the special legacy variant cover that month. The 'flagship' titles are all in the mid thirties.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on February 13, 2018, 06:25:33 PM

Gambit doesn't have any other "ships". The only actual character that exists outside of background art or issue/book exclusive was Bella Donna, Frenzy and Storm. Bella is his far behind ex-wife, and Frenzy was off panel and one embarrassing kiss. Storm seems to be only sticking point but I think that would effect them both. I think I'd be a huge revelation if this turned into an ongoing with them giving each other a clean slate just for it to be revealed later on that he and Storm had a "friends with benefits" relationship for a period. Possibly before or a little after Gambit started officially courting Rogue. Itd explain the origin of the infamous waterfall kiss between the two.


Frenzy was more of a consolation prize for Gambit during Carey and Gage’s runs on Legacy, and for that reason it should never, ever be revisited. It was forced and never felt natural to me…I know they had some off-panel history beforehand, but the chemistry was non-existent. Storm on the other hand? Makes a lot more sense and a far more formidable rival for Rogue (for Gambit’s affections) if we were going to go that path. Gambit and Polaris had a lot of chemistry too in X-Factor. A shame they didn’t explore that further.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 13, 2018, 08:36:13 PM

Frenzy was more of a consolation prize for Gambit during Carey and Gage’s runs on Legacy, and for that reason it should never, ever be revisited. It was forced and never felt natural to me…I know they had some off-panel history beforehand, but the chemistry was non-existent. Storm on the other hand? Makes a lot more sense and a far more formidable rival for Rogue (for Gambit’s affections) if we were going to go that path. Gambit and Polaris had a lot of chemistry too in X-Factor. A shame they didn’t explore that further.


I so agree on Frenzy being left behind. Polaris strarted off interesting till PAD torpedoed it with that infamous kiss/slap and never recovered it due to lack of time. Antthing now would have to jump the hurdle of what happened again after that. We never even find out what happens to serval/xfactor its like it just fell of a cliff.


Storm though is in the too hard bucket between tchalla/logan/forge messes which get the airtime. It would be a total stealth steal and the revolt from segmemts of the community would likely be fierce if it became more than a really intimate friendship.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Meliorist on February 13, 2018, 09:34:23 PM
There is still Sage~


Or am I alone on wishing for that one...? Ah well



Polaris strarted off interesting till PAD torpedoed it with that infamous kiss/slap and never recovered it due to lack of time. Antthing now would have to jump the hurdle of what happened again after that. We never even find out what happens to serval/xfactor its like it just fell of a cliff.


Not much of a hurdle when compared to the Gambit/Rogue baggage but getting it addressed (in a positive light >.>) would be nice.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 13, 2018, 09:51:07 PM
No, not wishing. There is still Sage. That was never finished or addressed. She liked kissing him and had done so a few times.

As for Polaris - I hold out hope for that despite the clumsiness of what PAD did with Gambit and Polaris.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 14, 2018, 01:04:12 AM
No, not wishing. There is still Sage. That was never finished or addressed. She liked kissing him and had done so a few times.

As for Polaris - I hold out hope for that despite the clumsiness of what PAD did with Gambit and Polaris.


Given the nostalgia bender they are on I think Havok might get in the way of that.


The only time i felt that it kind of looked like it would work was that tender moment when she was in his room playing with the cats.... right up till she almost smooshed the one who nicked her. I think that put a bit of a dent in it. Then it disappeared with that wierd thing with snows wife which clumsily segued into the kiss/slap... which is a pity cause in that early scene coupled with the mystery as to why she sought him out to join just got wasted.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Meliorist on February 14, 2018, 01:18:12 AM

... which is a pity cause in that early scene coupled with the mystery as to why she sought him out to join just got wasted.


That seems to be a theme; interesting set up but the follow up fails.


Agreed that Marvel seems to be on a nostalgia kick. I can't decide how I feel about that but I am willing to read and find out. Your point would be heavily reinforced if Gambit and Rogue get back together after this mini. Then again...Marvel has been continuity lite of late too
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on February 14, 2018, 10:18:22 AM

I so agree on Frenzy being left behind. Polaris strarted off interesting till PAD torpedoed it with that infamous kiss/slap and never recovered it due to lack of time. Antthing now would have to jump the hurdle of what happened again after that. We never even find out what happens to serval/xfactor its like it just fell of a cliff.


Storm though is in the too hard bucket between tchalla/logan/forge messes which get the airtime. It would be a total stealth steal and the revolt from segmemts of the community would likely be fierce if it became more than a really intimate friendship.


I agree there wasn't much if any chemistry between Gambit and Frenzy, but I like the characters depth. Better than anyone she may be able to understand him better due to her past being even muddier than his, and willingly so. She's a great character and I think they could have been great friends. A sort of reality check or anchor for him when he's about to do something stupid. One of the reasons I hope she ends up in his orbit if he gets a book with more focus on him. Not necessarily romantic, I think they'd make better friends. Much like he and X-23. As for Storm and her other relationships. I think it reflects her personality. It's super hard to read Storm. She can warm and compassionate, turbulent and wrathful, or stoic and nearly emotionless... much like the weather. But with that, I can understand her not latching onto anyone for long periods of time and probably why she and Gambit may have been able to establish an understanding about an intimate relationship where they are friends, but also engage in less than platonic activities without letting overwhelming feelings get involved. It'd be one helluva a situation for anyone on the outside to swallow.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on February 14, 2018, 10:30:08 AM
With Rogue's characterisation in R&G, and the high praise it's getting from Rogue fans, at least it puts the "Gambit ruined Rogue" debate to rest, which annoyed me greatly. Around 10-12 years ago Gambit was copping a lot of harsh and unfair criticism from fans who blamed him for Rogue's whining and weak story lines (especially in Milligan's run), he was the scapegoat.


If you're a Rogue fan, you can't really complain about the way KT writes her in 'Rogue & Gambit'. She's strong, witty, and fun, the way she's supposed to be written. It proves that Rogue can be written very well with Gambit around.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 14, 2018, 11:29:13 AM
With Rogue's characterisation in R&G, and the high praise it's getting from Rogue fans, at least it puts the "Gambit ruined Rogue" debate to rest, which annoyed me greatly. Around 10-12 years ago Gambit was coping a lot of harsh and unfair criticism from fans who blamed him for Rogue's whining and weak story lines (especially in Milligan's run), he was the scapegoat.


If you're a Rogue fan, you can't really complain about the way KT writes her in 'Rogue & Gambit'. She's strong, witty, and fun, the way she's supposed to be written. It proves that Rogue can be written very well with Gambit around.

Loved this post and a great observation.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 14, 2018, 01:56:56 PM
50K and that was only because it had the special legacy variant cover that month. The 'flagship' titles are all in the mid thirties.


The flagship titles are late in their runs.  R&G was a #1 issue.  Gold and Blue for example debuted with 114k and 109k respectively and that was at 4.99 and they double ship.


If R&G is only at 38 debut shipping monthly at 3.99 then not much reason for it to continue as an ongoing unless it somehow maintains those sales levels which is uncommon.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 14, 2018, 02:03:54 PM

Frenzy was more of a consolation prize for Gambit during Carey and Gage’s runs on Legacy, and for that reason it should never, ever be revisited. It was forced and never felt natural to me…I know they had some off-panel history beforehand, but the chemistry was non-existent. Storm on the other hand? Makes a lot more sense and a far more formidable rival for Rogue (for Gambit’s affections) if we were going to go that path. Gambit and Polaris had a lot of chemistry too in X-Factor. A shame they didn’t explore that further.


I disagree, the story potential was there and Gage just dropped the ball.  The beauty of a Frenzy and Gambit relationship would be you could explore it in the present and the past given the fact we know there was some history off panel.  That would make for a far more richer story if done right.


I always imagined Frenzy and Gambit linking up after his exile when Gambit was at a low point and perhaps a bit resentful and thus more willing to get involved with someone a little bit more radical.  Gambit was a dick back then as he got Genevieve to fall in love with him and there is no indication he would have given a s*** aside from the fact she died.  He also had a friendship with Scalphunter and was comfortable working with Sinister including assembling the Marauders.


So I would expect their relationship to have been passionate, explosive and very volatile with perhaps Gambit moving on because he wanted to be a better person.  So now that Frenzy has become less of a villain then starting with her pursuing him and trying to convince him she has changed for the better would be a welcome change from Gambit being the pursuer.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 14, 2018, 02:10:54 PM

I agree there wasn't much if any chemistry between Gambit and Frenzy, but I like the characters depth. Better than anyone she may be able to understand him better due to her past being even muddier than his, and willingly so. She's a great character and I think they could have been great friends. A sort of reality check or anchor for him when he's about to do something stupid. One of the reasons I hope she ends up in his orbit if he gets a book with more focus on him. Not necessarily romantic, I think they'd make better friends. Much like he and X-23. As for Storm and her other relationships. I think it reflects her personality. It's super hard to read Storm. She can warm and compassionate, turbulent and wrathful, or stoic and nearly emotionless... much like the weather. But with that, I can understand her not latching onto anyone for long periods of time and probably why she and Gambit may have been able to establish an understanding about an intimate relationship where they are friends, but also engage in less than platonic activities without letting overwhelming feelings get involved. It'd be one helluva a situation for anyone on the outside to swallow.


As for Stormy, I just always viewed them as having avery flirtatious relationship without necessarily consummating things.  I think for Gambit, he maybe he took it much further because a part of him will always see the young girl he first met when she was de-aged so while he can flirt and maybe even share a kiss, he wouldn't take things further.

As for Storm, I think she is weighed down by her responsibilities in a way Gambit never was so she is drawn to Gambit because he reminds of what her life was like when she had more freedom to do what she wants.  The young thief just enjoying life as it comes to her.  However, I also don't think she would consummate because she understands that whatever she has with Gambit is just a way to kick back as neither is ready for a relationship that requires more responsibility to each other.


Having said that, I wouldn't be opposed to a friends with benefits arrangement with no drama but I think I still prefer the flirtatious and carefree relationship with them making to to home plate.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on February 14, 2018, 03:50:05 PM

As for Stormy, I just always viewed them as having avery flirtatious relationship without necessarily consummating things.  I think for Gambit, he maybe he took it much further because a part of him will always see the young girl he first met when she was de-aged so while he can flirt and maybe even share a kiss, he wouldn't take things further.

As for Storm, I think she is weighed down by her responsibilities in a way Gambit never was so she is drawn to Gambit because he reminds of what her life was like when she had more freedom to do what she wants.  The young thief just enjoying life as it comes to her.  However, I also don't think she would consummate because she understands that whatever she has with Gambit is just a way to kick back as neither is ready for a relationship that requires more responsibility to each other.


Having said that, I wouldn't be opposed to a friends with benefits arrangement with no drama but I think I still prefer the flirtatious and carefree relationship with them making to to home plate.


I have to disagree with this a bit. Though I'm not opposed to your overall preference. Storm is a strong, beautiful, smart, sexy woman and Gambit would be insane to not enjoy her physically if it was on the table. An unattached mature sexual hookup between these two is exactly what they could use if the situation permitted. And I like your take on how Gambit reminds her of a free-er time and I think that perfectly lends itself to a "no strings attached" intimate encounter. I'm not big into the "we shouldn't sleep together cuz we respect eachother" stuff. These are sexy characters with hormones, in need of comfort and understanding sometimes. I think Gambit and Storm are a perfect match for this type of scenario.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on February 14, 2018, 07:25:04 PM
Sometimes I just think about the 'who is with who' situation and chuckle to myself, because of the way Marvel operates on a compressed timeline.


It reminds me of middle/high school, where you'd hear about the popular boys/girls who are 'going out' with a different person every other month. If you take the compressed timeline into consideration, Rogue has been 'going out' or having a fling with a different guy every other month for the last few years, but keeps eventually rebounding to Gambit.


That's not to say he hasn't had his own dalliances, but when your panel-time is few and far between over the last couple of years, we can only guess.


If this series ends them with a clean slate, I'm both curious and (hoping/wishing/thinking?) about what might potentially happen now that Jean is back and single. Gambit and Phoenix has always been my number 2 for a few years, so...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 15, 2018, 01:16:52 AM
Sometimes I just think about the 'who is with who' situation and chuckle to myself, because of the way Marvel operates on a compressed timeline.


It reminds me of middle/high school, where you'd hear about the popular boys/girls who are 'going out' with a different person every other month. If you take the compressed timeline into consideration, Rogue has been 'going out' or having a fling with a different guy every other month for the last few years, but keeps eventually rebounding to Gambit.


That's not to say he hasn't had his own dalliances, but when your panel-time is few and far between over the last couple of years, we can only guess.


If this series ends them with a clean slate, I'm both curious and (hoping/wishing/thinking?) about what might potentially happen now that Jean is back and single. Gambit and Phoenix has always been my number 2 for a few years, so...


I figured they were going to press Namor into that role. Heck they in his kindom now.


I wonder if Gambit is there to play of Laura and now Gabi. Taylor has refrenced him a few times now. Gives her a familiar face to interact with.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 15, 2018, 09:13:59 AM

I have to disagree with this a bit. Though I'm not opposed to your overall preference. Storm is a strong, beautiful, smart, sexy woman and Gambit would be insane to not enjoy her physically if it was on the table. An unattached mature sexual hookup between these two is exactly what they could use if the situation permitted. And I like your take on how Gambit reminds her of a free-er time and I think that perfectly lends itself to a "no strings attached" intimate encounter. I'm not big into the "we shouldn't sleep together cuz we respect eachother" stuff. These are sexy characters with hormones, in need of comfort and understanding sometimes. I think Gambit and Storm are a perfect match for this type of scenario.


No worries.  Like I said, just my preference that they not go all the way so to speak but I can see the appeal in that as well.  Although I would say it is not "we shouldn't sleep together cuz we respect each other," but moreso they both understand that it ends with the flirtation and the occasional kiss.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 15, 2018, 09:15:47 AM
If this series ends them with a clean slate, I'm both curious and (hoping/wishing/thinking?) about what might potentially happen now that Jean is back and single. Gambit and Phoenix has always been my number 2 for a few years, so...


Yeah I always thought he and Jean would be an interesting couple in the vein of opposites attract.  Gambit appears to have a thing for really powerful women while Jean could use someone that isn't as serious or brooding as Cyclops and Wolverine.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on February 15, 2018, 09:43:14 AM

Yeah I always thought he and Jean would be an interesting couple in the vein of opposites attract.  Gambit appears to have a thing for really powerful women while Jean could use someone that isn't as serious or brooding as Cyclops and Wolverine.


I'd be interested to see this as a dynamic as well, even if it just turns into a no-strings-attached type thing.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on February 15, 2018, 11:42:49 AM

I have to disagree with this a bit. Though I'm not opposed to your overall preference. Storm is a strong, beautiful, smart, sexy woman and Gambit would be insane to not enjoy her physically if it was on the table. An unattached mature sexual hookup between these two is exactly what they could use if the situation permitted. And I like your take on how Gambit reminds her of a free-er time and I think that perfectly lends itself to a "no strings attached" intimate encounter. I'm not big into the "we shouldn't sleep together cuz we respect eachother" stuff. These are sexy characters with hormones, in need of comfort and understanding sometimes. I think Gambit and Storm are a perfect match for this type of scenario.


I accept the concept of "hooking up" because I know its a real thing that people of all ages do, its just part of reality. Heck, I've done it. However, I find odd when people refer to it as "mature". I think its actually the opposite. What we call "hooking up" is nothing more than giving into our baser instincts and physical needs. Children do that on a regular basis. Being able to shut off emotional attachment to another person in favor of fleeting physical pleasure... Not too different than throwing a temper tantrum in a super market (I'm from a Jamaican family. Did that exactly one time with my mom and from what I'm told it never happened again. I learn quick.). I think hooking up is more about letting go of maturity and living in the moment, which IMO is very teenager-y. I guess the "mature" part is being to compartmentalize the emotion afterwards. Not allowing oneself to be overwhelmed or even effected by them just to it again, quite often with another person. In a way is a bit sociopath-ic if you think about it LOL. That can be very liberating and attractive for someone as pent-up as Storm. She has to maintain constant control of her facets or the nature of powers can reap havoc on the earth. We saw this after Wolverine died. Beast (I think it was Beast) had to take her into orbit just so she could breakdown and cry. Just my thoughts.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 15, 2018, 03:45:45 PM
Hooking up is mature if it is in line with one's feelings and personality.  There is no requirement for all of us to want a monogamous relationship and I think it is mature to recognize in oneself that fact that you do or not not want one and to then act accordingly.  So I don't think it is binary in that one is mature and the other isn't.  I think the answer like most things in life is that it depends. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on February 15, 2018, 05:57:35 PM

I accept the concept of "hooking up" because I know its a real thing that people of all ages do, its just part of reality. Heck, I've done it. However, I find odd when people refer to it as "mature". I think its actually the opposite. What we call "hooking up" is nothing more than giving into our baser instincts and physical needs. Children do that on a regular basis. Being able to shut off emotional attachment to another person in favor of fleeting physical pleasure... Not too different than throwing a temper tantrum in a super market (I'm from a Jamaican family. Did that exactly one time with my mom and from what I'm told it never happened again. I learn quick.). I think hooking up is more about letting go of maturity and living in the moment, which IMO is very teenager-y. I guess the "mature" part is being to compartmentalize the emotion afterwards. Not allowing oneself to be overwhelmed or even effected by them just to it again, quite often with another person. In a way is a bit sociopath-ic if you think about it LOL. That can be very liberating and attractive for someone as pent-up as Storm. She has to maintain constant control of her facets or the nature of powers can reap havoc on the earth. We saw this after Wolverine died. Beast (I think it was Beast) had to take her into orbit just so she could breakdown and cry. Just my thoughts.


Well, giving in to base instincts and shutting off emotional attachments for fleeting physical pleasure is not how I'd characterize a sexual encounter between Gambit and Storm. It's not like it's a hook-up between a frat guy and a party girl. Gambit and Storm are super hero freedom fighters who have experienced hyper intense moments, loss, extreme pressure, and attraction with each other on many occasions for years. They are deeper than friends. If they find themselves in a situation to enjoy each other physically  with both understanding that they don't plan on being a couple, I say that's fair for them to do so. Maybe it helps rejuvenate their spirits and adds another dimension to their friendship/relationship. Sex doesn't have to be an excuse just to get off. It could be  another layer in which Gambit and Storm  know each other and have connected.  I feel Gambit and Storm are a perfect duo to pull off a mature "hook-up". No drama or pettiness, just the culmination of a unique friendship between two characters who have a deep connection with each other.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on February 15, 2018, 06:22:32 PM
Did you try to post something?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on February 16, 2018, 10:50:10 PM

The flagship titles are late in their runs.  R&G was a #1 issue.  Gold and Blue for example debuted with 114k and 109k respectively and that was at 4.99 and they double ship.


If R&G is only at 38 debut shipping monthly at 3.99 then not much reason for it to continue as an ongoing unless it somehow maintains those sales levels which is uncommon.
I was bringing up the flagship sales just to show sales are down overall. I don’t think you can compare sales on the heavily marketed relaunch of the flagship title to a non-event mini series. It’s apples to oranges at best.


Anyway, I like storm better as a brother/sister thing, but I suppose I could something casual. Though I guess, it would have to have been in the past, because I think she’s back with black panther.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 17, 2018, 10:56:38 AM
My point was I don't know that they are down overall.  No 1 issues for both flagships still sold a ton of issues as No 1 issues generally do.  And I mentioned earlier that the Asmus No 1 series and the Deadpool vs Gambit mini No 1 both outsold R&G, the latter by a huge margin.


I don't know what amount of sales the mini needs to turn it into an ongoing but I am just saying if it starts out as low as 38k then there is no overwhelming financial reason to make it a mini.  Again now maybe it's sales stabilize or get a boost as Rogue and Gambit resolve their drama but books that start out with No 1 issues at 38k tend to end up somewhere in the 20k range by the time you are at say 12 issues or so.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 17, 2018, 11:47:37 AM
As a group that was over obsessed with the sales numbers for Asmus solo - which I get, we wanted that book to last for a long time. When it got to 38k range, there was already concern. Looking at a number 1 that only sold 38k for a company that did a reprint because they didn't expect it to do well, the under print gives false expectation. Perhaps they should have had 50k's worth of books from the get go? I don't know.

If an ongoing is desired, 38K isn't a solid number for that to happen unless you are Captain, Ms Marvel, Squirrel Girl or any other "agenda" book. This book doesn't fit an agenda.

The 38k is a book in the middle of a run amount, as we seen when observing other books.  Why this would grant an ongoing with this number would surprise me.

However if the sales go up because the book got better, things could change. Keeping in mind though, first impressions and R&G1 didn't do Gambit any favors and those hardcore fans may not have stuck around for the next issue.

My apologies if this is a debbie downer view.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on February 17, 2018, 12:05:54 PM
Though R&G does have really good word of mouth so who knows. I think a lot of people saw the the early promo stuff and Rogue being before Gambit and thought "forget this". Maybe this series can have legs.
 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: X-fan73 on February 17, 2018, 12:23:58 PM
Thought I heard issue #1 would get a reprinting? Honestly the series is doing respectable under the current climate.Buzz is good after two issues.After over a decade or so of bias against Romy, it didn’t take that much effort to show why Rogue and Gambit’s romance IS an iconic comic couple. How many couples have come and gone with ppl not caring other than the writer trying to make it work.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on February 17, 2018, 12:30:20 PM
After over a decade or so of bias against Romy, it didn’t take that much effort to show why Rogue and Gambit’s romance IS an iconic comic couple. How many couples have come and gone with ppl not caring other than the writer trying to make it work.


Couldn't have said it any better. People have hated on Romy for a while and the instant it's brought back and handled well, it's praised and the pair is back to being called one of the most iconic couples in Marvel history. See how easy that was? ;)  Honestly, I think the timing for it is fairly perfect. I think people are hungry for something like this. I think it's easy to forget how Gambit and Rogue were the "People's Couple" for a long time. And I agree, I think the current climate of Marvel comics makes numbers a little hard to read especially for two characters like this.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 18, 2018, 11:14:45 PM
Thought I heard issue #1 would get a reprinting? Honestly the series is doing respectable under the current climate.Buzz is good after two issues.After over a decade or so of bias against Romy, it didn’t take that much effort to show why Rogue and Gambit’s romance IS an iconic comic couple. How many couples have come and gone with ppl not caring other than the writer trying to make it work.


Well if it showed that you would expect more sales.  I don't know that this series does anything except convince the people that were already Romy fans.  You would need a lot more than 38k in sales to claim proof of iconic status.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on February 19, 2018, 10:08:57 AM
Sales have been down at marvel, they have said that. They've been down for about two years? They did not say by how much or any details past that. But even Deadpool's been down (probably over extended) Marvel has also said that mini series always sell lower than ongoing sales, that's why they keep publishing so many ongoings even if they seem like mini series.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 19, 2018, 04:02:36 PM

I accept the concept of "hooking up" because I know its a real thing that people of all ages do, its just part of reality. Heck, I've done it. However, I find odd when people refer to it as "mature". I think its actually the opposite. What we call "hooking up" is nothing more than giving into our baser instincts and physical needs. Children do that on a regular basis. Being able to shut off emotional attachment to another person in favor of fleeting physical pleasure... Not too different than throwing a temper tantrum in a super market (I'm from a Jamaican family. Did that exactly one time with my mom and from what I'm told it never happened again. I learn quick.). I think hooking up is more about letting go of maturity and living in the moment, which IMO is very teenager-y. I guess the "mature" part is being to compartmentalize the emotion afterwards. Not allowing oneself to be overwhelmed or even effected by them just to it again, quite often with another person. In a way is a bit sociopath-ic if you think about it LOL. That can be very liberating and attractive for someone as pent-up as Storm. She has to maintain constant control of her facets or the nature of powers can reap havoc on the earth. We saw this after Wolverine died. Beast (I think it was Beast) had to take her into orbit just so she could breakdown and cry. Just my thoughts.


Maybe an unpopular view but I always saw Gambits hook up behaviour as him trying to fill a whole in his life based on the lack of real connection growing up and a certain level of covering for an insecurity. These woman come and go with  no real affection. But on the few rime he opens uo its like we get to see a real piece of him behind the emotional armour it gives his worldly waya a touch of innocence and moves him past just being a douche bag womaniser. Which is why with a real connection to Rogue he wont let go it means too much.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 19, 2018, 05:14:23 PM
Sales have been down at marvel, they have said that. They've been down for about two years? They did not say by how much or any details past that. But even Deadpool's been down (probably over extended) Marvel has also said that mini series always sell lower than ongoing sales, that's why they keep publishing so many ongoings even if they seem like mini series.


Great that just provides excuses for the fact the book is not selling enough to claim iconic status.  Sometimes there just isn't enough data to support a claim.  There is simply not enough data to claim Romy is iconic.  Sorry that is just the truth.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 19, 2018, 05:17:21 PM

Maybe an unpopular view but I always saw Gambits hook up behaviour as him trying to fill a whole in his life based on the lack of real connection growing up and a certain level of covering for an insecurity. These woman come and go with  no real affection. But on the few rime he opens uo its like we get to see a real piece of him behind the emotional armour it gives his worldly waya a touch of innocence and moves him past just being a douche bag womaniser. Which is why with a real connection to Rogue he wont let go it means too much.


Don't know that Gambit has ever been a womanizer.  A ladies man is different than a womanizer.  And the only relationship he had that was based on deceit was Genevieve which still had nothing to do with him being a womanizer and more to do with the fact he was contracted to do a job.  Womanizer to me would be someone that routinely misled women about the nature of his intentions. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on February 19, 2018, 05:44:23 PM

Great that just provides excuses for the fact the book is not selling enough to claim iconic status.  Sometimes there just isn't enough data to support a claim.  There is simply not enough data to claim Romy is iconic.  Sorry that is just the truth.


I've seen a Batman/Catwoman mini series debut at 23,000 way back in 2004, and a Superman/Lois mini debut at 35,000 in 2015, 'Spider-man Loves Mary Jane' debuted at 11,000 in 2006. I'm not saying Rogue/Gambit are more iconic than the ones I've just named, but in terms of popularity they hold their own, and they are more prominent than a lot of other pairings in both Marvel and DC.


And sales are well down on all X-Books, I was expecting somewhere between 35 - 45 thousand for R&G.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 19, 2018, 08:15:13 PM

Don't know that Gambit has ever been a womanizer.  A ladies man is different than a womanizer.  And the only relationship he had that was based on deceit was Genevieve which still had nothing to do with him being a womanizer and more to do with the fact he was contracted to do a job.  Womanizer to me would be someone that routinely misled women about the nature of his intentions.


A womanizer does not necessarily have to be deceptive. Oxford dictionary defines it as such

Womanizer
(British womanizer)
NOUN derogatory
A man who engages in numerous casual sexual affairs with women.It really seems to imply a casual shallowness about self satisfaction. Hence the derogatory nature. There are i am sure more than a few broken hearts out there. But yes with out any real lasting connection it is exactly what he is. You could argue if everyone is happy what does it matter but there are likely more than a few instances of hurt caused because what he perceives as without attachment mat not be reciprocal humans are fickle like that. Hence why its poor form to carelessly enter into ships they have a capacity to change as one partners feeling may not be the same. Probably why we from on it and the hurt it can cause. Look at the disappointment frenzy showed and that was just a kiss bad as it was. Probably the risk of his intimate ship with Storm if she felt more attached and he shoots off after Rogue again it could create issues. and this stuff gets convoluted when emotions get involved.


 Edit: I tried to fix, should be easy for you to edit when you want. I'll fix the other post too. Neko
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 19, 2018, 08:21:56 PM

A womanizer does not necessarily have to be deceptive. Oxford dictionary defines it as such
 

Womanizer
(British womanizer)
NOUN derogatory
A man who engages in numerous casual sexual affairs with women.It really seems to imply a casual shallowness about self satisfaction. Hence the derogatory nature. There are i am sure more than a few broken hearts out there. But yes with out any real lasting connection it is exactly what he is. You could argue if everyone is happy what does it matter but there are likely more than a few instances of hurt caused because what he perceives as without attachment mat not be reciprocal humans are fickle like that. Hence why its poor form to carelessly enter into ships they have a capacity to change as one partners feeling may not be the same. Probably why we from on it and the hurt it can cause. Look at the disappointment frenzy showed and that was just a kiss bad as it was. Probably the risk of his intimate ship with Storm if she felt more attached and he shoots off after Rogue again it could create issues. and this stuff gets convoluted when emotions get involved.


Appologies format exploded when i pulled accross the quote.


I also wanted to add to complicate matters for Remy is his hypnotic charm. Which may make you wonder even if by accident who got tipped over into a fling with him over it or felt more about the fling than he did.


I think that is aslo whay made Romy so great for him as it added some depth to his relations with woman and showed his vulnerabiltiy and that he isnt a one note wonder and a capacity to love more than just himself. I worry what happens if he just goes ona woman spree he loses a bit of his humanity that we got to see there and regresses him.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 19, 2018, 08:51:48 PM
Hey AeroSennin - it happens sometimes with the site, especially with the copy and paste from other sites. I did my best fix it up, but should be easier for you to edit if you feel the need to do so. :)

Crazy stuff.  ;D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 20, 2018, 12:37:49 AM

I've seen a Batman/Catwoman mini series debut at 23,000 way back in 2004, and a Superman/Lois mini debut at 35,000 in 2015, 'Spider-man Loves Mary Jane' debuted at 11,000 in 2006. I'm not saying Rogue/Gambit are more iconic than the ones I've just named, but in terms of popularity they hold their own, and they are more prominent than a lot of other pairings in both Marvel and DC.


And sales are well down on all X-Books, I was expecting somewhere between 35 - 45 thousand for R&G.


I didn't say they were not popular.  I said I don't know how you can claim they are iconic based on this book. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 20, 2018, 12:47:46 AM

A womanizer does not necessarily have to be deceptive. Oxford dictionary defines it as such

Womanizer
(British womanizer)
NOUN derogatory
A man who engages in numerous casual sexual affairs with women.It really seems to imply a casual shallowness about self satisfaction. Hence the derogatory nature. There are i am sure more than a few broken hearts out there. But yes with out any real lasting connection it is exactly what he is. You could argue if everyone is happy what does it matter but there are likely more than a few instances of hurt caused because what he perceives as without attachment mat not be reciprocal humans are fickle like that. Hence why its poor form to carelessly enter into ships they have a capacity to change as one partners feeling may not be the same. Probably why we from on it and the hurt it can cause. Look at the disappointment frenzy showed and that was just a kiss bad as it was. Probably the risk of his intimate ship with Storm if she felt more attached and he shoots off after Rogue again it could create issues. and this stuff gets convoluted when emotions get involved.


 Edit: I tried to fix, should be easy for you to edit when you want. I'll fix the other post too. Neko

As your definition notes the term is derogatory so yes it does imply some element of one being misled as if they were happy then they would have no reason to use the word womanizer.  They would instead say ladies man as there are no hurt feelings.

And there is no real evidence of Gambit being a womanizer.  He has been with Rogue for much of his time with the X-men and in fact Rogue has had more relationships with known characters than Gambit.

Nor are the Frenzy or Storm relationships evidence of his womanizing because he refrained from progressing those relationships.  An actual womanizer would have actually slept with both of them.  Gambit did not.  Not to mention Frenzy only kissed him to try and get over Cyclops whom she was in love with in the Age of X storyline just as Gambit could be said to be trying to get over Rogue.  So that was not an act of womanizing.  It was two people trying to forget about an ex.

So I think the label doesn't fit.  Gambit simply hasn't slept with enough women over the years for this to qualify and is being judged more harshly than women doing the very same thing.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 20, 2018, 01:50:35 AM
As your definition notes the term is derogatory so yes it does imply some element of one being misled as if they were happy then they would have no reason to use the word womanizer.  They would instead say ladies man as there are no hurt feelings.

And there is no real evidence of Gambit being a womanizer.  He has been with Rogue for much of his time with the X-men and in fact Rogue has had more relationships with known characters than Gambit.

Nor are the Frenzy or Storm relationships evidence of his womanizing because he refrained from progressing those relationships.  An actual womanizer would have actually slept with both of them.  Gambit did not.  Not to mention Frenzy only kissed him to try and get over Cyclops whom she was in love with in the Age of X storyline just as Gambit could be said to be trying to get over Rogue.  So that was not an act of womanizing.  It was two people trying to forget about an ex.

So I think the label doesn't fit.  Gambit simply hasn't slept with enough women over the years for this to qualify and is being judged more harshly than women doing the very same thing.


Derogatory could also be as a result of social constructs frowning upon the behaviour. Take slut as a similar example it is derogitory with a similar definition with no deciept involved.


It is such a fickle thing so much grey blurring black. But the thing with casual flings are at somepoint you are bound to have sever emotional casualties. Esp if one is more invested, heck he became one to rogueneto. I tend to believe one should be caeeful with others hearts because you never know when it wont just be a casual thing to another. Heck it might start that way and explode horribly how many friends with benefits relations exploded for exactly that reason someone became more invested.


With Storm it may not be there but when she acknowldeged that it would likely upset Rogue it implies she maybe felt more about it than a passing pash. I think if they started sleeping together there is tonnes of room realistically for it to imploded and leave chaos in its wake.


Frenzy is a lesser example she was clearly disappointed when she left if it had been more then what when he wasnt invested fortunately he didnt take advantage. But he was rruely loving in that moment he could have rebounded with her and left her hurt maybe you could write it loke its all sunshine and daisies but may not make sense.


Any way it good to debate alternate world views.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 20, 2018, 01:51:57 AM
Hey AeroSennin - it happens sometimes with the site, especially with the copy and paste from other sites. I did my best fix it up, but should be easier for you to edit if you feel the need to do so. :)

Crazy stuff.  ;D


Thanks for the effort Neko i'll leave it as is seeing as its been reaponded to. Much appreciated.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 20, 2018, 08:19:07 AM

Derogatory could also be as a result of social constructs frowning upon the behaviour. Take slut as a similar example it is derogitory with a similar definition with no deciept involved.


It is such a fickle thing so much grey blurring black. But the thing with casual flings are at somepoint you are bound to have sever emotional casualties. Esp if one is more invested, heck he became one to rogueneto. I tend to believe one should be caeeful with others hearts because you never know when it wont just be a casual thing to another. Heck it might start that way and explode horribly how many friends with benefits relations exploded for exactly that reason someone became more invested.


With Storm it may not be there but when she acknowldeged that it would likely upset Rogue it implies she maybe felt more about it than a passing pash. I think if they started sleeping together there is tonnes of room realistically for it to imploded and leave chaos in its wake.


Frenzy is a lesser example she was clearly disappointed when she left if it had been more then what when he wasnt invested fortunately he didnt take advantage. But he was rruely loving in that moment he could have rebounded with her and left her hurt maybe you could write it loke its all sunshine and daisies but may not make sense.


Any way it good to debate alternate world views.


But there was no fling.  That is the point.  He did nothing more than kiss Storm and Frenzy and in both instances he did not do so because he was intending to start some sort of casual fling.


So while I understand your overall point it simply doesn't apply to those situations precisely because in both it was clear there was no attempt to initiate a fling.  The precise reason why there was no fling is because unlike a womanizer Gambit refused to let things progress further.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 20, 2018, 11:42:22 AM
Thanks for the effort Neko i'll leave it as is seeing as its been reaponded to. Much appreciated.

No prob. This happens to Purp all the time.  ;)

All I do is take out the font/size/ or any other tag that somehow lingered. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 20, 2018, 11:47:30 AM
If we use Xmen Legacy written by Carey as an indicator of what Gambit gets out of the relationship with Rogue and its not about sex. It had never been about that with him. I believe he had Magneto tell Rogue that she ennobled Gambit. To a degree, certainly from the beginning, I think she did do that.

At this point, while he'll do shady things, he ends up doing the right things in the end. I like his morally grey.

As for womanizing, I never saw him as a womanizer. The whole ladies man thing was women flocking to him or wanting to be with him. Not so much of him actually following up on all of it, some yes but not all. He never came across as a "user" as it were in my eyes.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on February 20, 2018, 02:32:55 PM
Hey... lets get something straight... Gambit's the most non-woman getting ladiesman, womanizer-whatever in the history of whatevers. Don't go doing Marvel's job for them and scratch notches on his lonely headboard.  :idiot2:
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 20, 2018, 03:51:05 PM
Hey... lets get something straight... Gambit's the most non-woman getting ladiesman, womanizer-whatever in the history of whatevers. Don't go doing Marvel's job for them and scratch notches on his lonely headboard.  :idiot2:


Hehe well atleast with non flatscans..... hehe. There he has a reasonable body count in recent times including a 4 some a 3 some with mystiek....., Joelle is inplied, another mans wife which ended up with him being left behind and tortured (he really should have been a bit more careful) , i don't buy Snows acceptance and a slapdown... he did turn down danger though...


I am also playing a bit of devils advocate here. Remy has avoided bing a douche despite many people attempt to paint him with that brush. I just worry that he treads in a grey space and on a tight rope of morality. In this era of backlash it is easy ro get discarded after an unintentional miss step.


It is why KT has been a breath of fresh air. She has also moved him back a bit onto the linr and away from the douche bag remy other authers have been pressing.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 20, 2018, 04:09:48 PM
Well I am not sure having him push Rogue about a relationship incessantly and then following her around to beg some more when she leaves him is putting him on the right path.  That is more problematic than consensual hookups.  You just feel differently about it because of nostalgia but it is creepy in its own way.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on February 20, 2018, 04:31:18 PM
Well I am not sure having him push Rogue about a relationship incessantly and then following her around to beg some more when she leaves him is putting him on the right path.  That is more problematic than consensual hookups.  You just feel differently about it because of nostalgia but it is creepy in its own way.


To be fair if we choose to oversimplify and drive agendas we can drive busses though wach orhers plot holes :).


I know you dislike Romy so you gravitate to a set view on it to help the argument and you are hard harlining grey areas to create a sweeping argument at one point oushing a #me too sexual harrasment argument. One i never saw you apply to Polaris. But really running into casual hookups acts as a regression and makes him easier as a target given his history and power set. Showing him as commoted the flip side to that argumemt has a more positive apin. But given the subjectiveness of human emotions it is open to being twisted repeatedly to suit a set view. I am probably guilty of this too.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on February 20, 2018, 06:11:01 PM
Not sure why I would push it with Polaris when it was one kiss, she punched him and that was the end of it.  Having said that, sure if Polaris had gone to Snow and claimed sexual harassment then she would be correct in making that charge because it was an unwanted advance.  However, that is still much different than REPEATEDLY begging Rogue and REPEATEDLY being rebuffed.  Not sure why this would confuse anyone.

As for casual hookups, Wolverine and probably a few other characters have hooked up far more than Gambit in the books so don't think casual hookups have an impact on the character one way or another.  Again that is just your personal preference.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on February 20, 2018, 09:46:02 PM
Gambit definitely assaulted her face with his mouth. But he's done that several times at this point. Cassandra, Danger, I think some background art...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: pastella on February 22, 2018, 03:22:35 PM

ROGUE & GAMBIT #5 (OF 5)
KELLY THOMPSON (W) PERE PEREZ (A)




(https://static0.cbrimages.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/ROGUEGAMBIT2018005-cov.jpg?q=35&w=864&h=1312&fit=crop&dpr=1.5)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on February 22, 2018, 04:03:24 PM
Soooo... another cover of them kissing. That's what, the fourth or fifth one now? Any other Marvel 'couple but not-really-a-couple' pairing ever have that many kissing covers?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on February 22, 2018, 04:14:14 PM
Actually it is only 2nd Romy cover that I remeber with kiss. I am cool with it
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on February 22, 2018, 04:23:40 PM
Actuallly it is only 2nd Romy cover that I remeber with kiss. I am cool with it


You're right afaik. In the others they're close, but this is only the second with them locking lips.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Ludi on February 22, 2018, 04:48:44 PM
Well, someone's officially excited at least.   :D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on February 22, 2018, 05:04:46 PM
Well, someone's officially excited at least.   :D


Same here!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on February 22, 2018, 07:22:53 PM

Gambit #16 and now R&G #5 are the only 616 covers I can think of...


But there's also Ultimate X-Men #53
Gambit #10 (Nicieza) where the kiss isn't prominent on the cover and it's an alternate future version of them.
...and also the back cover of X-Men Annual 1997, also a strange alternate version of them.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on February 22, 2018, 08:55:54 PM
Ok, yeah - some are actually 'really close', but not actual kisses. I probably should have stated it as 'kisses and could become a kiss at any moment'.


I can't seem to get the images to work, but there is X-Men 24, Gambit 16, X-Men'92 002, Uncanny Avengers 5, X-Men Legacy 224, X-Men 204, and Rogue 5...


For something that never seems to stick with Marvel - it suuuuure is has been used quite a lot over the years. It's like the ultimate bait-and-switch that's been going on since I started reading comics and watching XTAS, 1992/3-ish, when I was barely 10 years old. I don't recall it being done like this with any two other characters over such a long period of time. (Especially considering the compressed timescale). Could be wrong, but as I've been a Gambit fan before anything else, it was always something that stuck with me. Now we'll get another one.


I was a Romy fan for easily a decade, maybe 15 years. Then I gave up.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on February 23, 2018, 09:50:10 AM
I feel ya, Jast. I'm still a Romy fan but I think that's due in part to them being 2 of my favorite heroes. It'll be interesting to see what happens at the end of this book, but I have a hunch it'll be another bait-and-switch haha
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Toadman005 on February 23, 2018, 02:52:16 PM
Hey... lets get something straight... Gambit's the most non-woman getting ladiesman, womanizer-whatever in the history of whatevers. Don't go doing Marvel's job for them and scratch notches on his lonely headboard.  :idiot2:


You ain't kidding'.


I know they're playing off his cliche stereotype, as he was meant to be the stud beefcake when introduced, the tall, dark, handsome, mysterious and dangerous loner bad boy, and his name literally translates into "The Beautiful", but in the last decade, I dunno which has happened more...him getting his ass kicked or him getting rejected cucked.


The absolute worst behind Rogue living him for Magneto's old, grey bush is when he got shot down by two chicks at Burning Man. Jesus Christ.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on February 26, 2018, 08:31:44 PM
http://doyouevencomicbook.com/2018/02/rogue-gambit-2-search-perfect-first-time/

Next issue out March 7th.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on February 26, 2018, 11:34:15 PM
You know, I never read the title. In a vacuum, I would have not thought it meant what it did...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on February 27, 2018, 09:40:11 AM
Whoa...another reviewer who wasn't really a fan and he loved it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 02, 2018, 04:30:58 AM
Awesome R&G #3 preview  :D :smitten:


http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/exclusive-preview-rogue-gambit-3-explores-the-couples-past-as-a-new-mystery-unfolds?amp&__twitter_impression=true
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on March 02, 2018, 11:35:43 AM
Awesome R&G #3 preview  :D :smitten:


http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/exclusive-preview-rogue-gambit-3-explores-the-couples-past-as-a-new-mystery-unfolds?amp&__twitter_impression=true (http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/exclusive-preview-rogue-gambit-3-explores-the-couples-past-as-a-new-mystery-unfolds?amp&__twitter_impression=true)


Oh, dayum. I didn't read too much of what was said to avoid spoilers but I'm glad to see they're still going to therapy
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on March 02, 2018, 03:57:10 PM
I didn't read to much either. Looks interesting. Nice booty shot of Rogue in a bikini. :coolsmiley:
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Spoonz on March 03, 2018, 06:25:33 AM
So Rogue lost her virginity to Gambit. Huh. And Magneto taped it! I never thought about it much before but on top of everything else the guy is also literally a sex offender.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Toadman005 on March 05, 2018, 11:24:53 AM
Interesting that Rogue’s first time was Remy. I assumed they did bang…as most did…but I also assumed Mag’s tapped it in the Svage Land before she even met Remy. Also, wasn’t it (cringe) established she slept with Sentry?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 05, 2018, 12:21:40 PM
Interesting that Rogue’s first time was Remy. I assumed they did bang…as most did…but I also assumed Mag’s tapped it in the Svage Land before she even met Remy. Also, wasn’t it (cringe) established she slept with Sentry?


This small retcon just killed Sentry nonsense.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 05, 2018, 12:45:32 PM
Interesting that Rogue’s first time was Remy. I assumed they did bang…as most did…but I also assumed Mag’s tapped it in the Svage Land before she even met Remy. Also, wasn’t it (cringe) established she slept with Sentry?


Nah, it was one of those "almost" incidents. The only time Magneto and Rogue would have had time to do that would have occurred off-panel and was then never spoke of, so no. Rogue basically admitted as much (nothing happening between them) during Legacy before Xavier fixed her powers. She admitted the attraction but that's as far as it went. I believe even Claremont said nothing happened between the two in the Savage Land and romance wasn't his intention to begin with. I find the last part hard to believe with all the loin clothes/ bikinis going around.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 05, 2018, 12:46:17 PM

This small retcon just killed Sentry nonsense.


We don't talk about that.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: M on March 06, 2018, 09:20:47 AM

We don't talk about that.


Talk about what?


Seems like I should invest more in this mini... but it's Marvel... We'll see
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on March 06, 2018, 09:38:21 AM
I think you should M. It's romy written by someone who romys. I don't think any romy lover should skip it. LOL

It's in your restaurant as it were ...... (will wait to see if M remembers). *wink*
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on March 06, 2018, 10:35:11 AM
I think you should M. It's romy written by someone who romys. I don't think any romy lover should skip it. LOL

It's in your restaurant as it were ...... (will wait to see if M remembers). *wink*


I concur. Yeah, there has only been 2 issues out, but KT is quickly becoming my favorite romy writer (if such a sub-genre exists) haha
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AnimatedPhil on March 06, 2018, 01:38:20 PM

I concur. Yeah, there has only been 2 issues out, but KT is quickly becoming my favorite romy writer (if such a sub-genre exists) haha


The way she’s addressed the whole Antartica thing. With Rogue taking blame for what she did to Remy has scored big points with me. It’s what I would argue about with my ex. I now have finally won that argument.  ;D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 06, 2018, 03:26:32 PM
I don't really care about "blame" more than the embracing of the incident. Whether it was bad writing or not, it happened. It was pitched, approved and printed. It's canon that she left him. We can argue that she was being affected by his own self-loathing, but that doesn't excuse the X-Men. Why didn't anyone go back for him immediately? It's the freakin' Antarctic, a person can't survive out there that long without provisions. He there for at least days. How does editorial tell the writers to bring him back, but ignores that glaring problem? They can make Marrow, Sabretooth and Mystique X-Men but leave one of their own to die for a mistake he made as a desperate young man who couldn't control his powers? That could have easily been any of them in that position. Again, it's canon and the result of questionable writing, but that crap got through and wasn't touched upon after the fact. If I recall correctly, they wrote Storm scolding him for not telling the X-Men that he was alive... I guess no one cared enough to sit in Cerebro for a quick second? I'm glad KT is confronting it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on March 06, 2018, 03:57:37 PM
For some reason i thought his unique energy was meant to hide him from tp's and was the basis of his psycic defense....? Could anyone clarify.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 06, 2018, 04:16:48 PM
No Gambit isn't immune to telepathic detection. If someone is specifically searching for him, they'll find him. Otherwise his mind comes up as background noise. It's like looking around in dimly lit room seeing nothing but vague shapes, versus looking around for some specifically. You'll key in on certain shape or silhouette. He has techniques to increase this "vagueness" like holding a charged card to his head. But it doesn't make him immune like you'd see with Juggernaut or Magneto's helmet.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: M on March 07, 2018, 03:40:45 AM
I think you should M. It's romy written by someone who romys. I don't think any romy lover should skip it. LOL

It's in your restaurant as it were ...... (will wait to see if M remembers). *wink*



 :gambit:
Romy is who?
A play on words
So where's Remy
at? become?




I seen it
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on March 07, 2018, 12:17:14 PM
Without spoiling anything, R&G #3 was a really fun issue, the best one so far, a lot happens...action, humour, sexiness, emotion...it's like an old fashioned X-Men comic...
KT's handling Gambit a lot better in the last 2 issues. I know in issue #1 there were some problems with his characterisation, but he reads quite well in this issue...and she writes another strong Rogue here, which was expected, KT's got a good feel for her.


Kelly Thompson is only 2 issues away from being the best "ROMY" writer ever. I know Nicieza, Lobdell and Claremont wrote some nice relationship moments in the past, but KT's taking it to another level.





Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 07, 2018, 01:27:28 PM
It was a very good issue!
This issue has the best Gambit from this series so far.


And KT did smth that Amsus were not able to do for me with this issue. Gambit was fighting multiple enemies, dodging attacks and at the same time kicking enemies with his bo staff. He wasn't even punched once by them!
While Rogue was punched at the beginning and was fighting like brawler, Gambit was fighting as at his old times.


Kudos for KT. Remy was used really really good here.
Now I am really interested to see whose take on Gambit I would love more at the end. Her Gambit or Amus'.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on March 07, 2018, 01:40:37 PM
Glad to hear it! I probably won't be able to read it for a couple days so this is really good news
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on March 07, 2018, 01:52:05 PM
Yeah, great issue.  #2 still stands atop my favorite issue of the young year so far though. But great action and worthwhile dialogue to go with it all throughout the issue. Not just constant blabbering that we see in a lot of Marvel comics.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 07, 2018, 01:53:24 PM
This book is Romy deep! I am happy it wasn't just a fun adventure of Gambit and Rogue. It is fun but at the same time it is emotional, super hot and actioned packed.
I think issue 3 had everything I want from Gambit book.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 07, 2018, 01:55:04 PM
Yeah, great issue.  #2 still stands atop my favorite issue of the young year so far though. But great action and worthwhile dialogue to go with it all throughout the issue. Not just constant blabbering that we see in a lot of Marvel comics.


Yeah. Dialogue was so good that issue felt long even that preview pages showed first 5 pages.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on March 07, 2018, 02:14:00 PM
One of the reason's why #3 stands out for me is because it was a much longer read than the first 2, as great as they were, I remember it took no time to finish reading those, whereas here in #3, it was a lot more deeper, a lot more going on...though I did love issue #2's "first meeting" scenes, some really great writing there too...but I don't know, #3 was very meaty, a lot of material.


Perez's action scenes were excellent, the one page that stood out was this large melee of clones, it's the page where Gambit says "Rogue! Switch!" beautifully drawn.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 07, 2018, 05:23:18 PM
Gambit`s reaction to Kitty as this gif was perfect ;D


https://gifer.com/en/2A3A
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on March 07, 2018, 05:23:47 PM
It was a good issue. The fight scene drawn well. Antarctica addressed which was good and Rogue owning it which she should have done back then instead of getting a hall pass. There was no "self loathing" excuse used.

I was amused at the therapeutic method. LOL

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on March 07, 2018, 05:58:08 PM
So help me, I really enjoyed this issue. I think I might be falling back in love with these two. And that kind of makes me angry.

But that "someone else" speech bothers me. We all know she meant Erik and if it were anyone else but him, I'd be 100 percent on her side.

But I do like that KT addressed it, even if I disagree with it.

Other stuff I liked:
the recognition of Antarctica on their relationship
Romy sex!
The fight with the Romy clones though too obvious in its symbolism was still a lot of fun
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 07, 2018, 06:08:00 PM
KT so far made a great work with them.

She is doing her best with some terrible bagage created by other writers. I hope mini will continue to be as good.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on March 07, 2018, 06:12:28 PM
I get that. And as dissatisfied as I am with the explanation, I also get that, short of retconning, there isn't a good explanation for what happened there. Same goes for a lot of other bad plots and characterizations they've gone through.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on March 07, 2018, 06:31:28 PM
She's really stringing it all together nicely. In a mini no less. It's pretty incredible work on KT's part.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 07, 2018, 06:58:25 PM
This issue was like the polar opposite of the legacy issue before the schism split. I'm surprised it took so long to get an issue like this. Cyclops and Beast have had more intimate scenes than Gambit. Profound sadness.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on March 07, 2018, 07:01:41 PM
Amidst all the dialogue.. I'm really curious about all the clones and how it's effecting their memory. Should be a real interesting final two issues. It feels like there's so much left to cover. Amazing she's fitting everything into these five issues.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on March 07, 2018, 07:15:22 PM
I think there is more to the villain and the memories, she seems to feed off of them, hence the people in the dementia and stuff.

Kind of like Shadowking but not.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 07, 2018, 07:25:36 PM
I wonder why KT chose to use an original character opposed to a more established one. But I suppose sheds need a specific set of powers to make the plot work.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on March 07, 2018, 07:53:36 PM
You know how some music artists have that one hit that you hear over and over, then never hear from them again? Everyone knows the 'One Hit Wonder'.


Now we need to apply the same thing for villains in a comic series or mini. Kinda like a 'One Arc Wonder'. Come in, do their dastardly thing, then you never hear or see from them again. Unless its someone reminiscing.


But yeah, otherwise, solid props for this issue. Can't help but wonder with all the good feels going on, if it is going to continue beyond the therapy, or if reality will come crashing down around them when they leave. (AKA when another writer gets them again)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: wantutosigh on March 07, 2018, 09:42:51 PM
Unfortunately, snowy weather prevented me from being able to make the trip to the local comic store so I'll have to wait before I can read this. :tickedoff:
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on March 08, 2018, 10:13:14 AM
Since my comic book was down to just about zero before this, I got a digital copy y and picked up the floppy later.


I think she probably did the best she could with the legacy situation. I'm actually a little happy she never mentioned mags by name, showing he really wasn't important *slight evil giggle*. Being that one was terrible all around, don't dwell on it too much...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 08, 2018, 10:42:35 AM
I wonder why KT chose to use an original character opposed to a more established one. But I suppose sheds need a specific set of powers to make the plot work.


I am happy that villain is new. Gambit needs bigger gallery of villains.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 08, 2018, 05:59:27 PM
So help me, I really enjoyed this issue. I think I might be falling back in love with these two. And that kind of makes me angry.

But that "someone else" speech bothers me. We all know she meant Erik and if it were anyone else but him, I'd be 100 percent on her side.

But I do like that KT addressed it, even if I disagree with it.

Other stuff I liked:
the recognition of Antarctica on their relationship
Romy sex!
The fight with the Romy clones though too obvious in its symbolism was still a lot of fun


Yep that vague reference to sleeping with the dude that helped cause Antarctica which Rogue just said ruined Romy just doesn't work for me.  Not sure why KT couldn't just have Rogue say, "I f**ked up and shouldn't have slept with Mags."  Pretty simple really.  It doesn't need an explanation.  All it needed was an acknowledgment that she messed up.  Instead we get Rogue trying to excuse Mags as her wanting to explore.  It would like someone trying to justify sleeping with their girlfriend's sister as "I just wanted to explore." GTFOH.  You go exploring with people that didn't ruin your relationship. 

It is especially odd because KT had Rogue take responsibility for Antarctica but it is like KT couldn't bring herself to go all the way and have Rogue apologize for Mags.  Ruins the whole issue for me which is a shame because the rest of it was pretty solid.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 08, 2018, 07:59:06 PM

Yep that vague reference to sleeping with the dude that helped cause Antarctica which Rogue just said ruined Romy just doesn't work for me.  Not sure why KT couldn't just have Rogue say, "I f**ked up and shouldn't have slept with Mags."  Pretty simple really.  It doesn't need an explanation.  All it needed was an acknowledgment that she messed up.  Instead we get Rogue trying to excuse Mags as her wanting to explore.  It would like someone trying to justify sleeping with their girlfriend's sister as "I just wanted to explore." GTFOH.  You go exploring with people that didn't ruin your relationship. 

It is especially odd because KT had Rogue take responsibility for Antarctica but it is like KT couldn't bring herself to go all the way and have Rogue apologize for Mags.  Ruins the whole issue for me which is a shame because the rest of it was pretty solid.


Probably for the same reason most pros aren't going to outright say they "hated" another pros work. Especially when it represents the company they work for. The Magneto relationship-thing was laced throughout Carey's run, just thrown into overdrive for the last 12 (or less) issues. It's probably bad form to denigrate it. Something I think she learned during her move from critique to writer. Kinda like NBA coaches don't talk ish about each other in public during or after their tenure in the league. KT is walking a line here, outside of straight up retconning it, she has to try to make sense of something that shouldn't have happened in the first place. She's trying to respect continuity (Doing a really good job at it. best I've seen in years) and at the same time appease both Rogue and Gambit fans. You may be asking too much. As many times as Gambit has gotten the short end of the stick, she cant just go and dump everything on Rogue (arguably the biggest female draw in Marvel right now). The fact that she's allowed to even do this much is somewhat surprising to me.


I personally don't see a problem with it. People sleep with people they shouldn't all the time. At the moment the person will swear up and down its the "right thing" and probably cling that much harder to the person. Then turn around and look back a couple years later and regret the whole thing. From what I gather, Rogue seems to be remorseful. I think you may want a bit more than what's necessary. From Gambit's response too. In the past you've said you want Gambit not to care, and that's basically whats happening here, he let it go. But you seem to want him not to care at all, which I guess is fair as well. Gambit has some fault in the rockiness in their relationship, "the tape" comes to mind, but I don't believe Rogue even knows about that. And yeah, I still don't know how the Storm incident came up... There's just not enough time to delve so deep.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 08, 2018, 09:45:35 PM
Sorry bro, you are excuse making.  Writers retcon and contradict other writers all the time.  You are free to feel however you want about it.  I think her hand waving Mags away was bulls*** and no amount of mental gymnastics is going to sway me.

People sleep with people they shouldn't all the time.  And adults that do so man up and admit it.  Rogue didnt do that.   She made excuses.  Mags was not her exploring.  Give me a break. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 08, 2018, 10:16:54 PM
Hmm.... So, ok if we're not taking characters words as cannon, I'm curious, what was she doing if not exploring, as was written? Because I was just generating reason for something thatst already happened. At this point your questioning the mental position of a fictional character. Isn't what they say the very stuff that makes it reality? Unless there's a narrator box or thought bubble, doesn't it end there?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 08, 2018, 10:34:58 PM
Rogue is a fictional character.  The writer created a bulls*** excuse to handwave Mags away just as Carey created a bulls*** excuse to put them together in the first place.

Exploring is hooking up with Deadpool or Johnny Storm.  It is not hooking up with the dude who helped ruin your relationship.  Like lets be real here dude.  That s*** would not fly with anyone in Gambit's situation.

There is no way if my girlfriend or anyone's girlfriend for that matter slept with someone that tried to ruin my or their life that they would just accept that claim.  It is by no means realistic bro.  KT has done a good job overall but I am not pretending her Mags' explanation makes sense.  She doesnt get a pass for bulls*** just because you like her story more than Carey's.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 08, 2018, 11:21:21 PM
You seem to be a bit more agitated over this than thought. Won't go further into this much longer... But o believe you're misconstruing my posts. I'm actually asking what you think is going on. I'm talking about human action and response. I can't really tell if you're talking about KT the writer or Rogue the character. I'm more interested in talking about character motivations rather than writer missteps, because if we're going to start sifting stories by that then this is all just assumptions because none of work with these people or are present at their little retreats. The only reason I talked about KT earlier was to explain why she probably didn't write Rogue just outright denouncing Magneto (though I kinda think she just called him an experiment. Is that a good thing?), professional courtesy and all that...


Is anyone else having issues with predictive text when posting here?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 08, 2018, 11:47:41 PM
But getting back to character motivations, it's one of the reasons I like the idea that Gambits self loathing drove Rogue to leave him in Antarctica (because that didn't make sense), and why I hate that X-Men just let it happen. Also why I really hate retcons and love continuity. I can't change what's happened. It's printed but I love making sense of it. Assuming it's possible because somethings are just pointless. Like Gambit at burning man or Johnny and Rogue happening off panel during a period of time that doesn't exist.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 08, 2018, 11:48:33 PM
Not agitated at all.  It is what it is. If KT could have Rogue say Mags was an experiment then she could have had her simply say he was a mistake and that she never should have slept with the dude that helped ruin their relationship.  So trying to explain that away as professional courtesy makes no sense.  She has invalidated Rogueneto either way.  She simply did so in a way I think preserves her favorite character as she just couldnt quite bring herself to having Rogue admit the truth.

As for what it means for Rogue.  Rogue is still running that is what it means.  She can't admit she messed up with Mags so she tries to lump him in with Deadpool and Johnny but anyone that read Rogueneto and knows the history knows he was different.

So until Rogue can come to terms with the fact that on some level she betrayed the man she claims to be her one true love, their relationship is ultimately built on a lie.  She wasn't exploring with Mags.  Exploring doesnt do justice to the betrayal.

We all know there are certain people that if we slept with them our ex would be livid.  So while we have the right to do it many of us have the courtesy and regard not to particularly if we still love our ex as Rogue claims.  Rogue has yet to fully own what she did by sleeping with Mags.  That is the issue that until resolved forever taints them getting back together IMO which is a shame because KT has done well showing what they can be.  For many the good will make them ignore it being built on a lie.  It simply doesnt work for me so in the end to each his/her own.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on March 09, 2018, 01:58:48 AM
While not direct it makes a tonne of sense. And for someone who run's and seems has trouble being honest with thier emotions it seems a massive admission while trying to hold some dignity. Esp with something so important, something Gambit has experience with and i assume a lot of empathy i think he would be content to read between the lines. It feels real in a visceral way opening up a fair amount of vulnerability. I think Gambit showed great maturity by taking it at its meaning knowing who it comes from and accepting it as the olive branch it is not throwing his toys out the cot wanting to "btb". It is a way of admitting culpability without pulling the scabs off every wound would we really expect a blow by blow of every missgiving leading into some siege mindwarfare? If you are wanting to reconcile and you know the details why burn yourself right back down again for no purpose if the real heart of what you want has been addressed.


It also seems a tidy way of rolling it all up and laying it out for what it is and without naming it becomes a cover all for all the other things even johnny pool and the rest.


It sets a tone of reconciliation, the more i think about it seems thr best way forward with the options realistically available.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 09, 2018, 08:22:13 AM
There is nothing wrong with telling someone you messed up.  That is all that would have been required.


Saying you were exploring with Mags is not a massive admission.  It is a massive copout.  But of you guys are fine with it then do you.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 09, 2018, 08:31:32 AM
I think there's a difference in "being fine" with something and just not letting something bother me. In the grand scheme of things, this seems mild to what actually irks me in terms of Gambit;


Him being left in Antarctica
Agreeing to be Death
Losing like he did to Cap
Losing fights to effing Mystique
Most of X-factor (though there were places PAD was great)
Clown Pants, clown pants, effing clown pants
Freaking out after kissing Frenzy


And for goodness sake can we stop with the "whatever" disclaimers? Not just you. It's patronizing and gives the impression of something is wrong with everyone else for not sharing the sentiment. Probably no one's intension but its a mood killer. Id like to post here more than once a day but we have to leave it bit more accessible as if an argument isn't going to be birthed. I'm not posting CBR anymore because apparently we can't have a difference in opinion there without being a "troll". And they banned Purp, so #&#$ them lol. I just want to hear your thoughts and ideas, not convince you to think like me.


 I believe a lot of you are enjoying this book more than you'll openly admit. Shh I won't tell ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 09, 2018, 08:36:47 AM
I think there's a difference in "being fine" with something and just not letting something bother me. In the grand scheme of things, this seems mild to what actually irks me in terms of Gambit;


Him being left in Antarctica
Agreeing to be Death
Losing like he did to Cap
Losing fights to effing Mystique
Most of X-factor (though there were places PAD was great)
Clown Pants, clown pants, effing clown pants
Freaking out after kissing Frenzy


This list kills me :(
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 09, 2018, 08:43:56 AM
I think there's a difference in "being fine" with something and just not letting something bother me. In the grand scheme of things, this seems mild to what actually irks me in terms of Gambit;


Him being left in Antarctica
Agreeing to be Death
Losing like he did to Cap
Losing fights to effing Mystique
Most of X-factor (though there were places PAD was great)
Clown Pants, clown pants, effing clown pants
Freaking out after kissing Frenzy


The first thing on your list was caused by Mags and therein lies the rub.


I am not bothered by it.  I am telling you my thoughts about it.  If I were bothered by it I wouldn't be saying KT has done a.good job overall.  One can offer a critique of something without being bothered by it.  We are only still talking about it because you asked me to discuss my opinion more.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 09, 2018, 08:48:30 AM
Your response is as if I were talking about you. I was actually talking about me. When it said "me" it wasn't symbolism for "you". My intention is not to accuse you of being one way or another. I'm not debating or being combative, here. Got no wish for that. I'm in search of a conversation, not argument. But I like this. Two responses in as many minutes. Dope.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 09, 2018, 09:01:42 AM
As a fan of Rogue, there are things that annoy me as well. I'm not "mad" about Antarctica because I do think the idea of here bring affected by Gambits mind is viable (because otherwise that @&## dont make sense). But that doesn't excuse the X-Men's response or lack thereof.


Then there's her not going after Gambit once he was Death. Could have been a great subplot like how Wolvie did in xtas chasing Morph.


Positively annoyed with her telling Gambit she wasn't "ready" once she control of her powers in large parts thanks to him


Now the end of AoX where she goes off with Mags. I don't like mix blame with cannon character moments and writer BS but it's hard because that was based on a effing retcon. Legacy never showed anything for Magneto during aox. And when asked about the problems Rogue should have with being Magneto Carey said they worked it out off panel. At that point Carey is just inserting himself into the universe and playing god with the infinity gauntlet.


Then there was every author shipping her with their favorite character, including Carey and either having the gest of it occur "off panel" or out of thin air. Johnny doesn't make sense in the time given or the fact she can't control her powers; she had no reason to "make out" with Deadpool or why he's not in a coma. There's more stuff, but most recent and stands out the most to me.


I detest inconsistencies.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 09, 2018, 09:21:28 AM
Your response is as if I were talking about you. I was actually talking about me. When it said "me" it wasn't symbolism for "you". My intention is not to accuse you of being one way or another. I'm not debating or being combative, here. Got no wish for that. I'm in search of a conversation, not argument. But I like this. Two responses in as many minutes. Dope.


I know you weren't referring to me directly but obviously when you say what you did in the midst of a back and forth, someone could read it and infer that you saying you are not bothered implies that I may be so I was just responding to clarify my position.  I don't find this combative at all. 

The thing that annoys people about Antarctica is that it was clearly written to cover for Rogue.  I remember reading it back then and I remember the flak Rogue was getting for it.  So it was clear to me back then it was a retcon meant to soften what Rogue did rather than something they truly envisioned at the start.

And while I agree with most of what you said, I think the same sort of analysis should be applied here.  We all know that when the stories were told, Mags was more than just exploring.  They have a long history together and this is where we need to give our buddy Jason Esta some credit.  He is right.  Mags is more prominent in Rogue's story than Deadpool or Johnny who are the guys I can accept are her exploring.  Even if you ignore the Trial stuff, Mags has popped in and out of her life several times and their relationship clearly was much more as told by Carey.

So now we seem to be ok with KT basically retconning that story as her just exploring simply because it gets some people to Romy.  So this is why I am saying it is not a matter of me being upset or bothered.  This is simply me holding her to the same standard I have held every writer to.  If I am going to critique when Carey or other writers play it loose with continuity then I need to do the same for KT.  And if KT is just going to pretend like all those interactions with Mags was just Rogue exploring then I see no reason for her not to go all the way and simply have Rogue admit to it being a mistake.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on March 09, 2018, 09:55:42 AM
Careful, this post will not be for the faint of heart ... rant-ish I guess, and not in response to anyone. LOL Just an opinion.

I don't like this book. I don't like Rogue and she'll come out of it like some precious princess, she always gets that treatment from anyone who writes her. She does no wrong, doesn't admit to doing wrong, doesn't own anything. It is always somebody else when it comes to her.

Self Loathing - Gambit
killed some dude - Wonder Man - didn't know his strength and what not.
fake feelings for Magneto - those memories she held onto were placed in her head, so she sleeps with Magneto. And she won't even own it.  Or that is never written to own it. This is the problem.

Magneto an experiment ..... far too much history between Magneto and Rogue for that. Was she trying to spare Gambit's feelings? I dunno, you can't tell, she doesn't admit to anything, and what she does admit to is so subtle that is easy to gloss over. Hall pass. Wait, we have a "harbor speech" by Gambit, therefore it was his fault for her to experiment with Magneto. See, how easy it is ....

Gambit will be the pining punk love interest who did some cool s*** with his powers and accepting of Rogue and her crap because he always does. Rogue - Marvel Princess will move on and not deal with her issues and not held accountable for anything. R&G 5 issue mini.

I don't give a s*** about her days with the Brotherhood. It's not held against her now, not like the MM is held against Gambit at every turn. There is some sort of pedestal for Rogue. I'm not even going to get into all the kills Magneto and Wolverine racked up and nobody says boo about it. But hey, remember the retcon of MM - Gambit ... lets not ever forget that and lets bring it up every time there is a trust issue with Rogue.

She is still not owning her s***. That is where this book is failing for me. She is not growing as a character, she is not admitting to anything, beyond mildly saying she did things. She never apologizes for anything. She barely shows remorse. This is a difficult character to identify with or like ...Yes, its how she's written and she's fictional. That said, then she should be written better. IMO I read books for entertainment, I am not entertained.

Gambit has always been written to own his misdeeds, to the point of overkill. Its constantly in his face. And not just by writers, fans too. Where is the balance.

All the bs aside between the couple, the one thing not really being addressed, the one thing that is brought up time, and time again ...... TRUST. They don't have it, or more specifically she doesn't trust Gambit. This is stated in far too many books for it to just be glossed over in a mini. We can address and look at the events that have shaped this pairing and look at the misdeeds and what not but until trust is built, for which Rogue has repeatedly stated is an issue with Gambit, then whats the point.

There you go, how's that for opinion. LMAO.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: albahan888 on March 09, 2018, 10:09:40 AM
I'm with remydat from what I've heard of this issue because I don't give Marvel my money anymore and therefore haven't read any of this series. You can't just handwave Magneto as 'exploring' after the way it was actually presented and (poorly) handled and especially with Rogue apparently using Gambit's words to justify it and deciding that Antarctica is the worst thing to happen to their relationship (which isn't necessarily wrong). Magneto caused Antarctica and she knows that and I also agree if you're going with a handwavey explanation just admit it was a mistake and go from there. Human Torch or Deadpool maybe would be exploring but Magneto isn't. As I've said here before he is the second worst character for Rogue to get with that would be an insult to Gambit behind Mr. Sinister... Mr. Sinister is the only worse one that would make less sense.


Also, Antarctica has already been addressed and gotten over to some extent but nothing since Milligan and Carey has and it doesn't sound like it's going to be. It's just frustrating to see that probably the only book that will (for a while) care about or try to address and fix Romy is ignoring one of the biggest monkey wrenches that has been stuck in it recently especially since it easily ties in to the Trial of Gambit. I understand that it's probably hard to explain it and deal with it because it doesn't make any sense in the first place but as she said if it's gonna matter going forward you've got to address the continuity and problems and I don't think you do that by just handwaving her 'relationship' with that old terrorist away like that. Like I said though I don't really have the context or direct quotes of what was said to go by so I can only react based on an impression. Gotta say I do disagree with the one Rogue (I assume) quote I saw on the CBR Forums because I feel like that's basically how writers have treated things since the Magneto mess (again I don't read Marvel anymore so it's just the impression that I get)... which isn't a fictional character's fault but you know.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on March 09, 2018, 10:28:52 AM
Here is the thing with a fictional character's fault. It is theirs to own because they are the ones used in the story. We're a small group, CBR is small too btw - and we're more in the know as it were when it comes to writers, and artists. Joe or Jane Doe off the street who is buying for no reason other than something to read, may not know who wrote what or care who wrote it. It will still come down to the character in the end.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on March 09, 2018, 10:34:54 AM
For what it's worth, I think it's a BS excuse, but it is cannon until someone else retcons it. Either way, it's not an issue that really bothers me.


Careful, this post will not be for the faint of heart ... rant-ish I guess, and not in response to anyone. LOL Just an opinion.


I don't give a s*** about her days with the Brotherhood. It's not held against her now, not like the MM is held against Gambit at every turn. There is some sort of pedestal for Rogue. I'm not even going to get into all the kills Magneto and Wolverine racked up and nobody says boo about it. But hey, remember the retcon of MM - Gambit ... lets not ever forget that and lets bring it up every time there is a trust issue with Rogue.



This s*** though...You hit the nail on the head, Neko
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 09, 2018, 10:40:12 AM
The thing is the fix is simple.  You don't need to go into all the reasons why she slept with Mags as God knows I don't know how you justify it.

All that would be needed was for Rogue to say, "Gambit, I am sorry for sleeping with Mags.  I don't know what I was thinking and I know it was unfair to you and to us really considering what he did to us."

That's it.  That is literally all you have to do and it would at least be her owning it.  Gambit could then simply apologize for Death which he still hasn't apologized for and we can call it a day.

Instead, we get this bs, "I was just exploring the guy that ruined our relationship.  No biggie."  Come one, if I was trying to get back with an ex and she pulled that bs, I would roll my eyes and tell her to take a hike.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 09, 2018, 10:54:48 AM
Well this turned out better than I hoped. Love it. We're the guild. Shouldn't be afraid of offending someone. My motto is "$&$& yo feeling's, tell me how you feel"... Well that made more sense in my head. Replace the last "feel" with "opinion".
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: albahan888 on March 09, 2018, 11:02:09 AM
Here is the thing with a fictional character's fault. It is theirs to own because they are the ones used in the story. We're a small group, CBR is small too btw - and we're more in the know as it were when it comes to writers, and artists. Joe or Jane Doe off the street who is buying for no reason other than something to read, may not know who wrote what or care who wrote it. It will still come down to the character in the end.


That's my point though. Rogue can say that and that should (in my opinion) be the case but (again without direct context/evidence) 'it was never as simple as not loving you, as not choosing you' I don't think is really how she's been written as far as I can tell since the Magneto mess. I mean I guess she's right that it isn't that simple but I don't agree with the other part of that statement given what admittedly little I've seen of her attitudes about it especially since she's been an Avenger.


The thing is the fix is simple.  You don't need to go into all the reasons why she sleep with Mags as God knows I don't know how you justify it.


All that would be needed was for Rogue to say, "Gambit, I am sorry for sleeping with Mags.  I don't know what I was thinking and I know it was unfair to you and to us really considering what he did to us."


That's it.  That is literally all you have to do and it would at least be here owning it.  Gambit could then simply apologize for Death which he still hasn't apologized for and we can call it a day.


Instead, we get this bs, "I was just exploring the guy that ruined our relationship.  No biggie."  Come one, if I was trying to get back with an ex and she pulled that bs, I would roll my eyes and tell her to take a hike.


I agree. You really can't explain it so just admit it was at least a mistake if you're apparently gonna hang the relationship problems on the Trial of Gambit which was done by Magneto. It seems simple... bad things happened in Antarctica and Magneto was directly responsible for most of them but apparently Gambit being physically and mentally altered by Apocalypse into Death was too far and whatever other Carey BS so she went to that old terrorist and that was fine because now it was just 'exploring' or whatever was actually said in this issue.  ::)


Oh well. I guess that's the biggest problem with Romy is it isn't universally (or barely at all) supported in Marvel so it's not treated well and at this point there's so much crap piled on top of it even the seemingly one writer at Marvel that does appear to care about it won't or can't even try to really clean it off.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 09, 2018, 11:16:03 AM
The thing is the fix is simple.  You don't need to go into all the reasons why she slept with Mags as God knows I don't know how you justify it.

All that would be needed was for Rogue to say, "Gambit, I am sorry for sleeping with Mags.  I don't know what I was thinking and I know it was unfair to you and to us really considering what he did to us."

That's it.  That is literally all you have to do and it would at least be here owning it.  Gambit could then simply apologize for Death which he still hasn't apologized for and we can call it a day.

Instead, we get this bs, "I was just exploring the guy that ruined our relationship.  No biggie."  Come one, if I was trying to get back with an ex and she pulled that bs, I would roll my eyes and tell her to take a hike.


Something to take into account. All writers don't have the same amount of freedom as others. Something we know. Their stories have to be approved and signed off. Only a handful of them like Bendis and for a little while Remender have/had more of a free hand. For instance there are several story lines that come to mind that I doubt will ever really be brought up again. One, Ms. Marvel being impregnated by the Beyonder. Two Antman beating up Wasp. There are a few more but those two mostly because of sociological implications and just overall distasteful for business.


Those are abandoned storylines, from how Marvel handled Rogue and Magneto, and even Deathbit, I don't think it'll ever be head on addressed unless it's absolutely necessary. Both storylines were ultimately ignored and then written off quietly.


As for in character issues. I see the main theme here being trust it lack thereof, leading to betrayal. Ive always thought Gambit should have a huge problem with Magneto. Hes a thorn in his side in several realities. The only time we've seen him make mention of it was during X-factor. I loved that. But outside of that one instance Gambit has never even brought up his distaste of the man. Something I've always wanted to be laid out. One of the reasons Legacy never made sense to me, unless Gambit just hates himself so much that he has little to no self confidence which is not the case.


A lot of this goes back to weak editors not keeping writers in check in terms of characterizations and reeling in their personal feelings.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on March 09, 2018, 11:18:33 AM
How about an apology from Rogue, written by someone who is in charge of her specifically. That would be nice. Not from a Gambit writer, or in a Gambit solo. But in a book that should have some sort canon attached to it. TBH, there should have been an apology in that "session" when they were talking about Antarctica. She admits it was a mistake but doesn't apologize for her actions.

What I tire of  .... its always Gambit's fault.

Agree with you albahan888 with the comment of not choosing you, again why? Is this the trust thing again?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 09, 2018, 11:36:31 AM

Something to take into account. All writers don't have the same amount of freedom as others. Something we know. Their stories have to be approved and signed off. Only a handful of them like Bendis and for a little while Remender have/had more of a free hand. For instance there are several story lines that come to mind that I doubt will ever really be brought up again. One, Ms. Marvel being impregnated by the Beyonder. Two Antman beating up Wasp. There are a few more but those two mostly because of sociological implications and just overall distasteful for business.

Those are abandoned storylines, from how Marvel handled Rogue and Magneto, and even Deathbit, I don't think it'll ever be head on addressed unless it's absolutely necessary. Both storylines were ultimately ignored and then written off quietly.

As for in character issues. I see the main theme here being trust it lack thereof, leading to betrayal. Ive always thought Gambit should have a huge problem with Magneto. Hes a thorn in his side in several realities. The only time we've seen him make mention of it was during X-factor. I loved that. But outside of that one instance Gambit has never even brought up his distaste of the man. Something I've always wanted to be laid out. One of the reasons Legacy never made sense to me, unless Gambit just hates himself so much that he has little to no self confidence which is not the case.

A lot of this goes back to weak editors not keeping writers in check in terms of characterizations and reeling in their personal feelings.


So are we back to talking about meta reasons because I feel like when I do, you will tell me you want to talk about Rogue, lol.  Sorry, just had to get that little jab in.  In all seriousness, I already addressed this, if KT can change continuity to turn Rogueneto into Rogue just exploring then I see no reason why she couldn't have Rogue say sorry.  So while I understand your point, I simply see no evidence it applies here and I think it is just an excuse to let KT off the hook as a writer.  Until she or someone at Marvel says she was not allowed to let Rogue apologize then not buying it.

I don't even care that Gambit doesn't have a huge problem with Mags.  At the end of the day, Mags was a villain and enemy of the X-men at the time and had no obligation to Gambit or Rogue for that matter.  It is Rogue that violated some measure of trust between them by sleeping with Mags.  I don't expect Gambit and Mags to be best buds but I always thought it was odd when say someone gets cheated on and they get more mad with the stranger than they do their significant other who is the one that has an obligation of trust.  Not saying Rogue cheated of course but the point here is Gambit shouldn't be mad at Mags for sleeping with Rogue.  He should be mad at Rogue for sleeping with Mags.  Mags doesn't owe gambit sh*t.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on March 09, 2018, 11:44:54 AM
This s*** though...You hit the nail on the head, Neko

I have my days I guess. LOL
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 09, 2018, 12:25:40 PM
I was offering a tidbit as to why we don't see things explained/addressed the way we'd like not explaining away anything. I wasn't making any excuses, or I didn't mean to, just offering some insight. We all saw what Asmus went through concerning the smallest of plot points. And the fact we saw Mags and Rogue ended in Legacy by Gage, which was obviously an edict. I welcomed one lol. I also split my response into two sections as to not mix the two statements I made. Tried to keep it on track.


Whether KT meant that to be an apology or not, or if it could have been more or less direct, I couldn't tell you. I can ask, if you'd like? What that meant and what vein she wanted it to come down. Well, I'll probably ask any way. It's an interesting question.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 09, 2018, 01:08:49 PM
I was just having a go at you.  Again I understand your point.  I just don't see it being true here.  With Asmus we got plenty of actual evidence of editorial interference.  I do not see any such evidence here.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on March 09, 2018, 02:22:29 PM



The thing is the fix is simple.  You don't need to go into all the reasons why she slept with Mags as God knows I don't know how you justify it.

All that would be needed was for Rogue to say, "Gambit, I am sorry for sleeping with Mags.  I don't know what I was thinking and I know it was unfair to you and to us really considering what he did to us."

That's it.  That is literally all you have to do and it would at least be her owning it.  Gambit could then simply apologize for Death which he still hasn't apologized for and we can call it a day.



I like your solution in regards to Magneto, for some reason I felt that the writer and editing team didn't want to mention Magneto. It sounded like Rogue was too afraid to name him. Again though, your solution is plausible, it's quick, to the point (it would take just 1-2 panels) and it wouldn't drag on or derail the story and bum out the audience by rehashing that depressing story line.


Hard to say with Gambit joining Apocalypse as "Death-bit", because Gambit had good intentions. Stupid as hell, but good intentions.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on March 09, 2018, 02:27:45 PM
I noticed people here mentioning Antarctica. Been a long while since I've read Nicieza's Gambit solo, but didn't Rogue apologise to Gambit for Antarctica? I'm referring to the 'Gambit' '99 Annual...
Maybe in X-Men #81 as well? I can't remember exactly...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on March 09, 2018, 02:30:32 PM
The apology was in the Nicieza run of the Gambit solo. However, Rogue has never apologized for anything when in a main book. My thing was beyond a solo. She was given a hall pass for her behavior and Fabian fixed it as it were.

I don't think there was an apology in Xmen #81, but ... its been a long time since I've looked at any of those issues.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 09, 2018, 03:28:39 PM
81..vol 2


:: quick web search::


Oooh that one. Where Wolverine acted all daddy on him. I don't recall an apology but there were a lot of "sad eyes"... Gambit seemed to be the one that was apologetic. Now I want to go back and read the issues prior to that where Storm acted all mommy on him. She gets less of a pass for him being left in Antarctica but I think she asked if they we're still friends like "are we enemies" or something like that.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on March 09, 2018, 06:10:52 PM
IDK, I thought speech in #3 was supposed to be an apology. Given the past 2 issues, it looked like he had already let it go (which I know a lot of you guys already didn’t like, I get that.) And if this isn’t a good enough for an apology, I get that too. I wish it had been stronger too, though it’s ‘rational’ enough reason for a girl with a terrible ‘father figure’ (mystique) growing up.


Meta arguments keep getting brought up, because the whole thing is ‘meta problems’. The more I find out about marvel’s behind the scenes stuff, the more it seems that ‘Romy’ wasn’t intended as a long term thing, but it became very popular, so it was extended, but it seems the writers and editors almost resented it for being more popular than they intended. Antarctica happened because the new writers didn’t like gambit and wanted to kill him off, but somehow didn’t realize they were writing a stupid story, but assumed most people must agree with them and wouldn’t mind.


Likewise, Carey, and the editors in involved, clearly intended roguneto to be a big long term thing, but it was much less popular than intended. Carey at least was resentfu that it wasn’t liked and from what gage had said and how his story was written, I think he wanted them to stay together too, but the fans weren’t buying it (literally and figuratively, because marvel doesn’t care about angry fans, if sales are good.). So we have the original story, which was stupid and sexist, because behind the scenes guys just wanted it to happen, the break up story which was also stupid, but not quite as bad, because behind the scenes people realized it was losing money and ordered it done.


And now KT is, to an extent, re-writing that story, and she’s probably conscious that some of the behind the scenes higher up guys that wanted the magneto story in the first place are still there but they also approved this story...So it’s like meta tight rope, lol.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 12, 2018, 06:42:06 PM

100 23.24 $3.99 MAR Rogue and Gambit (2018) 2 22,201 -44.27%

Pretty steep drop off.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 12, 2018, 06:54:18 PM

100 23.24 $3.99 MAR Rogue and Gambit (2018) 2 22,201 -44.27%

Pretty steep drop off.



Huge drop. A mini and no variants for issue 2.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on March 12, 2018, 07:11:59 PM
As much as I disliked the whole Rogue/Magneto pairing (and I did, very VERY much), I assume KT decided not to have Rogue say outright that it was a mistake (though it was, IMHO) because there are fans of that pairing, and she didn't want to trash their 'ship.


That being said, I think she did say it in a far more subtle way: Rogue's whole monologue made it sound like it was a mistake and the art seemed to show that it was even painful for her to talk about it aloud.  No names mentioned, like he was an inconsequential rebound.  That's what I think anyway. . .  :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on March 12, 2018, 08:16:20 PM

100 23.24 $3.99 MAR Rogue and Gambit (2018) 2 22,201 -44.27%

Pretty steep drop off.



Huge drop. A mini and no variants for issue 2.

This should not be a surprise in general, there is always a drop between issue #1 and #2. Especially for minis and books that are limited. Solos see drastic drops too.

Variants might have helped but I'm not sure how much, since there wasn't one for the second issue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 12, 2018, 10:49:05 PM
Well probably didn't help that you started off the mini by having half of your tandem looking like a creep.  I suspect a decent amount of Gambit fans didn't stick around for issue 2.  That or like me me they just flip through at their LCS without buying.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on March 13, 2018, 02:34:53 AM
We're living in a time where the core X-Men books are selling between 30-39k. With those figures, what chance does Rogue & Gambit have, or any solo X-Man? Even Deadpool's hit the 20k mark, and that guy gets promoted like crazy. In fact pretty much every book is performing badly, including Avengers.


And that's why I'm glad it's a mini, no abrupt cancellations will effect the story...and it's critically acclaimed, and it should make a nice TPB. So I'm content with that.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 13, 2018, 03:38:03 AM
This should not be a surprise in general, there is always a drop between issue #1 and #2. Especially for minis and books that are limited. Solos see drastic drops too.

Variants might have helped but I'm not sure how much, since there wasn't one for the second issue.


In current market variants helps a lot.
All new Marvel ongoins have numerous sales till issue 5 at least. Venom variant for Astonishing #3 rose sales so much that AXM#3 outsold #2.
It is just shows that R&G was left to survive on it`s own. The same way as Gambit by Asmus.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on March 13, 2018, 08:30:54 AM
I forgot that issue 2 did have a variant and it didn't help. It was not rare either, it was not part of some "marketing" to push another book or help this one. It has the Hulk on it. It seemed to be a 1 for 1 type because I grabbed it by accident and didn't put it back. Attached is the variant for Rogue & Gambit #2.

As for sales, it is what it is .... the book dropped close to half of issue 1, and we've debated that issue quite a bit. Gambit came across poorly, whereas he is better in issue 2 and 3. Issue one set the tone and it wasn't a good one for one of the characters whose name is on the cover (Gambit). Creep Gambit in issue one was no better than clown pants Gambit. IMO.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on March 13, 2018, 06:17:58 PM
KT tweeted this, for those interested:


Quote
If any of y'all wanna write in about how much you love #Rogue & #Gambit, this is the email: [email protected] Make sure to write "ok to print"
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on March 14, 2018, 09:37:48 AM
KT tweeted this, for those interested:


Thanks for sharing! Definitely going to have to do this because R&G has exceeded my expectations
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on March 14, 2018, 06:01:04 PM
Quote from: bark_no_byte link=topic=5109. msg72683#msg72683 date=1521034668

Thanks for sharing! Definitely going to have to do this because R&G has exceeded my expectations



No problem.  :)


I'm pretty happy with the series too so far (though yeah, there are parts in the first issue I didn't like as much, but all in all: good book).  I wrote in.  Hopefully more people do too. 


Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 15, 2018, 06:54:06 AM

KT: "There are two more significant flashbacks in issue 4, yes.


One of them takes place in a famous scene from the past - and gives us a chance to see some “between the panels/off panel” stuff we missed back then. The other is a totally new scene that spins out of some events from the Asmus/Mann Gambit solo series. I think each FB is two pages."
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on March 15, 2018, 09:07:14 AM
Considering her disdain back then, but has reconsidered her view on the Asmus solo, that is nice.

Thanks for the updates ...  :gambit:

edit: that is, its good to have the solo recognized. She could have ignored it but didn't.
 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: pastella on March 15, 2018, 12:45:51 PM

From Pere Perez's Tumblr  (https://pereperezart.tumblr.com)


"The last lines of the last page of the last issue of Rogue and Gambit are about to be drawn.[/size][size=78%]"[/size]

(https://78.media.tumblr.com/594ba42e85362c73716f1f25f1506b9d/tumblr_p5mpzzlieZ1vjnnhko1_1280.jpg)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on March 15, 2018, 12:55:07 PM
Definitely can't argue about the art.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 15, 2018, 01:14:48 PM
Considering her disdain back then, but has reconsidered her view on the Asmus solo, that is nice.

Thanks for the updates ...  :gambit:

edit: that is, its good to have the solo recognized. She could have ignored it but didn't.


Mann's Gambit was also lying on the table in the room with clons.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on March 18, 2018, 08:49:05 PM

As for the "famous" flashback scene, my guess is the near-death experience in X-treme X-men.  KT has ruled out a bunch of other scenes (as suggested by fans) on her tumblr account, but no one asked about that one.

Also, something to look forward to - KT: "The last two issues also look absolutely phenomenal.  Pere really outdid himself.  He just turned in the last page of issue five this week and it’s just a gorgeous issue.  There’s a splash page of Rogue & Gambit in issue 5 that is visually EASILY one of the top 10 moments of ALL TIME for the two of them. "


I'm going to miss this book once it's over!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 19, 2018, 05:18:44 AM
As for the "famous" flashback scene, my guess is the near-death experience in X-treme X-men.  KT has ruled out a bunch of other scenes (as suggested by fans) on her tumblr account, but no one asked about that one.

Also, something to look forward to - KT: "The last two issues also look absolutely phenomenal.  Pere really outdid himself.  He just turned in the last page of issue five this week and it’s just a gorgeous issue.  There’s a splash page of Rogue & Gambit in issue 5 that is visually EASILY one of the top 10 moments of ALL TIME for the two of them. "


I'm going to miss this book once it's over!


Sounds really good!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: andresa on March 19, 2018, 08:16:07 AM
I remember her mentioning that the Valle Soleada period wouldn’t be addressed. A flashback of something that happened before that is probably not out of the question, though. More of the conversation they had after they almost died would be nice. There are a lot of gaps that could be filled in from them making the decision of leaving to settling down.       
 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on March 19, 2018, 09:53:21 AM
I'm going to miss this book once it's over!


Me too! Tempted to buy the trade once it comes out so I can re-read it without having to un-bag/board my floppies
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on March 19, 2018, 06:54:14 PM
Per Amazon:
"Rogue & Gambit: Ring of Fire
by Kelly Thompson and Pere Perez
Paperback
Available for Pre-order. This item will be released on July 17, 2018."
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 20, 2018, 03:34:21 AM
(http://community.comicbookresources.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=63525&d=1521516391)




From #4. Their eyes :o :o
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on March 20, 2018, 11:24:38 AM
Per Amazon:
"Rogue & Gambit: Ring of Fire
by Kelly Thompson and Pere Perez
Paperback
Available for Pre-order. This item will be released on July 17, 2018."


That sounds right. Last issue will be in May and then a month in between. It'll give me a nice break to digest the finale and then come back to it and read it all at once haha
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on March 20, 2018, 07:08:49 PM
From #4. Their eyes :o :o


Yeah, I wonder how the heck that happens. Lovely art though...


Update on the TPB release per Newsarama (https://www.newsarama.com/39134-marvel-comics-june-2018-solicitations.html (https://www.newsarama.com/39134-marvel-comics-june-2018-solicitations.html)):
Quote
FOC 5/14/2018
AMAZING SPIDER-MAN BY DAVID MICHELINIE & TODD MCFARLANE HC (On Sale 10/3/2018)
DOCTOR STRANGE: DAMNATION TPB (On Sale 7/4/2018)
GENERATIONS TPB (On Sale 7/4/2018)
HELLSTORM BY WARREN ELLIS OMNIBUS HC (On Sale 10/3/2018)
PUNISHER: SHADOWMASTERS TPB (On Sale 7/4/2018)
ROGUE & GAMBIT: RING OF FIRE TPB (On Sale 7/4/2018)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: andresa on March 21, 2018, 08:10:37 AM
 I was hoping that ugly cover would be reconsidered. I’ll buy it regardless.
 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 21, 2018, 08:14:22 AM
The cover does kinda suck. I'm not a fan of the majority of Anka's covers for this series, but the first and #4 are my least favorite. I'd like to ask why the use of the blank backgrounds. It seems to be the theme and I'm not sure whether it's in tune with whats happening in the story, or just lazy.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on March 21, 2018, 09:25:29 AM
I actually really like the cover but yeah, I do wish there was more going on in the background
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 21, 2018, 10:46:45 AM
The cover does kinda suck. I'm not a fan of the majority of Anka's covers for this series, but the first and #4 are my least favorite. I'd like to ask why the use of the blank backgrounds. It seems to be the theme and I'm not sure whether it's in tune with whats happening in the story, or just lazy.


I like cover for first issue. Not a fan of issue 4 cover.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 21, 2018, 11:21:00 AM

I like cover for first issue. Not a fan of issue 4 cover.


I like #4 more than #1... I can't stand how Gambit or Rogue are drawn on the first one. I think a better cover could have been used to show the tone the book was going for, definitely wasnt that IMO.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on March 21, 2018, 06:26:31 PM
So we can see from the June solicits, that this book hasn't been renewed. Here's a quote from KT (from tumblr):


Quote
I think there’s a lot of love at Marvel for our Rogue & Gambit book - everyone has been really encouraging and supportive. But we’re just going to have to wait and see if that means we can get something else going down the line.
Don’t give up hope, there really is a lot of love at Marvel for this book and I think they’re very aware of the fan response as well as the excellent reviews we’re getting. 
And thanks to all of you for your part in making your love for the book known - it absolutely means something and helps the cause of more stories for these two!



Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on March 21, 2018, 07:32:32 PM
There's always a chance for KT to write a volume 2 in the future now that she'll be more prominent at Marvel. Or maybe she'll write them both in an X-Men book.
Though I can't see anyone else write a 'Rogue/Gambit' series, I think KT is the only one that's capable of writing a high quality R&G book.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on March 22, 2018, 09:34:54 AM
There's always a chance for KT to write a volume 2 in the future now that she'll be more prominent at Marvel. Or maybe she'll write them both in an X-Men book.
Though I can't see anyone else write a 'Rogue/Gambit' series, I think KT is the only one that's capable of writing a high quality R&G book.


This. KT seems to be blowing up w Marvel, so even if R&G ends at #5, she certainly has a lot of love for the characters, so I wouldn't doubt she writes them again down the road
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on March 22, 2018, 06:50:27 PM

This. KT seems to be blowing up w Marvel, so even if R&G ends at #5, she certainly has a lot of love for the characters, so I wouldn't doubt she writes them again down the road


I would definitely say that this is our best bet. Thankfully for us, she seems like a pretty diehard fan. Plus, the feedback/praise she's getting from fans via her twitter/tumblr posts certainly must have a positive effect on both her and Marvel.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 28, 2018, 09:44:16 PM
This mini was a nice little diversion and nostalgia but it's time for Gambit especially to be his own character.  If they must be an item let them be an item apart from each other as Gambit will never get his due being Rogue's sidepiece.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on March 28, 2018, 11:21:52 PM
This mini was a nice little diversion and nostalgia but it's time for Gambit especially to be his own character.  If they must be an item let them be an item apart from each other as Gambit will never get his due being Rogue's sidepiece.


Agreed. Both characters need to still be in separate books, we don't want a repeat of what happened in Milligan's run, or Gambit being the plot device in Carey's. Ideally separate teams (if together/or not)...and the occasional rendezvous once every few issues.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: andresa on March 29, 2018, 09:40:22 PM
Preview: http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/exclusive-preview-rogue-gambit-4-finds-the-power-couple-in-dire-straights
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on March 29, 2018, 11:06:53 PM
Damn... That was fairly savage.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on March 30, 2018, 01:51:16 AM
Gambit being useful?  Boy Kelly keeps trying to rope me in but not quite.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 30, 2018, 02:52:22 AM
Preview: http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/exclusive-preview-rogue-gambit-4-finds-the-power-couple-in-dire-straights (http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/exclusive-preview-rogue-gambit-4-finds-the-power-couple-in-dire-straights)


Thank you! Great preview.


Love this book!
Gambit explpsion is dangerous :smitten:
Cool! Previous issue gave one of the best fights for Gambit in years. Can`t wait for this issue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: belay on March 30, 2018, 03:03:55 AM
I am really loving how Kelly Thompson has been using Gambit's skills and powers in such a creative manner.  The preview looks amazing and will really miss this book once the series ends. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on March 30, 2018, 07:18:56 AM
So great. Two of my favorite books Marvel is putting out right now are minis that I wish could be turned into ongoings (this and Tales of Suspense).
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: andresa on March 30, 2018, 09:40:29 AM
It’s amazing to see Gambit being useful and skilled again. His powers were fading but he was still able to free them really fast and hurt the villain. Don’t remember the last time he was necessarily brutal like that. Also Rogue and Gambit’s dynamic was great too. The way she kept distracting Lavish cause she knew Gambit was working to get them out of there. So good. That's the best Gambit we've had in years.       

 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: M on March 30, 2018, 10:38:43 AM

No one get's a long term relationship in Marvel


Like Peter Parker and MJ are not going to get together?
C'mon man

IDK, I thought speech in #3 was supposed to be an apology. Given the past 2 issues, it looked like he had already let it go (which I know a lot of you guys already didn’t like, I get that.) And if this isn’t a good enough for an apology, I get that too. I wish it had been stronger too, though it’s ‘rational’ enough reason for a girl with a terrible ‘father figure’ (mystique) growing up.


Meta arguments keep getting brought up, because the whole thing is ‘meta problems’. The more I find out about marvel’s behind the scenes stuff, the more it seems that ‘Romy’ wasn’t intended as a long term thing, but it became very popular, so it was extended, but it seems the writers and editors almost resented it for being more popular than they intended. Antarctica happened because the new writers didn’t like gambit and wanted to kill him off, but somehow didn’t realize they were writing a stupid story, but assumed most people must agree with them and wouldn’t mind.


Likewise, Carey, and the editors in involved, clearly intended roguneto to be a big long term thing, but it was much less popular than intended. Carey at least was resentfu that it wasn’t liked and from what gage had said and how his story was written, I think he wanted them to stay together too, but the fans weren’t buying it (literally and figuratively, because marvel doesn’t care about angry fans, if sales are good.). So we have the original story, which was stupid and sexist, because behind the scenes guys just wanted it to happen, the break up story which was also stupid, but not quite as bad, because behind the scenes people realized it was losing money and ordered it done.


And now KT is, to an extent, re-writing that story, and she’s probably conscious that some of the behind the scenes higher up guys that wanted the magneto story in the first place are still there but they also approved this story...So it’s like meta tight rope, lol.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on March 30, 2018, 11:01:50 AM
It’s amazing to see Gambit being useful and skilled again. His powers were fading but he was still able to free them really fast and hurt the villain. Don’t remember the last time he was necessarily brutal like that. Also Rogue and Gambit’s dynamic was great too. The way she kept distracting Lavish cause she knew Gambit was working to get them out of there. So good. That's the best Gambit we've had in years.     


I agree that it is the best Gambit in years.
I hope in RED he will be good too.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on March 30, 2018, 11:54:06 AM
No one get's a long term relationship in Marvel


Like Peter Parker and MJ are not going to get together?
C'mon man


Ugh. One of the many reasons I dropped ASM.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on April 02, 2018, 08:39:39 PM
KT interview:


http://www.xplainthexmen.com/2018/04/191-unconscionably-sexy/ (http://www.xplainthexmen.com/2018/04/191-unconscionably-sexy/)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on April 02, 2018, 09:14:36 PM
List Ned to it earlier. I liked that she brought up context regarding Remy’s pursuit of Rogue, even if I disagree how she handled it in issue 1.

And I disagree about her being more powerful than him.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 03, 2018, 03:38:19 AM
It was a very enjoyable interview! I am happy that final product is Romy deep and not just a fun adventures. I love to hear writer thoughts about characters. Can`t wait for #4.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 03, 2018, 10:36:31 AM
And I disagree about her being more powerful than him.


Why do you say that? I was always under the impression that she was more powerful.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 03, 2018, 11:45:03 AM
Because... she is.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on April 03, 2018, 11:49:54 AM
Because... she is.


Yeah I thought this was common knowledge.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Meliorist on April 03, 2018, 12:12:18 PM
Maybe depends on the scope you are viewing? Gambit at full power vs Rogue now or Gambit vs Rogue with just her power/limited absorbed. View points don't necessarily have to be strictly right here right now
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 03, 2018, 12:43:12 PM
True... but Rogue at full power (to the point of exploding) held the abilities of every hero on Earth (that was available) and fought off a celestial. You know, a giant space god? When you take away the advantages of Rogue's secondary abilities (strength, flight and durability), she's got no chance. But that's not the case, neither is Gambit's god-mode cheat code. As is versus as is, Gambit can hold her off, but in the end, there's not all that he can do outside of keeping her off balance.


Now, god-Gambit (essentially New Son) Versus space god stopper- Rogue (sound like 90s action figures)? That'd be fun to watch. Kind of a toss up. Question is... Gambit killed the phoenix at full power. Is PF possessed Jean stronger than the giant foot of a celestial?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 03, 2018, 01:33:32 PM
Full power Gambit kills full power Rogue because he can travel in time. He killed Phoenix and Apocalypse.


Rogue without brawler powers is not a danger to him at all.


Rogue with brawler powers will win most fights vs normal Gambit. But he still can defeat her.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on April 03, 2018, 02:07:54 PM
i should have elaborated, because now *I* can't recall why I said that, which is frustrating. Maybe something to do with power potential? Something about atoms/molecules? Because just speaking in general it's no contest that it's her.

If it comes to me again, I'll explain further.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Dantay on April 03, 2018, 02:11:09 PM
As is Rogue is more powerful, Gambit at full power could destroy the multiverse, its the whole reason New Sun tried to train him then try and kill him, New Sun Killed Pheonix and Apocalypse and wiped out his entire world, then traveled through other universes and created his own dimension. Gambit at full power with full control is the most powerful being in Marvel, unfortunately its all been forgotten and brushed under the carpet.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on April 03, 2018, 04:54:13 PM
Interesting how Gambits un PC- ness is talked about...with the one host saying gambit can be creepy and "douchy" towards women
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 03, 2018, 05:18:05 PM
Well, there's a distinct reason I stopped listening to that podcast ages ago. It's like listening to someone talk to themselves. There is very rarely a difference in opinion. Sonically as well. I used to be able to tell who's talking but I found it hard. Pretty sure they used to both do it together and now I think they do it via phone or Skype. I believe one moved from Portland to NYC, or vice versa.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 04, 2018, 09:50:23 AM
Regarding their fighting abilities, it depends on the nature of the fight.  If it is a non-lethal fight then Rogue probably wins most of the time as her strength and durability wins a battle of attrition. 

If it is a fight to the death then it would depend on who got the upper hand first but I would lean towards Gambit slightly.  Rogue would need to get in close to use her strength and durability and I would imagine Gambit could peg her with a fully powered card to stun her and then finish her off with a few cards.  We saw what a full deck of cards did to Gladiator and even that was Gambit ultimately being non-lethal.

I suppose Rogue can fly around throwing crap at him but I would think he would use his agility to avoid those objects while I don't know that Rogue could truly avoid Gambit's cards but it is an interesting matching.  Strength and durability vs Agility and extreme attacking power.

New Son Gambit vs Full Power Rogue is pretty much over in a few seconds realistically as New Son would simply charge the cells in Rogue's body from a safe distance and make her go boom.  She wouldn't ever be able to get close enough to do anything to him and even if she did, New Son is far more durable than regular Gambit as he has a constant flow of energy surrounding him and is more akin to a psionic/energy being without a real physical body.


Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 04, 2018, 09:55:54 AM
As for the issue, it was probably the best issue so far and was close to convincing me that Romy could work at present.  It would have been interesting to see what KT could have done with them if she had a clean slate and none of the baggage but sadly she does not and there is still too much left unsaid between them for me to be a full believer.  But it is a rather enjoyable and at times emotional read.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 04, 2018, 12:46:19 PM
As for the issue, it was probably the best issue so far and was close to convincing me that Romy could work at present.  It would have been interesting to see what KT could have done with them if she had a clean slate and none of the baggage but sadly she does not and there is still too much left unsaid between them for me to be a full believer.  But it is a rather enjoyable and at times emotional read.


Nice! Excited to read it. Definitely seems like each issue is better than the previous.


I feel like Marvel has made me jaded when it comes to their relationships. None of them seem to stick. Even ones like MJ and Pete or Medusa and BB have been broken up to shake up the status quo. As someone who really loves Romy, I'm not sure I'd want them back together right now because someone will just break them up again in another year, just adding to their baggage
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 04, 2018, 02:09:42 PM
As for the issue, it was probably the best issue so far and was close to convincing me that Romy could work at present.  It would have been interesting to see what KT could have done with them if she had a clean slate and none of the baggage but sadly she does not and there is still too much left unsaid between them for me to be a full believer.  But it is a rather enjoyable and at times emotional read.

I thought this issue was good. Nice nod to Asmus' solo too with the Avenger's thing.

Agree too much left unsaid, and Gambit gave her another out .... instead of letting her apologize which she should have just done and ignored him. She is good at ignoring his wishes in the past, she should have stayed true and woman'd up. IMO.

The art is good and the power swap was interesting.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 04, 2018, 04:50:20 PM
Reread it twice before posting.
Wow as great as previous issue! So emotional, actioned packed and beautiful. Nothing to say more. Great issue. So sad that only 1 issue is left of that awesome book.

Gambit was awesome in this. A lot may not enjoy first issue of R&G or even the whole mini but overall KT in 4 issues did much much more for Remy then Asmus in his first arc.
Ofcourse it was hard for Asmus to return Gambit from crap to normal but resolve all bagage of Romy for KT is much harder for sure.Interesting what she would do if it was an ongoing.

Also Gambit kicked Cap in this. It was not real Cap but he did this :gambit:
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 04, 2018, 06:10:49 PM
KT didn't resolve all baggage.  She just has the characters skipping over the baggage and focusing on very simple issues.

Perhaps she did more than Asmus in his first arc but that is not an apples vs apples comparison.  Asmus knew he was writing an ongoing and paced his story that way.  KT knew she was writing a mini and paced her story that way. 

If KT were actually doing an ongoing then I would expect a lot more focus on the real issues in their relationship as the wedding scene and the Avengers scene really aren't the first things any person would point to if they were addressing their issues.  MM, The Trial, Foxxx, Lili, Deathbit, Rogneto are far more pressing issues.  The reality is KT chose safe flashbacks to try and tackle things which makes sense in a mini I suppose.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 04, 2018, 06:19:04 PM
KT didn't resolve all baggage.  She just has the characters skipping over the baggage and focusing on very simple issues that really have nothing to do with the larger baggage.


Perhaps she did more than Asmus in his first arc but that is not an apples vs apples comparison.  Asmus knew he was writing an ongoing and paced his story that way.  KT knew she was writing a mini and paced her story that way. 


If KT were actually doing an ongoing then I would expect a lot more focus on the real issues in their relationship as the wedding scene and the Avengers scene really aren't the first things any person would point to if they were addressing their issues.  The Trial, Foxxx, Lili, Deathbit, Rogneto are far more pressing issues.  The reality is KT chose safe flashbacks to try and tackle things which makes sense in a mini I suppose.


KT didn't resolve all baggage but Asmus didn't bring Gambit back to his glory days either.


Gambit is better fighter in R&G then in his latest solo and it is already means a lot.


Asmus started to write Gambit best at #9 and KT started with #2.


Asmus may be planning as ongoing but some his issues as #3 had no meat inside.
I liked Asmus and his solo but in short term of 4 issues my vote is for KT.
The same thing I can say if you will compare Fabian's and Asmus solo. Fabian's has much more for Gambit in first arc.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on April 04, 2018, 06:55:24 PM
Okay, so I thought to jog my memory by re-listening to the podcast and:

I was thinking in ultimate terms of their powers, which is probably what KT didn't mean. She was probably just saying in general. Which as Dantay said, nobody at Marvel remembers, so I guess it doesn't matter anyway (?). Which sucks.
And yeah, the hosts both sound too similar. And annoying. (Sorry, I hate that nasally kind of voice.)
Again with the Gambit-as-coolness-burrito argument. I'm so tired of hearing it. Also tired of hearing about his "creepiness"--what people tend to forget is that women--including Rogue--are attracted to him, which makes a big difference. I'm so tired of people thinking of him as some sort of sleazy pickup artist.

***
Anyways, the issue. I really enjoyed it. I honestly can't find things to complain about. Actually, I *could* but don't really see the point in getting angry again at him letting her off--but that's just me.

 I am really loving that Gambit's powers are being used well and I admit I got emotional at their flashbacks. I also liked all the details included like them getting teary-eyed after seeing each other's perspectives. And Remy beating up Cap was a nice touch, even though it wasn't real.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 04, 2018, 07:19:26 PM
Yeah, fake Cap was just a surprise present for Gambit fans:)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 04, 2018, 07:43:45 PM

KT didn't resolve all baggage but Asmus didn't bring Gambit back to his glory days either.

Gambit is better fighter in R&G then in his latest solo and it is already means a lot.

Asmus started to write Gambit best at #9 and KT started with #2.

Asmus may be planning as ongoing but some his issues as #3 had no meat inside.
I liked Asmus and his solo but in short term of 4 issues my vote is for KT.
The same thing I can say if you will compare Fabian's and Asmus solo. Fabian's has much more for Gambit in first arc.

Not sure what you mean by glory days.  Asmus had already dealt with Romy and all this solo did was regress him further back than where he was at the end of Asmus, David, and Liu simply because of what Soule wrote.  This solo isn't moving him forward so much as it is erasing all the development he received away from Rogue to put him back where he was decades ago.

By contrast, Asmus made Gambit King of Thieves and gave him back his full powers after he was resurrected.  Those are far more interesting developments than sticking him back with his old lady.

Gambit is not a better fighter.  All this solo proves is that he can beat weakened clones of Rogue and himself, some unknown villain that isn't really a fighter, simulations of the Avengers, and guys that weren't seriously fighting over a garter.  None of those things speaks to some great skill.  Not that Asmus had him taking on world beaters but Asmus certainly had more creative uses of Gambit's powers than this solo.  Rather than just blow up stuff, we had him making things disintegrate, powering Iron Man suits, etc.  There is nothing in this solo that is especially exciting regarding his power usage.

I still wouldn't trade Gambit interacting with Nils, Fence, Pete Wisdom, Cece, Iceman, Karma, Polaris, Quicksilver or being King of Thieves, a trusted confidant in Liu's AXM and to X-23, or being recruited for Serval by Polaris.  Those represented new and potentially exciting relationships and roles for Gambit and showed that people valued him in some way.  This is just more of the same old tired stuff with Rogue.  I just give KT credit for writing it well but in the end, I'd much rather read people respecting and wanting Gambit on their team or to run their Guild than I would Rogue having to be convinced of Gambit's value. 

And therein lies the rub.  This solo was Rogue having to be convinced of Gambit's worth.  Asmus, Liu and David wrote people that barely knew him having more appreciation and respect for his worth than the woman who supposedly knows him best.  It is a well written story about how Rogue has taken Gambit for granted all these years.  But I get that for Romy fans, it reads differently so to each his or her own. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on April 05, 2018, 02:13:49 AM
Another entertaining issue by KT. Looking forward to how the story ends next month.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 05, 2018, 03:00:02 AM
Not sure what you mean by glory days.  Asmus had already dealt with Romy and all this solo did was regress him further back than where he was at the end of Asmus, David, and Liu simply because of what Soule wrote.  This solo isn't moving him forward so much as it is erasing all the development he received away from Rogue to put him back where he was decades ago.

By contrast, Asmus made Gambit King of Thieves and gave him back his full powers after he was resurrected.  Those are far more interesting developments than sticking him back with his old lady.

Gambit is not a better fighter.  All this solo proves is that he can beat weakened clones of Rogue and himself, some unknown villain that isn't really a fighter, simulations of the Avengers, and guys that weren't seriously fighting over a garter.  None of those things speaks to some great skill.  Not that Asmus had him taking on world beaters but Asmus certainly had more creative uses of Gambit's powers than this solo.  Rather than just blow up stuff, we had him making things disintegrate, powering Iron Man suits, etc.  There is nothing in this solo that is especially exciting regarding his power usage.

I still wouldn't trade Gambit interacting with Nils, Fence, Pete Wisdom, Cece, Iceman, Karma, Polaris, Quicksilver or being King of Thieves, a trusted confidant in Liu's AXM and to X-23, or being recruited for Serval by Polaris.  Those represented new and potentially exciting relationships and roles for Gambit and showed that people valued him in some way.  This is just more of the same old tired stuff with Rogue.  I just give KT credit for writing it well but in the end, I'd much rather read people respecting and wanting Gambit on their team or to run their Guild than I would Rogue having to be convinced of Gambit's value. 

And therein lies the rub.  This solo was Rogue having to be convinced of Gambit's worth.  Asmus, Liu and David wrote people that barely knew him having more appreciation and respect for his worth than the woman who supposedly knows him best.  It is a well written story about how Rogue has taken Gambit for granted all these years.  But I get that for Romy fans, it reads differently so to each his or her own. 


As glory days I meant Gambit at his best days. When he was skilled fighter, smart, dangerous etc.

Asmus didn`t resolve Romy. He just pushed them apart in kind way. They were still toxic with a huge baggage.
KT resolved most of this baggage.

By contrast, Asmus made Gambit King of Thieves and gave him back his full powers in 17 issues. That wasn`t made in 4 issues. I already told that I compared only first four Asmus issues vs KT`s first 4. It is not right to compare 4 issues vs 17 and I don`t understand why you are doing this.

Again you are compairing the wgole Asmus run. Gambit didn`t make more creative uses of his powers in first arc of Amsus solo then in R&G.

Gambit fight is R&G #3 with golems was great. Rogue was punched by golems. Gambit wasn`t. He was fast enough to dodge all attacks and kicking back. There are no better or even close Gambit fight to this in Asmus solo.

Again Iron-man suit was in issue 13 and not in first arc. 13 issues is almost 3 times more then R&G mini.

And again most characters that you mentioned were not used in first arc.
The whole runs vs 4 issues of mini comprasion as you are doing is not right.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 05, 2018, 08:46:40 AM
Keep in mind gang, its just opinion and we do not see everything the exact same way. Our connection is Gambit. :)

Comparing Asmus solo to KT's mini is apples vs oranges. Taking the first arc and putting up to the mini isn't exactly treating either book with any fairness.

The Asmus solo, took a character who was in bad shape, story-wise, character-wise and was in need of updating as much as Marvel was willing to allow, a reset of the status quo for Gambit and where ever his relationship was at that time which was no where.  It was a different thing.

The KT mini isn't an updating project for either character, its a concentrated story that focuses on one aspect of the two characters, their relationship. The only change to either character is where they will be at the end in their relationship. Perhaps a better place for other books down the road or something. I don't know.

These two concepts for story telling are completely different with different goals for the characters. 

The driving narrative is the difference.

There is only one issue left and only 20 pages for resolve, too much stuff not said. Guess we'll see how well it turns out.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 05, 2018, 09:16:47 AM

I still wouldn't trade Gambit interacting with Nils, Fence, Pete Wisdom, Cece, Iceman, Karma, Polaris, Quicksilver or being King of Thieves, a trusted confidant in Liu's AXM and to X-23, or being recruited for Serval by Polaris.  Those represented new and potentially exciting relationships and roles for Gambit and showed that people valued him in some way.  This is just more of the same old tired stuff with Rogue.  I just give KT credit for writing it well but in the end, I'd much rather read people respecting and wanting Gambit on their team or to run their Guild than I would Rogue having to be convinced of Gambit's value. 

And therein lies the rub.  This solo was Rogue having to be convinced of Gambit's worth.  Asmus, Liu and David wrote people that barely knew him having more appreciation and respect for his worth than the woman who supposedly knows him best.  It is a well written story about how Rogue has taken Gambit for granted all these years.  But I get that for Romy fans, it reads differently so to each his or her own. 

Agreed. Depending on how it ends, I worry Gambit will be regressed to waiting on Rogue, because .... I'm gonna call it now. She'll need "time". If putting the ball in her court is what happens, then move Gambit along. He should not be waiting for her. If I'm wrong, okay.

I want Gambit to be solid on his own without needing another character or for him used as a boost to another character.

The things that bothered me with the current issue. Rogue didn't know that her words hurt Gambit when it came to the Avengers. Really? Currently no words worth typing at this time to express what I think is wrong here with this. While the benefit of the doubt would tell me its possible, with trust being an issue for so long between them, she had to have known what she said would have been an issue for him. Instead, his own insecurities about self worth glosses it over. I'm so tired of those types of insecurities when it comes to Gambit.

Hey, if you are loving this book, love it, buy it, buy more than one copy. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 05, 2018, 09:33:39 AM

As glory days I meant Gambit at his best days. When he was skilled fighter, smart, dangerous etc.

Asmus didn`t resolve Romy. He just pushed them apart in kind way. They were still toxic with a huge baggage.
KT resolved most of this baggage.

By contrast, Asmus made Gambit King of Thieves and gave him back his full powers in 17 issues. That wasn`t made in 4 issues. I already told that I compared only first four Asmus issues vs KT`s first 4. It is not right to compare 4 issues vs 17 and I don`t understand why you are doing this.

Again you are compairing the wgole Asmus run. Gambit didn`t make more creative uses of his powers in first arc of Amsus solo then in R&G.

Gambit fight is R&G #3 with golems was great. Rogue was punched by golems. Gambit wasn`t. He was fast enough to dodge all attacks and kicking back. There are no better or even close Gambit fight to this in Asmus solo.

Again Iron-man suit was in issue 13 and not in first arc. 13 issues is almost 3 times more then R&G mini.

And again most characters that you mentioned were not used in first arc.
The whole runs vs 4 issues of mini comprasion as you are doing is not right.


As Neko said, Asmus and KT books were different hence why I don't know why you are trying to compare.  It would be like you reading the first 300 pages of a 1,000 page novel and then comparing it a full novel that was only 300 pages.  It is a silly comparison because the intent of the 300 page novel was to finish the story in 300 pages.  The intent of the 1,000 page novel was to finish the story over 1,000 pages so the first 300 pages are simply incomplete.  No one reviews novels this way so all you have done is set up a comparison that is rigged in KT's favor.  It is obvious that KT's work will have more packed into it because it is being told over a shorter time horizon over less pages.

With that aside, Gambit was smart and dangerous in Asmus' run.  He perhaps wasn't as great a fighter as his glory days but he certainly used his powers in smart and creative ways.  I also don't care that Gambit beat up weak golems of himself and Rogue.  They shouldn't be able to touch him because they are garbage.  They should be able to touch Rogue because she was never an agile fighter but rather a brawler.

Asmus also did resolve Romy as he had Gambit acknowledging their past love but moving on.  It was clear at the end of the solo that Rogue and Gambit were not together and it was fairly final.  Hence why in the years after the solo Gambit was perfectly content pursuing other characters.  It was only Charles Soule that completely ignored Asmus, Liu, and David's run and put Gambit back pining after Rogue. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 05, 2018, 09:52:35 AM
Agreed. Depending on how it ends, I worry Gambit will be regressed to waiting on Rogue, because .... I'm gonna call it now. She'll need "time". If putting the ball in her court is what happens, then move Gambit along.He should not be waiting for her. If I'm wrong, okay.

I want Gambit to be solid on his own without needing another character or for him used as a boost to another character.

The things that bothered me with the current issue. Rogue didn't know that her words hurt Gambit when it came to the Avengers. Really? Currently no words worth typing at this time to express what I think is wrong here with this. While the benefit of the doubt would tell me its possible, with trust being an issue for so long between them, she had to have known what she said would have been an issue for him. Instead, his own insecurities about self worth glosses it over. I'm so tired of those types of insecurities when it comes to Gambit.

Hey, if you are loving this book, love it, buy it, buy more than one copy. :)


The fundamnetal issue in their relationship is Rogue never seems to appreciate Gambit for what he is but rather he is in a constant state of trying to prove his worth to her.  That is tiring and ultimately only breeds contempt and resenment in the end.  The writers can force Gambit to not feel this resentment and contempt because he is fictional so in the end his fans feel it for him.

I am at the point where I just feel Rogue isn't worth it and is simply disloyal.  KT is a good story teller but the problem is not her writing, it is Rogue.  It is just a particular feature of Rogue that a part of her thinks Gambit doesnt deserve her.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 05, 2018, 10:49:40 AM

As Neko said, Asmus and KT books were different hence why I don't know why you are trying to compare.  It would be like you reading the first 300 pages of a 1,000 page novel and then comparing it a full novel that was only 300 pages.  It is a silly comparison because the intent of the 300 page novel was to finish the story in 300 pages.  The intent of the 1,000 page novel was to finish the story over 1,000 pages so the first 300 pages are simply incomplete.  No one reviews novels this way so all you have done is set up a comparison that is rigged in KT's favor.  It is obvious that KT's work will have more packed into it because it is being told over a shorter time horizon over less pages.

With that aside, Gambit was smart and dangerous in Asmus' run.  He perhaps wasn't as great a fighter as his glory days but he certainly used his powers in smart and creative ways.  I also don't care that Gambit beat up weak golems of himself and Rogue.  They shouldn't be able to touch him because they are garbage.  They should be able to touch Rogue because she was never an agile fighter but rather a brawler.

Asmus also did resolve Romy as he had Gambit acknowledging their past love but moving on.  It was clear at the end of the solo that Rogue and Gambit were not together and it was fairly final.  Hence why in the years after the solo Gambit was perfectly content pursuing other characters.  It was only Charles Soule that completely ignored Asmus, Liu, and David's run and put Gambit back pining after Rogue. 


Noone is setting up a comparison that is rigged in KT's favor. Relax. I loved Gambit by Asmus as much as you. His #1 is much better then R&G #1.


In both books Gambit is a main character and I can easily compare how he was written in them both.


Funny because it is exactly what happend. Golems were not able to touch him and were able to touch Rogue.


I told that Asmus pushed away them kindly but both characters stayed toxic. KT`s mini was planned to make them not so toxic to write and resolve the baggage. The same way as Asmus` solo was planned to reboot Gambit in some way from all crap.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 05, 2018, 11:17:44 AM
Okay, so I thought to jog my memory by re-listening to the podcast and:

I was thinking in ultimate terms of their powers, which is probably what KT didn't mean. She was probably just saying in general. Which as Dantay said, nobody at Marvel remembers, so I guess it doesn't matter anyway (?). Which sucks.
And yeah, the hosts both sound too similar. And annoying. (Sorry, I hate that nasally kind of voice.)
Again with the Gambit-as-coolness-burrito argument. I'm so tired of hearing it. Also tired of hearing about his "creepiness"--what people tend to forget is that women--including Rogue--are attracted to him, which makes a big difference. I'm so tired of people thinking of him as some sort of sleazy pickup artist.



You hit on a couple different things that annoy me about them. They tout themselves as loving everything X-Men, but apparently that line stops at Gambit, because they're so hypocritical sometimes when talking about him. I got sick of hearing them talk about how much of a douche he is and how he's just a creep. I read in a description for one of their episodes about how "Gambit ruins everything." Don't get me wrong, I try not to take him too seriously because there are some ridiculous aspects about him (like his costume, for example), but they're just unrelenting when bashing Gambit sometimes
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 05, 2018, 12:09:49 PM
Noone is setting up a comparison that is rigged in KT's favor. Relax. I loved Gambit by Asmus as much as you. His #1 is much better then R&G #1.

In both books Gambit is a main character and I can easily compare how he was written in them both.

Funny because it is exactly what happend. Golems were not able to touch him and were able to touch Rogue.

I told that Asmus pushed away them kindly but both characters stayed toxic. KT`s mini was planned to make them not so toxic to write and resolve the baggage. The same way as Asmus` solo was planned to reboot Gambit in some way from all crap.

But you aren't comparing how they were written in both books as you are ignoring over 75% of Asmus' run.  You are comparing 80% of KT's story with 25% of Asmus' story.  That is rigging.  Complete stories are compared to complete stories.  Doesn't really matter how many pages the stories are written.  Asmus' complete story has 17 chapters.  KT's has 5.

Both characters did not stay toxic.  Gambit was not toxic in Liu or David's run.  Rogue was living her life quite happily without Gambit in her books.

The toxicity was manufactured years after the fact by Soule. As a Gambit fan, I would have been perfectly content without this mini because there was no pressing need to resolve Romy.  It was done.  Romy fans just wanted to see them back together hence why a Romy fan that happens to be a writer pitched this story and ignored much of what Asmus, Liu, David and Rogue's writers wrote to focus on what Soule wrote.  Both Soule and KT are writing about angst that had been resolved years before just not to the liking of Romy fans.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 05, 2018, 12:17:06 PM
I compared first full arc of Asmus with unfinished first arc of KT.
Toxic as 2 characters together in one book ir story.
Number of issues does matter. You can easily compare just first arc or first issues.


Because you wanted them to be in separate books means nothing on quality of lame Astonishing or KT's book.
KT started from bad and developed into good.
Without AXM your argument may have sense. With Astonishing it don't work at all.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 05, 2018, 01:20:43 PM
The first full arc of Asmus' run was not a finished story.  Cich, Joelle, etc. all ended up in later arcs and the first arc was no different than reading the first 4 chapters of a book.  The book is obviously not over.  You would have a point if the first arc was self contained and if none of the elements in the first arc played a role in later arcs.  That obviously is not what happened as it is perfectly obvious the first arc was meant to set up the rest of the book.  Again, would you read a 300 page novel and then compare it to the first 300 pages of a 1,000 page novel?  That makes no sense Purp.  One is a finished story and the other isn't.

As for the toxic thing, I read years of stories in X-factor and Liu's AXM for which Gambit had moved on.  Those stories and those years of me reading it happened.  You and KT are acting like somehow a single issue in Soule's AXM suddenly means that the years of me reading Gambit and Rogue as free from each other are just my imagination.

KT didn't start from bad.  She simply cherry picked a single story albeit the most recent story and then acted like that single story from Soule outweighed all the years of stories from Liu and David.  If she had not written this book, most Gambit fans would have just dismissed Soule's crap as out of continuity bullsh*t because that is what it was.  KT had a right to start the book however she wanted but no Gambit was not toxic.  He was free of Rogue until Soule and KT decided to undo years of development.  Not a single issue like Soule.  But years of development.

Anywho, we are not going to see eye to eye on this.  I will end by saying this.  As a Gambit only fan, there was nothing toxic about Gambit until Soule and KT decided to write Gambit still pining after Rogue.  I prefer the Asmus, Liu, and David stories where Gambit is living a life that doesn't revolve around his begging Rogue to find him worthy of her.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 05, 2018, 05:13:05 PM
The first full arc of Asmus' run was not a finished story.  Cich, Joelle, etc. all ended up in later arcs and the first arc was no different than reading the first 4 chapters of a book.  The book is obviously not over.  You would have a point if the first arc was self contained and if none of the elements in the first arc played a role in later arcs.  That obviously is not what happened as it is perfectly obvious the first arc was meant to set up the rest of the book.  Again, would you read a 300 page novel and then compare it to the first 300 pages of a 1,000 page novel?  That makes no sense Purp.  One is a finished story and the other isn't.

As for the toxic thing, I read years of stories in X-factor and Liu's AXM for which Gambit had moved on.  Those stories and those years of me reading it happened.  You and KT are acting like somehow a single issue in Soule's AXM suddenly means that the years of me reading Gambit and Rogue as free from each other are just my imagination.

KT didn't start from bad.  She simply cherry picked a single story albeit the most recent story and then acted like that single story from Soule outweighed all the years of stories from Liu and David.  If she had not written this book, most Gambit fans would have just dismissed Soule's crap as out of continuity bullsh*t because that is what it was.  KT had a right to start the book however she wanted but no Gambit was not toxic.  He was free of Rogue until Soule and KT decided to undo years of development.  Not a single issue like Soule.  But years of development.

Anywho, we are not going to see eye to eye on this.  I will end by saying this.  As a Gambit only fan, there was nothing toxic about Gambit until Soule and KT decided to write Gambit still pining after Rogue.  I prefer the Asmus, Liu, and David stories where Gambit is living a life that doesn't revolve around his begging Rogue to find him worthy of her.




It is comics and not novels. There is a reason why ongoings are divided into arcs. You can compare any issue of comics to other issue. That is why every issue of comics has it`s own rating.


Once again I told that Gambit and Rogue were toxic together in book. Not that Gambit is toxic alone.
X-Factor`s Gambit may moved on. Liu`s Gambit was at the same time as Asmus` solo.


Not only Soule. Gambit wanted to kiss Rogue in UA by Duggan. Gambit was tricked by Rogue appearence in Civil War by Bunn. I think that was only 2 times thay were speaking and both times you can`t say that he was free.

I don`t agree about this but don`t want to continue to argue too.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 05, 2018, 05:15:02 PM
Neko, maybe it is some bad day for me but it is changing size of my text every time.
So I am editing every my post :-\
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 05, 2018, 06:37:43 PM

It is comics and not novels. There is a reason why ongoings are divided into arcs. You can compare any issue of comics to other issue. That is why every issue of comics has it`s own rating.

Once again I told that Gambit and Rogue were toxic together in book. Not that Gambit is toxic alone.
X-Factor`s Gambit may moved on. Liu`s Gambit was at the same time as Asmus` solo.

Not only Soule. Gambit wanted to kiss Rogue in UA by Duggan. Gambit was tricked by Rogue appearence in Civil War by Bunn. I think that was only 2 times thay were speaking and both times you can`t say that he was free.

I don`t agree about this but don`t want to continue to argue too.


The rating in a comic has nothing to do with whether the story is over or not.  Some arcs have stories that don't continue after the arc is over and other arcs have stories that obviously continue into later arcs.  Asmus' story had the latter.


I am not sure why you are comparing severals years worth of stories to forgettable cameos by Gambit.  Again, the point is it was not toxic.  Gambit had moved on and it was clear from reading Liu or David.  They wrote his character for years and Gambit was not pining for Rogue.  Years of development trumps some writer not doing their research and having Gambit pining for Rogue all of a sudden.  It was out of continuity.  Further, the Duggan appearance had Rogue pining for Gambit first as she tried to kiss Red Skull Gambit.  That is not the same as the crap Soule wrote where Gambit is the one begging.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 05, 2018, 07:04:24 PM
Neko, maybe it is some bad day for me but it is changing size of my text every time.
So I am editing every my post :-\

Not sure why ..... maybe because of using a mobile device ... maybe not .... I don't know. Do my best to fix it as I go. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 05, 2018, 07:20:14 PM

The rating in a comic has nothing to do with whether the story is over or not.  Some arcs have stories that don't continue after the arc is over and other arcs have stories that obviously continue into later arcs.  Asmus' story had the latter.


I am not sure why you are comparing severals years worth of stories to forgettable cameos by Gambit.  Again, the point is it was not toxic.  Gambit had moved on and it was clear from reading Liu or David.  They wrote his character for years and Gambit was not pining for Rogue.  Years of development trumps some writer not doing their research and having Gambit pining for Rogue all of a sudden.  It was out of continuity.  Further, the Duggan appearance had Rogue pining for Gambit first as she tried to kiss Red Skull Gambit.  That is not the same as the crap Soule wrote where Gambit is the one begging.


As I posted before Liu`s Astonishing was at the same time as Asmus solo. Your severals years worth of stories is only X-Factor.

Forgettable cameos are about Rogue and Gambit. That is why I used them. You told that Gambit was free before Soule. I showed that he wasn`t in any scene where was Rogue even with small cameo.
Rogue wanted to kiss Red Skull Gambit. She rejected real Gambit. Who wasn`t free and wanted to kiss her.


Don`t know why you are using X-Factor, Astonishing and other books because I compared only Asmus solo and KT`s mini.
You can compare any issue of book and see how much writer did with character and how he used him in one issue.
The same thing with arc and it don`t matter if story ended or not.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 05, 2018, 07:21:34 PM
Not sure why ..... maybe because of using a mobile device ... maybe not .... I don't know. Do my best to fix it as I go. :)


Thanks :)  It changes from mobile or laptop. Don`t matter if I copy or writing new text either.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 05, 2018, 07:46:31 PM
Thanks :)  It changes from mobile or laptop. Don`t matter if I copy or writing new text either.

Yeah, I don't know what it could be, hard to troubleshoot too. Kind of used to it so, we'll plug along. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 05, 2018, 08:31:53 PM

As I posted before Liu`s Astonishing was at the same time as Asmus solo. Your severals years worth of stories is only X-Factor.

Forgettable cameos are about Rogue and Gambit. That is why I used them. You told that Gambit was free before Soule. I showed that he wasn`t in any scene where was Rogue even with small cameo.
Rogue wanted to kiss Red Skull Gambit. She rejected real Gambit. Who wasn`t free and wanted to kiss her.

Don`t know why you are using X-Factor, Astonishing and other books because I compared only Asmus solo and KT`s mini.
You can compare any issue of book and see how much writer did with character and how he used him in one issue.
The same thing with arc and it don`t matter if story ended or not.


It was years worth of stories because Asmus, Liu, and David wrote Gambit not pining after Rogue literally for years.  Liu was from March 2012 to October 2013.  The solo was August 2012 to September 2013.  X-factor was January 2014 to January 2015.  So all told that is 2.5 of stories where Gambit is not pining after Rogue.


Gambit was not pining after Rogue in Duggan's run.  Rogue tried to kiss him first and didn't know it was not Gambit.  Rogue then told Gambit about it which is the only reason he then tried to kiss her.  That is not pining.  Nor is there anything toxic about it.  Rogue was just embarrassed that Red Skull fooled her but the point is her intent was to pursue him first.


In the end, I don't think there was anything there to fix.  Soule and KT just decided to put Gambit back to pining after Rogue but I read Gambit for 2.5 years where that was not the case and the crap Soule wrote that KT picked up on doesn't change the fact I enjoyed those stories.  KT is a good story teller but she began her story based on out of continuity bull that Soule wrote.  This is not hindsight either because many Gambit fans commented on how bull Soule's Gambit was when the story came out. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 05, 2018, 08:36:38 PM
Anywho no hard feelings.  On the bright side, this debate has made me decide to reread the solo and Liu's run just so I can be reminded what it is like to read Gambit as his own man.  Hopefully X-men Red delivers next week.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on April 05, 2018, 09:35:47 PM
But you aren't comparing how they were written in both books as you are ignoring over 75% of Asmus' run.  You are comparing 80% of KT's story with 25% of Asmus' story.  That is rigging.  Complete stories are compared to complete stories.  Doesn't really matter how many pages the stories are written.  Asmus' complete story has 17 chapters.  KT's has 5.

Both characters did not stay toxic.  Gambit was not toxic in Liu or David's run.  Rogue was living her life quite happily without Gambit in her books.

The toxicity was manufactured years after the fact by Soule. As a Gambit fan, I would have been perfectly content without this mini because there was no pressing need to resolve Romy.  It was done.  Romy fans just wanted to see them back together hence why a Romy fan that happens to be a writer pitched this story and ignored much of what Asmus, Liu, David and Rogue's writers wrote to focus on what Soule wrote.  Both Soule and KT are writing about angst that had been resolved years before just not to the liking of Romy fans.


I think Gambit was still in a mess for xfactor and asmus solo though asmus tried to clean it up a bi
t. But lets be real he litterally ditched his new love interest for rogue in the lead up to her death. And in xfactor he was drinking and moonlighting aimlessly before joining polaris never mind the tixic interactions with woman ie snows wife and the polaris smack down. Litterally felt like he was just continuously reboundong trying to fill a void. Liu is the only one who really released him a bit and tried to shatter those ties but she hated romy and loved gambit.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 06, 2018, 02:56:05 AM

It was years worth of stories because Asmus, Liu, and David wrote Gambit not pining after Rogue literally for years.  Liu was from March 2012 to October 2013.  The solo was August 2012 to September 2013.  X-factor was January 2014 to January 2015.  So all told that is 2.5 of stories where Gambit is not pining after Rogue.


Gambit was not pining after Rogue in Duggan's run.  Rogue tried to kiss him first and didn't know it was not Gambit.  Rogue then told Gambit about it which is the only reason he then tried to kiss her.  That is not pining.  Nor is there anything toxic about it.  Rogue was just embarrassed that Red Skull fooled her but the point is her intent was to pursue him first.


In the end, I don't think there was anything there to fix.  Soule and KT just decided to put Gambit back to pining after Rogue but I read Gambit for 2.5 years where that was not the case and the crap Soule wrote that KT picked up on doesn't change the fact I enjoyed those stories.  KT is a good story teller but she began her story based on out of continuity bull that Soule wrote.  This is not hindsight either because many Gambit fans commented on how bull Soule's Gambit was when the story came out.


What are you trying to achieve with this and with changing topic? I was talking about Asmus solo and KT`s mini. Definetely not about all this.


You don`t like Gambit and Rogue together. It is normal.
So what you are trying to achieve? To show that Gambit and Rogue shouldn`t be together? Or Gambit shouldn`t be pinning for Rogue?


That dialogue is completely off topic that I wrote.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 06, 2018, 03:04:19 AM
Funny that before this mini started the voting results were "Neither, just a fun adventure" as main. I also voted for this.


Now winning choice is "To explore and solidify their relationship".
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 06, 2018, 08:37:18 AM

I think Gambit was still in a mess for xfactor and asmus solo though asmus tried to clean it up a bi
t. But lets be real he litterally ditched his new love interest for rogue in the lead up to her death. And in xfactor he was drinking and moonlighting aimlessly before joining polaris never mind the tixic interactions with woman ie snows wife and the polaris smack down. Litterally felt like he was just continuously reboundong trying to fill a void. Liu is the only one who really released him a bit and tried to shatter those ties but she hated romy and loved gambit.


Not sure what you are referring too.  His drinking in X-factor had nothing to do with Rogue.  It had to do with Wolverine kicking him out of the school because he tried to steal from Tony Stark.  It surprised him because Wolverine at the end of Asmus solo had said he accepted Gambit for what he was.

Also sleeping with women is what ladies men are supposed to do.  Not sure how that is toxic.  It just turned out to be Snow's wife.  As for Polaris, he caught her off guard and the book was cancelled before the relationship could be developed. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 06, 2018, 08:44:37 AM

What are you trying to achieve with this and with changing topic? I was talking about Asmus solo and KT`s mini. Definetely not about all this.


You don`t like Gambit and Rogue together. It is normal.
So what you are trying to achieve? To show that Gambit and Rogue shouldn`t be together? Or Gambit shouldn`t be pinning for Rogue?


That dialogue is completely off topic that I wrote.


It is not off topic.  You said things were toxic so I am explaining that we had 2.5 years of Gambit not being concerned with Rogue.  That is not toxic.  Yes I dont like Romy.  You do.  However I dont think you can just rewrite history and pretend that some out of continuity crap by Soule and some dumb cameo by Duggan where Rogue told him she tried to kiss him suddenly means things were toxic.

Likewise Rogue certainly didn't give a crap about Gambit.  She was happy messing around with Storm and Deadpool.  There is no indication in the years before Duggan or Soule that she gave a single crap about Gambit.  And Duggan certainly didnt have her worried about Gambit for long as again she was with Deadpool.  It is clear he had no intention of anything with Gambit taking place. 

So nothing was toxic.  All that happened is a Romy fan decided to write a story to put them together.  The story was not necessary nor was the relationship toxic beforehand.  It was largely just over.

I responded because I felt that instead of just celebrating this book which I agreed was great and well written, your posts seemd to veer off into saying the 2.5 plus years that came before was somehow lesser or toxic simply because Gambit wasn't with Rogue.  That may have not been your intent but that was how it came off to me. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 06, 2018, 09:08:06 AM

... It had to do with Wolverine kicking him out of the school because he tried to steal from Tony Stark.  It surprised him because Wolverine at the end of Asmus solo had said he accepted Gambit for what he was.

Also sleeping with women is what ladies men are supposed to do.  Not sure how that is toxic.  It just turned out to be Snow's wife.  As for Polaris, he caught her off guard and the book was cancelled before the relationship could be developed.


I dont think he was trying to steal from Stark. I think the system he broke into was upgraded by Stark and Wolverine was contacted instead of the police when Gambit was detected. The house Gambit broke into was a "no-one" character. Yeah, PAD wrote the Polaris reaction as a reflect, not an intention. I think her expression and words after showed that it wasn't the act more than it being a total surprise... probably not the greatest idea to scare someone that's had mental issues in the past. But who hasnt a mental break in the X-Men these days? No, seriously, who hasn't gone nuts yet in the X-Men? Doop?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 06, 2018, 09:53:35 AM

It is not off topic.  You said things were toxic so I am explaining that we had 2.5 years of Gambit not being concerned with Rogue.  That is not toxic.  Yes I dont like Romy.  You do.  However I dont think you can just rewrite history and pretend that some out of continuity crap by Soule and some dumb cameo by Duggan where Rogue told him she tried to kiss him suddenly means things were toxic.

Likewise Rogue certainly didn't give a crap about Gambit.  She was happy messing around with Storm and Deadpool.  There is no indication in the years before Duggan or Soule that she gave a single crap about Gambit.  And Duggan certainly didnt have her worried about Gambit for long as again she was with Deadpool.  It is clear he had no intention of anything with Gambit taking place. 

So nothing was toxic.  All that happened is a Romy fan decided to write a story to put them together.  The story was not necessary nor was the relationship toxic beforehand.  It was largely just over.

I responded because I felt that instead of just celebrating this book which I agreed was great and well written, your posts seemd to veer off into saying the 2.5 plus years that came before was somehow lesser or toxic simply because Gambit wasn't with Rogue.  That may have not been your intent but that was how it came off to me.



Still don`t agree. Gambit and Rogue together were toxic characters and still are. A lot of bad stories stayed unresolved and untold.

Do you remeber how most Gambit fans reacted when they both were announced for Astonishing? There were a lot of hate. Almost the same was with R&G announcement.

I am sure KT changed at least some percent of Romy haters into more postitive or at least made them more open for Gambit and Rogue in one book.

There still will be a lot of angey posts if they will be together on one next team. Even if they wouldn`t be a couple.

 2.5 years of Gambit not being concerned with Rogue is just 2.5 years with Gambit and Rogue in separate books and stories.


Every time when even in cameo they were near, romance or drama were there.

With the same logic Gambit and Storm are not friends because they are for yeards in separate books and have only small friend cameos.
 

Rogue had her life. Gambit has his. It don`t mean that he/she don`t have some feelings for each other. Or that fellings won`t return when they will met again.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 06, 2018, 10:38:30 AM

I dont think he was trying to steal from Stark. I think the system he broke into was upgraded by Stark and Wolverine was contacted instead of the police when Gambit was detected. The house Gambit broke into was a "no-one" character. Yeah, PAD wrote the Polaris reaction as a reflect, not an intention. I think her expression and words after showed that it wasn't the act more than it being a total surprise... probably not the greatest idea to scare someone that's had mental issues in the past. But who hasnt a mental break in the X-Men these days? No, seriously, who hasn't gone nuts yet in the X-Men? Doop?


Yeah you are right about the Stark thing.  My point is it really had nothing to do with Rogue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 06, 2018, 11:34:39 AM

Still don`t agree. Gambit and Rogue together were toxic characters and still are. A lot of bad stories stayed unresolved and untold.

Do you remeber how most Gambit fans reacted when they both were announced for Astonishing? There were a lot of hate. Almost the same was with R&G announcement.

I am sure KT changed at least some percent of Romy haters into more postitive or at least made them more open for Gambit and Rogue in one book.

There still will be a lot of angey posts if they will be together on one next team. Even if they wouldn`t be a couple.

 2.5 years of Gambit not being concerned with Rogue is just 2.5 years with Gambit and Rogue in separate books and stories.

Every time when even in cameo they were near, romance or drama were there.

With the same logic Gambit and Storm are not friends because they are for yeards in separate books and have only small friend cameos.
 
Rogue had her life. Gambit has his. It don`t mean that he/she don`t have some feelings for each other. Or that fellings won`t return when they will met again.


Perhaps we are arguing semantics.  My point is there was no reason for them to have to resolve their stuff.  They could have gone on being separated and things were perfectly fine that way.  The Asmus solo allowed them to go their separate ways as adults.  Lazy writers (Duggan, Soule) that can't think of anything better to write just didn't allow them to remain adults about it.  The only reason they needed to resolve anything is because KT wants them to get back together.  Otherwise, people end relationships with things left unsaid all the time.  There is nothing toxic about it.  It just isn't worth the energy.

So again all that happened here is that a Romy fan got a chance to write this book and since she wanted to have them screw or get back together, she rightfully attempted to deal with some of their issues.  If there were no plans for them to be together then Gambit and Rogue could have easily continued as they were and simply be adults when they interacted as Asmus wrote them. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 06, 2018, 03:46:44 PM

Perhaps we are arguing semantics.  My point is there was no reason for them to have to resolve their stuff.  They could have gone on being separated and things were perfectly fine that way.  The Asmus solo allowed them to go their separate ways as adults.  Lazy writers (Duggan, Soule) that can't think of anything better to write just didn't allow them to remain adults about it.  The only reason they needed to resolve anything is because KT wants them to get back together.  Otherwise, people end relationships with things left unsaid all the time.  There is nothing toxic about it.  It just isn't worth the energy.

So again all that happened here is that a Romy fan got a chance to write this book and since she wanted to have them screw or get back together, she rightfully attempted to deal with some of their issues.  If there were no plans for them to be together then Gambit and Rogue could have easily continued as they were and simply be adults when they interacted as Asmus wrote them. 


Gambit and Rouge is one of the most iconic couples in comics. There is a reason for them to solve their stuff because a lot of people hated Carrey's Legacy and hated them both together as friends or couple after it. Some people even stopped reading comics after that.


You don't like them but Rogue is Gambit's closest character. They has the most stories together. So when they together in one book or story they must be exciting together. People need to want more of their adventures. As couple or as friends.


This is exactly what KT do with her mini.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 06, 2018, 05:28:32 PM

Gambit and Rouge is one of the most iconic couples in comics. There is a reason for them to solve their stuff because a lot of people hated Carrey's Legacy and hated them both together as friends or couple after it. Some people even stopped reading comics after that.

You don't like them but Rogue is Gambit's closest character. They has the most stories together. So when they together in one book or story they must be exciting together. People need to want more of their adventures. As couple or as friends.

This is exactly what KT do with her mini.


There was nothing to solve as friends as we saw them as friends at the end of Asmus.  The only thing that needed solving is if you want to make them lovers which is why KT is addressing this.


And the Asmus solo sold more than this mini so Gambit is perfectly fine without Rogue.  Some fans obviously want them together but it isn't as much as people think as that is clear from the sales or lack thereof. 


This is not to say they are no iconic as I would agree with that even as a Romy hater but they are not required to be together as friends or lovers in order for the characters to work.  They are just fine without each other.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on April 06, 2018, 05:36:18 PM
I might be in the minority, but I prefer Gambit solo and not part of a couple
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 06, 2018, 05:39:17 PM
I might be in the minority, but I prefer Gambit solo and not part of a couple


I don't think you're in the minority in thinking that (here at least). I do too - it's fun seeing him do his own thing. I just also like him with Rogue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 07, 2018, 02:38:23 AM

There was nothing to solve as friends as we saw them as friends at the end of Asmus.  The only thing that needed solving is if you want to make them lovers which is why KT is addressing this.


And the Asmus solo sold more than this mini so Gambit is perfectly fine without Rogue.  Some fans obviously want them together but it isn't as much as people think as that is clear from the sales or lack thereof. 


This is not to say they are no iconic as I would agree with that even as a Romy hater but they are not required to be together as friends or lovers in order for the characters to work.  They are just fine without each other.


I never told that Romy should sell more then Gambit. Or that Gambit is not fine on his own or without Rogue.


You are changing topic again.


At this point I don't see why we need to continue this conversation. It is nothing from topic I started and just Gambit vs Romy.


You are forgetting that we are Gambit fans here. I would take good Gambit solo over good Romy solo always.


They were tixic characters. They together creted a lot of hate from fans when they were in one book. This thing should have been changed. KT's book was created for this.


We have completely different opinion on this. I am nit interested to change yours and you want be able to change mine.


If you want to add smth more to this post then ok.
After that I hope we will continue to celebrate R&G #4 because it was a very good book.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: AeroSennin on April 07, 2018, 05:57:31 AM

Not sure what you are referring too.  His drinking in X-factor had nothing to do with Rogue.  It had to do with Wolverine kicking him out of the school because he tried to steal from Tony Stark.  It surprised him because Wolverine at the end of Asmus solo had said he accepted Gambit for what he was.

Also sleeping with women is what ladies men are supposed to do.  Not sure how that is toxic.  It just turned out to be Snow's wife.  As for Polaris, he caught her off guard and the book was cancelled before the relationship could be developed.


I feel his drinking was an extension of hisblife still falling apart after asmus solo. The status quo hadnt changed he was lost and alone he litterally followed polaris cause he had zip...... the snows wife thing was terrible as was what happened to him and i doublt gambolaris was going to fly it just felt like a good way to get gambit alapped it was honestly terrible for a man who is supposed to be smart about woman. It started feeling like a running gag after the danger kiss he was just messy and desperate... the highpoint of that series was his back and forth with quicksilver. Going back through it with history leaves him looking desperate to dill a hole of something he hasnt dealt with. Kindnof what i amntrting to express. Maybe not so well.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 07, 2018, 09:05:21 AM
I might be in the minority, but I prefer Gambit solo and not part of a couple

Me too.


I don't think you're in the minority in thinking that (here at least). I do too - it's fun seeing him do his own thing. I just also like him with Rogue.

I can't say that ... I don't like Rogue but I get people who do though, but there isn't much to convince me she is a character worth investing in.

I would rather read Gambit on his own.

This whole mini has glossed Rogue's faults over and amplified Gambit's. It sits poorly with me. I don't care if there was creative uses to his powers or hers. She still has not done the one thing I would want from her character, and that is on the writer.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 07, 2018, 10:42:35 AM

I never told that Romy should sell more then Gambit. Or that Gambit is not fine on his own or without Rogue.

You are changing topic again.

At this point I don't see why we need to continue this conversation. It is nothing from topic I started and just Gambit vs Romy.

You are forgetting that we are Gambit fans here. I would take good Gambit solo over good Romy solo always.

They were tixic characters. They together creted a lot of hate from fans when they were in one book. This thing should have been changed. KT's book was created for this.

We have completely different opinion on this. I am nit interested to change yours and you want be able to change mine.

If you want to add smth more to this post then ok.
After that I hope we will continue to celebrate R&G #4 because it was a very good book.

They create a lot of hate from fans when they are in one book not because they are toxic characters but because most of their writers are garbage.  They were not toxic in Asmus.  They were not even toxic at the end of Legacy as Carey made it clear that Gambit would leave her alone and let Rogue come back to her.  So the issue I have with your statement is they could have been written perfectly fine together as friends or apart if writers had simply left things as Carey, Asmus, had written.  Liu and David simply followed that formula while people like Duggan and Soule did not.

If you want to claim they are toxic, show me the convo where Gambit says he was lying about what he said in Legacy?  Show me the convo where he said he was full of sh*t regarding what he said at the end of Asmus?  No such story exists.  This sudden pining for Rogue or even Rogue wanting to kiss Red Skull Gambit was completely pulled out of thin air and simply is not supported by anything that happened in Legacy or the solo. 

In short, KT based her book on a false premise.  A false premise she did not create but a false premise she is clearly knowledgeable enough to realize exists because she read Legacy and the solo so she knows nothing Duggan and Soule wrote is supported by what Carey and Asmus wrote.  She simply did a beautiful job with that false premise but in effect, her story is based on a lie.  Gambit and Rogue were not toxic.  The were not pining for each other and Asmus proved they could handle things with no hard feelings. 

The point about sales is that while I agree they are iconic, that status is exaggerated.  If they were as iconic as Romy fans believe the book simply would have sold more and wouldn't have had sales that completely plummeted after the first issue.  That plummet is evidence of what I am saying.  I
personally know a few Gambit fans who read the solo, Liu, and David and were completely shocked by what they read in issue 1.  Why?  Because the casual Gambit fan isn't picking up dumb cameos like Duggan and they aren't reading books where it is clear Gambit is not a focus.  So they read 1 wondering how the f did the same Gambit who said what he said to Rogue at the end of Asmus and was trying to get with Cece and Polaris is suddenly back to begging Rogue for some a** in a way that borders on sexual harassment.  Casual fans simply don't rate cameos and awful characterization as highly as you or KT did and quite frankly many of them bailed long before KT was able to turn this around.  That was her fatal mistake.  Issue 1 pretty much ruined the experience for a lot of people because again, the premise of issue 1 is a lie and runs counter to years of development.  All because she decided to focus on garbage Gambit appearances in Duggan and Soule.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 07, 2018, 11:47:32 AM

I feel his drinking was an extension of hisblife still falling apart after asmus solo. The status quo hadnt changed he was lost and alone he litterally followed polaris cause he had zip...... the snows wife thing was terrible as was what happened to him and i doublt gambolaris was going to fly it just felt like a good way to get gambit alapped it was honestly terrible for a man who is supposed to be smart about woman. It started feeling like a running gag after the danger kiss he was just messy and desperate... the highpoint of that series was his back and forth with quicksilver. Going back through it with history leaves him looking desperate to dill a hole of something he hasnt dealt with. Kindnof what i amntrting to express. Maybe not so well.

His life wasn't falling apart after the solo.  He resolved things with Rogue, was accepted as a person that would be there when the school needs him, and was elected leader of the Thieves Guild.  His life was going fine.  All that happened is David started X-factor by having Wolverine freaking out about something he pretty much told Gambit he wouldn't freak out about at the end of Asmus.  David just did that to set up a reason for him to join X-factor.

He didn't follow Polaris because he had zip as he in fact still had the Thieves Guild.  He also still had the school if he wanted it as Wolverine simply gave him an ultimatum.  He had to choose the school or the Thieves Guild.  Since he wanted to be a thief and hero, he chose Polaris instead.  So not sure what mess you see.  It is pretty absurd to suggest a guy with 3 job offers on the table is falling about.  He simply took the offer that allowed him to do the two jobs he liked (ie Thieves Guild and a hero job).  Even his alleged drinking is exaggerated.  He was not drunk.  He had a few drinks and then roughed up some people who were saying New Orleans deserved Hurricane Katrina.  In the coffee shop after when he is talking to Polaris, he had no hint of a hangover or anything.  He simply was a guy that got yelled at by Wolverine and decided to have a few drinks and rough up some a**holes to blow off steam.

There was nothing wrong about the Snow thing.  He had sex with a consenting adult.  I suspect that happens fairly regularly for a guy that is single and supposed to be a ladies man.  As for the Polaris thing, it really was no different than how he started things with Rogue.  In case you didn't notice, he hits on his teammates.  Par for the course. 

Also the Danger kiss really has nothing to do with what we are discussing.  You are pretty much reimagining the whole premise of the solo and X-factor to fit this tired narrative that his life was a mess and he someone needed Rogue.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 07, 2018, 01:51:59 PM
They create a lot of hate from fans when they are in one book not because they are toxic characters but because most of their writers are garbage.  They were not toxic in Asmus.  They were not even toxic at the end of Legacy as Carey made it clear that Gambit would leave her alone and let Rogue come back to her.  So the issue I have with your statement is they could have been written perfectly fine together as friends or apart if writers had simply left things as Carey, Asmus, had written.  Liu and David simply followed that formula while people like Duggan and Soule did not.

If you want to claim they are toxic, show me the convo where Gambit says he was lying about what he said in Legacy?  Show me the convo where he said he was full of sh*t regarding what he said at the end of Asmus?  No such story exists.  This sudden pining for Rogue or even Rogue wanting to kiss Red Skull Gambit was completely pulled out of thin air and simply is not supported by anything that happened in Legacy or the solo. 

In short, KT based her book on a false premise.  A false premise she did not create but a false premise she is clearly knowledgeable enough to realize exists because she read Legacy and the solo so she knows nothing Duggan and Soule wrote is supported by what Carey and Asmus wrote.  She simply did a beautiful job with that false premise but in effect, her story is based on a lie.  Gambit and Rogue were not toxic.  The were not pining for each other and Asmus proved they could handle things with no hard feelings. 

The point about sales is that while I agree they are iconic, that status is exaggerated.  If they were as iconic as Romy fans believe the book simply would have sold more and wouldn't have had sales that completely plummeted after the first issue.  That plummet is evidence of what I am saying.  I
personally know a few Gambit fans who read the solo, Liu, and David and were completely shocked by what they read in issue 1.  Why?  Because the casual Gambit fan isn't picking up dumb cameos like Duggan and they aren't reading books where it is clear Gambit is not a focus.  So they read 1 wondering how the f did the same Gambit who said what he said to Rogue at the end of Asmus and was trying to get with Cece and Polaris is suddenly back to begging Rogue for some a** in a way that borders on sexual harassment.  Casual fans simply don't rate cameos and awful characterization as highly as you or KT did and quite frankly many of them bailed long before KT was able to turn this around.  That was her fatal mistake.  Issue 1 pretty much ruined the experience for a lot of people because again, the premise of issue 1 is a lie and runs counter to years of development.  All because she decided to focus on garbage Gambit appearances in Duggan and Soule.


It is so cool that yoy know what books should be ignored and what shouldn't be when you are writing #1 for new book. Cameo and story is s*** so it shouldn't be used or must be ignored. With the same logic writers should ignor all stories that they didn't like like it never happend.


They were toxic in Asmus. Some readers dropped third arc because Rogue was in it. The same way you was creating hater posts at cbr when R&G was announced 3 months before even #1. I don't remeber really but I think your posts about Astonishing wasn't when Rogue was announced either.


About sales I can't say because I don't know how it works. Marvel created just 38k and it was outsold and went to second printing. Should it be better? Definitely. But I am sure that if Gambit and Rogue were not written as crap before then sales would be better. End if they were not toxic then posters would be not writing hater posts and jusr tried this book.


I am not going to look for something to show you. I told you before that I am not interested in this. They were toxic before R&G. Now not so much but still are.


If you don't think that they are toxic then I am happy to see when you won't continue to make negative posts if they will be announced for one new team book.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 07, 2018, 02:01:01 PM
I think I should have intervened a few pages ago. Lets agree to disagree and move on.



Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 07, 2018, 03:27:12 PM
Edit - Sorry only saw Neko's post after responding so removed the bulk of my post.

I will just end by saying the decline in sales from 1 to 2 is proof she should have understood that the cameo and Soule was out of continuity stuff that people did not want to read.  Writers ignore stuff they don't like all the time as KT largely ignored 2.5 years of stories to hang her hat on cameos and Soule.  Continuity is the whole history not the most recent story.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 07, 2018, 03:45:24 PM
All good guys.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 07, 2018, 11:41:19 PM
So let's talk about Bishop's fabulous perm. I mean, man. Was that hair permy! Or was it more of a Jerry curl? I got a hint of nwa Ice Cube with a touch of De Barge.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on April 07, 2018, 11:57:56 PM
So let's talk about Bishop's fabulous perm. I mean, man. Was that hair permy! Or was it more of a Jerry curl? I got a hint of nwa Ice Cube with a touch of De Barge.

Yes! I was trying to think who he reminded me of and you nailed it.

Forgot to say before that I liked the part about Guido.

Rogue’s dress was bad then and remains so.

Jean’s big hair. I forget that that was still a trend into the 90s.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 08, 2018, 10:30:06 AM
Yes! I was trying to think who he reminded me of and you nailed it.

Forgot to say before that I liked the part about Guido.

Rogue’s dress was bad then and remains so.

Jean’s big hair. I forget that that was still a trend into the 90s.


Yeah, I love how 90s that entire section was. Bishop's gone through a lot of hairstyles throughout the years.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 08, 2018, 03:22:51 PM
Did Bishop ever do a mohawk haircut? Did he do no hair thing or am I thinking of another character?

I will say, I would want Gambit's hair to wild, don't need a ponytail but he'd probably look good with a manbun.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on April 08, 2018, 05:24:55 PM
I think he had a manbun in the Asmus solo, during one of the Rogue scenes...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 08, 2018, 05:54:55 PM
I know Gambit had a manbun in the solo, its why I mentioned it.  ;)

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on April 08, 2018, 06:17:14 PM
I thought the man bun was in the series with Storm.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 08, 2018, 06:45:05 PM
Did Bishop ever do a mohawk haircut? Did he do no hair thing or am I thinking of another character?

I will say, I would want Gambit's hair to wild, don't need a ponytail but he'd probably look good with a manbun.


From my recollection he had a curly perm, a low cut (long time) sometimes bald and then dreads.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 08, 2018, 06:45:37 PM
Re: Gambit's man bun.

Oh man, I don't know now. I don't know why I think in Asmus solo .... you're gonna make me grab my trades and look! LMAO

It could have been in the Storm series too.

Well, maybe Dantay will come to the rescue on this. LOL
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on April 08, 2018, 06:55:51 PM
I liked bishop's bald with a goatee look and the dreads the best.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on April 08, 2018, 06:56:13 PM
See Don’s icon? It’s a bit too short to do a bun.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on April 08, 2018, 07:13:54 PM
Bishop is best clean cut or in dreds.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: andresa on April 08, 2018, 07:18:29 PM
Gambit #17
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: andresa on April 08, 2018, 07:22:43 PM
Didn't remember this one. So forgettable.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on April 08, 2018, 07:29:44 PM
I never noticed that! Thanks!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Dantay on April 08, 2018, 07:42:57 PM
Re: Gambit's man bun.

Oh man, I don't know now. I don't know why I think in Asmus solo .... you're gonna make me grab my trades and look! LMAO

It could have been in the Storm series too.

Well, maybe Dantay will come to the rescue on this. LOL

Bishop started with a mullet then went shaved, in his ongoing and return set after UXM 348 he had dreads, then in XXM he had long straight hair then shaved again then longish corn rolls depending on the artist. Gambit always had long hair, length depended on the artist, for example in UXM 337 his hair is really long probably the longest its ever been drawn,apart from his long ass pony tail in x-men 4 during the basketball game and 8 the pie issue, UXM 334 is another time i can think of off the top of my head that he had it tied in a ponytail, during his first ongoing it was usually tied up in a ponytail with the headsock on, issue 16 & 17 of Asmus run he had a man bun as well as Storm issue 9, also in Gambit Origins his head is shaved for the brain surgery Sinister is about to perform
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 08, 2018, 08:38:11 PM
 Thanks andresa for the images. Thanks Dantay! I knew you'd come through.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 08, 2018, 10:29:37 PM
Bishop started with a mullet then went shaved, in his ongoing and return set after UXM 348 he had dreads, then in XXM he had long straight hair then shaved again then longish corn rolls depending on the artist. Gambit always had long hair, length depended on the artist, for example in UXM 337 his hair is really long probably the longest its ever been drawn,apart from his long ass pony tail in x-men 4 during the basketball game and 8 the pie issue, UXM 334 is another time i can think of off the top of my head that he had it tied in a ponytail, during his first ongoing it was usually tied up in a ponytail with the headsock on, issue 16 & 17 of Asmus run he had a man bun as well as Storm issue 9, also in Gambit Origins his head is shaved for the brain surgery Sinister is about to perform


...what the... How... Where the @&## do you store all this? Your brain doesn't work like normal brains. It is magnificent and needs to be preserved for future generations of guild members.


Purp. Get the chainsaw.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on April 08, 2018, 11:21:13 PM
He's probably memorized everything, including page numbers, letters pages and ads.

It's downright *sunglasses on* uncanny.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 09, 2018, 12:43:37 AM
We love him for it too.  :gambit:
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 09, 2018, 01:47:10 AM

...what the... How... Where the @&## do you store all this? Your brain doesn't work like normal brains. It is magnificent and needs to be preserved for future generations of guild members.


Purp. Get the chainsaw.


Ahah, on ny way ;D


Dantay is like Witness in flesh and blood :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Dantay on April 09, 2018, 10:05:05 AM

...what the... How... Where the @&## do you store all this? Your brain doesn't work like normal brains. It is magnificent and needs to be preserved for future generations of guild members.


Purp. Get the chainsaw.

LMAO i know its weird if only i had a memory like this for other things in life like science or math haha its funny too cause i remember the stuff from the 90's much easier than the comics of the last 16 years that arnt Gambit solos or minis/one shots. Its all because i re read the comics over and over again, now i havent re read my entire collection in a few years but funny enough i did happen to read that Storm issue about a month ago.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 09, 2018, 04:55:22 PM
R&G 5


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DaXmPlfUwAE7c8q.jpg)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 12, 2018, 08:45:38 PM
 
Edit: Actually the one thing I read this month that I found worse than the gun-guy, was crying Gambit in RG4. Crying Gambit bothers me greatly.

Yeah, I have to agree. That was the one part that threw me in R+G #4.

The above from the other thread and not in response – my point trying to be linear from where my view comes from.

Warning:
Not for the faint of heart and quite frankly, I'm not giving a hall pass –  understand in the end, its an opinion. :)

The thing that sits wrong is what Gambit is seeing isn't the same level of an issue as what she saw from him. The comparison is completely different. Not on par what so ever … seriously … Not the same.

Gambit's mind view: Rogue's power issues when they first met and her vulnerability that came with them was enough or her wanting to have a relationship makes him CRY?! Really. WTF. Everyone feels vulnerable in a new relationship.

What might have worked was Deathbit, Gambit trying to kill her and how she felt about that could have been worthy of tears.

Rogue's mind view: How much she hurt him by the trust issues, especially with the Avengers. She cries, that actually makes sense. Trust is a big deal to Gambit.

This sits wrong with the “Gambit only” fan.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on April 13, 2018, 09:18:15 AM
Deathbit was the reason why their relationship ended for 12 years, a very significant part of their history. I know it was a terrible story arc (probably the worst Gambit story ever written), but probably should've got a mention. It was the knock-out punch that had them apart for so many years.

That being said, I'm in the camp that loves the series, by far the best Rogue/Gambit story ever written, and if #5 is as good as the rest (which I think it will be) It'll be my favourite X-Men mini series (along with Claremont/Frank Miller 'Wolverine')

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 13, 2018, 11:10:50 AM
Prior disclaimers still stand. :)

I get it, I know there are those who enjoy this mini and will treasure it and all of that. I think that is great. I'll always love Gambit's first mini. It just holds a special place. I can see it holding special place for those who romy.

There is problems with this mini, like there was with Mackie's. However ... Mackie had more pages to work with. And there is only so much that can be done in 20 pages.

It's the glossing over of some things. And fans are glossing things over or are not as bothered by those things.

Those things that bother me:
Issue #1 in the #metoo movement environment was a huge one and if sales is an indicator, I'm not wrong on that. The promo piece for which the writer tried to quell wasn't wrong.

Rogue has not apologized, she has not taken ownership of her own misdeeds and she is one half of the equation, so far - its all on Gambit.

Gambit crying for the reason given is very fanfic like, mostly women write that sort of thing with male characters. The reason needed to be stronger with more resonance.

That said - I'm genuinely happy for those who are enjoying this book and can easily over look its faults. 

I'm happy for the romys who finally got their book.  :)

edit:
For the record: I have supported this book with my dollars.  I did that for Gambit - but other Gambit only fans bailed after issue 1 and they didn't come back (look at sales). That is on the writer.

@Don, in case you haven't seen the tweets at the other place in the romy thread, guess what is getting a nod ........ thats right buddy .... those cats!!!!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on April 13, 2018, 12:07:01 PM
That's fair Neko, the book's not for everyone. :)
Let's hope Gambit gets a bit more panel time in X-Men books after the mini ends (hopefully with 'Red' and maybe another book)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 13, 2018, 12:23:26 PM
That's fair Neko, the book's not for everyone. :)
Let's hope Gambit gets a bit more panel time in X-Men books after the mini ends (hopefully with 'Red' and maybe another book)


Agreed. Because Soule has not really used Gambit much in Astonishing and I feel like I'm going to go through withdrawals after R&G haha
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 15, 2018, 01:27:24 PM

@Don, in case you haven't seen the tweets at the other place in the romy thread, guess what is getting a nod ........ thats right buddy .... those cats!!!!


Yes... I noticed. I chose not to address it. @#[email protected] those cats. And your disgusting avatar. Those fleabags are ten times worse than seeing him cry because he chooses to dampen his testosterone daily be keeping them. No. No. No.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 15, 2018, 01:31:56 PM
Yes... I noticed. I chose not to address it. @#[email protected] those cats. And your disgusting avatar. Those fleabags are ten times worse than seeing him cry because he chooses to dampen his testosterone daily be keeping them. No. No. No.

*evil laugh* now I won't be changing that avatar anytime soon. 

We'll agree to disagree about what is worse though.  :D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 15, 2018, 01:52:46 PM
*evil laugh* now I won't be changing that avatar anytime soon. 

We'll agree to disagree about what is worse though.  :D


You can't control tears Neko! Sometimes they just come! I stubbed my toe two days ago and shed a manly, salty tear of pain. Or that time I re-watched the ID4 president speech for 100th time and it just keeps getting better every time! Or the tears of joy of joy I wept when all those sparkly Vampires died in that horrible movie, or the tears of sorrow that followed when it was all a effing vision!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 15, 2018, 02:26:18 PM

You can't control tears Neko! Sometimes they just come! I stubbed my toe two days ago and shed a manly, salty tear of pain. Or that time I re-watched the ID4 president speech for 100th time and it just keeps getting better every time! Or the tears of joy of joy I wept when all those sparkly Vampires died in that horrible movie, or the tears of sorrow that followed when it was all a effing vision!

Do you really want to discuss this? Because I do have a response but am choosing to not say anything.  ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 15, 2018, 03:10:41 PM
Do you really want to discuss this? Because I do have a response but am choosing to not say anything.  ;)


About what? The brilliance of the ID4 President speech, those wretched sparkly vampires mu wife made watch of hours of or my inflamed pinky toe?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 15, 2018, 03:27:35 PM

About what? The brilliance of the ID4 President speech, those wretched sparkly vampires mu wife made watch of hours of or my inflamed pinky toe?

Inflamed pinky toe while can cause tears is not the same as romance novel type stuff for which the crying was based on. I don't know any guy who cries with sparklie vamps or speeches. Pain though, yes ... but what was written in RG4 is romance novel type thing for a male crying. It wasn't believable to me nor would I want to see Gambit cry over romance novel type stuff.  ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 15, 2018, 04:41:18 PM
Inflamed pinky toe while can cause tears is not the same as romance novel type stuff for which the crying was based on. I don't know any guy who cries with sparklie vamps or speeches. Pain though, yes ... but what was written in RG4 is romance novel type thing for a male crying. It wasn't believable to me nor would I want to see Gambit cry over romance novel type stuff.  ;)


I don't think you quite appreciate the satisfaction of watching those "vampires" die one at a time or understand the profound sorrow I felt as I realized it never happened. As for the Gambit crying part... I didn't really care one way or another. But it made me itchy. I'm not an emotional type. You should see my wedding pictures.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 15, 2018, 05:11:18 PM
I don't think you quite appreciate the satisfaction of watching those "vampires" die one at a time or understand the profound sorrow I felt as I realized it never happened.

LMAO - having watched the films, I know what you are talking about. I was rather surprised as well with the mind eff. :)

Not a fan of those books or the films. The worst vamps ever - imo.

As for the Gambit crying part... I didn't really care one way or another. But it made me itchy. I'm not an emotional type. You should see my wedding pictures.

I dunno if we're on the same page or not. But I cared because that is not how I see Gambit. Which is why I went with the reasoning not solid enough.

It isn't how I see Gambit at all, and while I enjoy romance novels, men crying is not something that I can relate to in any romance novel I've read. I've stopped reading authors who made that a trait.

Lets think about this for a second - who is the target of comic books? Is it shifting? Do men want to see men crying? I'd like to know because I can tell you, no, I don't. This coming from a female. I'm not the target at all.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on April 15, 2018, 05:52:41 PM
LMAO - having watched the films, I know what you are talking about. I was rather surprised as well with the mind eff. :)

Not a fan of those books or the films. The worst vamps ever - imo.

I dunno if we're on the same page or not. But I cared because that is not how I see Gambit. Which is why I went with the reasoning not solid enough.

It isn't how I see Gambit at all, and while I enjoy romance novels, men crying is not something that I can relate to in any romance novel I've read. I've stopped reading authors who made that a trait.

Lets think about this for a second - who is the target of comic books? Is it shifting? Do men want to see men crying? I'd like to know because I can tell you, no, I don't. This coming from a female. I'm not the target at all.
agree...what bothers me about this rogue -gambit series is it seems to be a continuation of the ongoing "PC makeover" of gambit. Im female as well but I get a kick out of ladies man gambit..with a bit of arrogance and confidence is what made him appealing to this fan
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on April 15, 2018, 07:45:04 PM
The thing that sits wrong is what Gambit is seeing isn't the same level of an issue as what she saw from him. The comparison is completely different. Not on par what so ever … seriously … Not the same.


That is exactly what I thought. It didn't make me teary eyed as a reader (though I did have an "aww, Rogue" moment, but then again, yeah, I'm a Rogue fan too  :P ) but I don't think it should have evoked a strong "tears streaming down his cheeks" kind of moment. "Teary-eyed" would have been enough for me. But that's my opinion...


That being said, this unabashed Romy fan is still loving this series and will miss it once it's gone.  :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on April 15, 2018, 08:33:32 PM

That is exactly what I thought. It didn't make me teary eyed as a reader (though I did have an "aww, Rogue" moment, but then again, yeah, I'm a Rogue fan too  :P ) but I don't think it should have evoked a strong "tears streaming down his cheeks" kind of moment. "Teary-eyed" would have been enough for me. But that's my opinion...

See, I thought it *was* just being a bit teary-eyed, and then I looked again, and...yeah, I agree. I don't mind Fluffy Gambit sometimes, but I do miss the classic version. I don't think we'll be seeing cocky kickass ladies man Remy anytime soon, because that sort of character is losing its popularity. (The ladies man aspect, I mean.)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 15, 2018, 09:42:55 PM
 
agree...what bothers me about this rogue -gambit series is it seems to be a continuation of the ongoing "PC makeover" of gambit. Im female as well but I get a kick out of ladies man gambit..with a bit of arrogance and confidence is what made him appealing to this fan
That is exactly what I thought. It didn't make me teary eyed as a reader (though I did have an "aww, Rogue" moment, but then again, yeah, I'm a Rogue fan too  ) but I don't think it should have evoked a strong "tears streaming down his cheeks" kind of moment. "Teary-eyed" would have been enough for me. But that's my opinion...


That being said, this unabashed Romy fan is still loving this series and will miss it once it's gone.

Meant to reply to both separately but .. we seem to be on the same wavelength discussion – wise. Hope you can follow my views, if not, ask. :)

I had not thought of the “pc makeover” of Gambit. Didn't see it but can now and I will say, I don't want him made over. I adore ladies man Gambit, because of who he is .. not for anything else. It may not be appropriate for the time period but damn – I love him. Chivalry, I like a man to help a lady – she may not need it or want it, its nice to be asked.

IMO
I enjoy romance novel stuff – I do, sue me. LMAO. Gambit's end game needs to have him in an equal relationship.

Edit: redundant on my part ... no need for the same old drivel from me. LOL

See what you want to see … but Gambit is not coming out of this mini the guy I adore.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 15, 2018, 09:48:10 PM
Interesting... When was the last time you saw the Gambit you adore.? Then I'd like to tackle your childhood and relationship with your mother. I'd also like to revisit this next week at next session.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 15, 2018, 10:04:00 PM
Interesting... When was the last time you saw the Gambit you adore.? Then I'd like to tackle your childhood and relationship with your mother. I'd also like to revisit this next week at next session.

I have not seen him in a long time.

What does my mother have to do with it? LOL

We can waste time if you want ...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 16, 2018, 10:09:08 AM
...I think we're making progress here. I foresee a wonderful breakthrough for you.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on April 17, 2018, 09:02:28 AM
Lol


The the 'men crying' subject, I don't mind as well as it's 'restrained' so to speak. I never thought of it as a PC makeover, but I guess it could be. He doesn't even need much of a make over. The ladies man/ harassing angle gets overblown most of the time.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 17, 2018, 09:35:04 AM
I find it funny that people still let him use that title. Wolverine, Beast, Cyclops, Angel, and even Iceman have been involved with more ladies than him and most them are considered "square". Gambit has earned that title as much as Fantomex is the X-Men's "premier thief". But in today's ultra sensitive climate, I doubt that will change. I think sometimes people forget what may seem as a negative trait is still part of a person. It matters as much as a virtue. If we start cutting away everything that looks not all the way above board, we'll be reading stories about robots.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on April 17, 2018, 10:04:30 AM
"Fantomex is the X-Men's "premier thief"
Than what does that make gambit? Lol
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 17, 2018, 02:32:06 PM
Than what does that make gambit? Lol


Ask Marvel. They are the ones that gave him the title during his Max series..
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 17, 2018, 02:58:16 PM

Ask Marvel. They are the ones that gave him the title during his Max series..

He had a Max series? Asking, I don't recall it but maybe I missed something. LOL
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 17, 2018, 03:30:32 PM
He had a Max series? Asking, I don't recall it but maybe I missed something. LOL


He did, which is kind of baffling, but it wasn't supposed to be very good iirc
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 17, 2018, 03:44:42 PM

He did, which is kind of baffling, but it wasn't supposed to be very good iirc

Wow, I need to look for this .. how did I miss it! LOL Who knows.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on April 17, 2018, 04:23:22 PM
You guys talking about the Fatomex Max mini series?  I never read it either, but heard it wasn't very good.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on April 17, 2018, 04:32:47 PM
Ugh, don’t remind me. I think it came out around the time the solo was ending, or near there—it seemed like an extra f you to us.

And I agree that his relationships with women are blown way out of proportion.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on April 17, 2018, 05:05:33 PM
Wow, I need to look for this .. how did I miss it! LOL Who knows.


You missed it because it was an epic flop. Debuted at 19K in sales and finished with a 4 digit number.
No one cares about this character except writers...probably because Grant Morrison created him, I dunno...
He's a cross between Gambit and Deadpool...but crap.
 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 17, 2018, 09:09:15 PM

You missed it because it was an epic flop. Debuted at 19K in sales and finished with a 4 digit number.
No one cares about this character except writers...probably because Grant Morrison created him, I dunno...
He's a cross between Gambit and Deadpool...but crap.


I'm actually surprised someone writing Deadpool hasn't made a crack about him yet... To be honest, if we ever got a Gambit solo, I don't think I'd mind seeing the three of them pull a job together... or Gambit and Deadpool working together, run into Fantomex (possibly doing the same job), and then the three end up fall in. Could be pretty fun. But it'd have to be via a Gambit solo. I don't trust anyone the writes Deadpool to do Gambit justice.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 18, 2018, 10:42:01 AM

I'm actually surprised someone writing Deadpool hasn't made a crack about him yet... To be honest, if we ever got a Gambit solo, I don't think I'd mind seeing the three of them pull a job together... or Gambit and Deadpool working together, run into Fantomex (possibly doing the same job), and then the three end up fall in. Could be pretty fun. But it'd have to be via a Gambit solo. I don't trust anyone the writes Deadpool to do Gambit justice.


I would read it if it was written by someone who was also a Gambit fan. Otherwise I just know he'd end up being the butt of every joke
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on April 18, 2018, 11:58:51 AM

I would read it if it was written by someone who was also a Gambit fan. Otherwise I just know he'd end up being the butt of every joke
dosen't Deadpool make fun of everyone and everything..all.day long...continuously. On and on lol -
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 18, 2018, 01:51:22 PM
dosen't Deadpool make fun of everyone and everything..all.day long...continuously. On and on lol -


Well yeah, but it would get old seeing Gambit being dumped on by both him and Fanto for a series
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on April 18, 2018, 02:14:19 PM

Well yeah, but it would get old seeing Gambit being dumped on by both him and Fanto for a series


True which is ironic and ridiculous since fanto is big fat blatant ripoff of gambit(coat, thief, accent etc)...did his creator ever admit to the fact>?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 18, 2018, 02:18:28 PM

True which is ironic and ridiculous since fanto is big fat blatant ripoff of gambit(coat, thief, accent etc)...did his creator ever admit to the fact>?


I'm not sure if he stated it explicitly, but I'm pretty sure Morrison created him to be a parody of characters created in the 90s like Gambit. And now he's the "X-Men's premier thief". That's like if DC decided to have Midnighter take over the mantle of Batman lol
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 18, 2018, 02:33:49 PM

I'm not sure if he stated it explicitly, but I'm pretty sure Morrison created him to be a parody of characters created in the 90s like Gambit. And now he's the "X-Men's premier thief". That's like if DC decided to have Midnighter take over the mantle of Batman lol


Midnighter: Gotham's Dark Knight.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 18, 2018, 02:53:30 PM
Morrison had stated on his own website his dislike for Gambit. He also didn't like Rogue as she was then or is now and wanted to change her, whether it was via death and resurrection or some way with her powers. 

Morrison was an odd guy.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on April 18, 2018, 04:29:19 PM
Morrison had stated on his own website his dislike for Gambit. .
did he say what his reasons were?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 18, 2018, 06:53:37 PM
did he say what his reasons were?

Wow, I am not sure if I remember correctly, because his blog or whatever was incredibly weird. You really had to read some odd things before you got to anything that was Xmen.  And this was back in 2001 or so.  I don't know if his blog is still around either.

I remember that CC traded Beast to Morrison and picked up Gambit with that roster change for X-Treme Xmen.

Morrison didn't like the simian look to Beast, so CC had Sage jump-start his evolution so that Morrison could have cat Beast.

Morrison wanted some of the traits Gambit has but didn't want the character, thus Fantomex was created with some similarities.

Morrison didn't like the concept of the Xavier Institute for Higher Learning as a cover for mutants, he wanted a "school", next thing you know .... there were a ton  of mutants.  Every writer took his lead and started making up groups and new mutants.

Thus the "No More Mutants" and Marvel cutting the group down to 198 of them.

Morrison also wanted to kill off Rogue. There is actually a newer article about that.
http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/x-men-grant-morrison-nearly-killed-rogue
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on April 18, 2018, 07:44:26 PM
I remember Morrison stating that he didn't like characters like Gambit, Cable and Cecilia Reyes because their code names didn't match their powers...it was around 2000 when I read that interview.
He didn't like Rogue either.
He basically copied the movies, turned the X-Men into teachers, they wore boring black clothing, and Wolverine was the focal point...and it sounds like he wanted the crappy movie version of Rogue to replace the original. Morrison at his best was a great writer, but I just wasn't feeling his X-Men, and it became a cluster f*** ever since...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 18, 2018, 08:17:56 PM
People give the guy praise but his lead and finally the onset of Milligan made me quit reading from 2003 to nearly 2010.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 18, 2018, 09:20:13 PM
I remember Morrison stating that he didn't like characters like Gambit, Cable and Cecilia Reyes because their code names didn't match their powers...it was around 2000 when I read that interview.
He didn't like Rogue either.
He basically copied the movies, turned the X-Men into teachers, they wore boring black clothing, and Wolverine was the focal point...and it sounds like he wanted the crappy movie version of Rogue to replace the original. Morrison at his best was a great writer, but I just wasn't feeling his X-Men, and it became a cluster f*** ever since...


I like Morrison. He's done some great stuff for DC (his run on Batman and Robin is one of my favorite Dick Grayson story-lines ever) and I liked the first couple arcs of his New X-Men, but I'm not surprised to hear this stuff. Some of his thinking is a little out there and I can see how his ideas would be polarizing, especially to X-fans
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 18, 2018, 09:43:56 PM
I remember Morrison stating that he didn't like characters like Gambit, Cable and Cecilia Reyes because their code names didn't match their powers...it was around 2000 when I read that interview.

I'm sort of remembering that now ... I remember thinking ... why would a code name make a big deal with a character. I chalked it up to not understanding any of the characters mentioned.


I like Morrison. He's done some great stuff for DC (his run on Batman and Robin is one of my favorite Dick Grayson story-lines ever) and I liked the first couple arcs of his New X-Men, but I'm not surprised to hear this stuff. Some of his thinking is a little out there and I can see how his ideas would be polarizing, especially to X-fans

Never read his DC stuff but I did read the praise it got from fans.

I tried one arc from his run. All because he was suppose to be doing all these wonderful things - The story arc was "Murder At The Mansion" .... A murder mystery ... I was thinking - great way to rope me in. I love murder mysteries ....

Well .... I can tell you it was a four issue arc and at the end, it was not a murder mystery. In fact, the person murdered didn't stay dead. I know why he couldn't let it go, Morrison loved Emma Frost.

Bottom line, what was promised was not delivered. And I never wasted another dollar on a book solicited in such a way for characters with no investment from me.

I know we're a tad off topic but til previews for issue #5, it might not be so bad. Up to you folks.

If there is some way to steer back though and someone has an idea - share it. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on April 19, 2018, 09:52:28 AM
I suppose it's marginally on topic as Morrison hated Gambit and Rogue. He seemed to be kinda the first 90's bad, hipster type writers. Though clearly he did not have a crush on Rogue (like most of the eighties kid writers)  as Emma was his waifu/self insert (seriously she suddenly had an English accent when he was writing.)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 19, 2018, 10:40:48 AM
In fact, the person murdered didn't stay dead.


So, business as usual for comics  ;D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 19, 2018, 11:16:06 AM
So, business as usual for comics  ;D

Indeed!  ;D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 19, 2018, 05:08:15 PM
Though clearly he did not have a crush on Rogue (like most of the eighties kid writers)...


I thought I was the only one that noticed that for a while. Every time a writer would get their hands on her, Rogue immediately was flirting with what was obviously their favorite character.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 19, 2018, 05:35:52 PM

I thought I was the only one that noticed that for a while. Every time a writer would get their hands on her, Rogue immediately was flirting with what was obviously their favorite character.


I definitely noticed that recently when Duggan paired her with Deadpool. Seeing as she's one of my favorite comic characters, it always makes me feel...uncomfortable.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on April 19, 2018, 05:52:32 PM
I suppose it's marginally on topic as Morrison hated Gambit and Rogue. He seemed to be kinda the first 90's bad, hipster type writers. Though clearly he did not have a crush on Rogue (like most of the eighties kid writers)  as Emma was his waifu/self insert (seriously she suddenly had an English accent when he was writing.)

Oh, I remember that. That was weird. Yes, Massachusetts accents sound the most like English ones, but nobody's gonna confuse that with an English accent.

But then again, it's Marvel. Their writers' track records with anything regarding speech and culture is...not good. Like even now, they make simple grammatical errors in French or having Remy say "boyo" in the latest issue of Gold.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 27, 2018, 03:10:35 AM
R&G #5 preview


http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/2018/04/27/marvel-preview-rogue-gambit-5/
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: andresa on April 27, 2018, 03:23:30 PM
So, those panels in the preview that seem to be flash-forward are from a possible future. 

From Pere Perez tumblr: “On those pages there are a couple of panels with images from a possible future of the guys, wearing possible future costumes.”
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 27, 2018, 03:38:48 PM
So, those panels in the preview that seem to be flash-forward are from a possible future. 

From Pere Perez tumblr: “On those pages there are a couple of panels with images from a possible future of the guys, wearing possible future costumes.”


Not too crazy about Rogue's but I'm liking Gambit's quite a bit
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: belay on April 27, 2018, 07:18:13 PM
So, those panels in the preview that seem to be flash-forward are from a possible future. 

From Pere Perez tumblr: “On those pages there are a couple of panels with images from a possible future of the guys, wearing possible future costumes.”


Liking the design for Gambit but not sure this will be future costume for him as he already has a new uniform for X-men Red.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on April 28, 2018, 03:15:31 AM

Liking the design for Gambit but not sure this will be future costume for him as he already has a new uniform for X-men Red.


I am sure Red costume for Gambit is only for RED. I other books he will be in bis own costume.
Maybe they will use new costumes for Fresh Start.
News costume is ok but could be much better.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on April 28, 2018, 09:57:27 AM
It's fine, but why the headsock again? It's like a zombie and keeps coming back...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on April 28, 2018, 10:01:44 AM
So in the splash page, the cats appear. Can someone please enlighten me as to when exactly Gambit got cats? This must have happened during the period when I stopped reading comics...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: belay on April 28, 2018, 11:41:53 AM
So in the splash page, the cats appear. Can someone please enlighten me as to when exactly Gambit got cats? This must have happened during the period when I stopped reading comics...


Gambit got the cats from Mystique in Astonishing X-men issue #62.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on April 28, 2018, 11:57:52 AM
Mystique saved the cats from Sabertooth who was going to eat them.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 28, 2018, 01:18:58 PM
It's fine, but why the headsock again? It's like a zombie and keeps coming back...


Yeah, I'm with you on that. I'm not sure he'll ever break away from it at this point
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on April 28, 2018, 01:43:13 PM
It's fine, but why the headsock again? It's like a zombie and keeps coming back...
sock? I always thought it was leather. Rather that than a bandana around his neck looking like a bad 80s cowboy lol
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on April 28, 2018, 05:52:32 PM
Sock was obviously just an expression (but could you imagine how hot a headsock in leather would be, yikes) if it was an either or choice, I dunno, I think I'd go with the bandana...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on April 28, 2018, 08:16:38 PM

Gambit got the cats from Mystique in Astonishing X-men issue #62.
Mystique saved the cats from Sabertooth who was going to eat them.


Ah. OK. Thanks!  :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on April 28, 2018, 10:21:05 PM
I love that scene with Gambit and Mystique. That's how their awkward dynamic should be written.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on April 29, 2018, 12:42:02 AM
Mystique saved the cats from Sabertooth who was going to eat them.


Biggest... Mistake... Ever.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on April 29, 2018, 11:13:35 AM
sock? I always thought it was leather. Rather that than a bandana around his neck looking like a bad 80s cowboy lol


I really like the bandanna. I can't explain why haha his whole look for Astonishing has been one of my favorites.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Berry on May 02, 2018, 10:48:22 AM
So, issue 5 was fairly Rogue heavy, Gambit was pretty much support staff with the actual saving of the day.  That said, I still really enjoyed it.  I was pretty amused by Gambit’s trench coat being back on him in one piece at the hospital which means he either 1.) brought two coats with him to a tropical island or 2.) sewed it back together before him & Rogue went off to the hospital. 


Also, their ‘redisgns’ from the preview page shows back up in the make out splash page.  I can’t imagine KT would have used it twice if she wasn’t leading somewhere with it.  No idea where, the end page doesn’t indicate anything is coming down the pipes for them other than to look for them in Gold.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Dantay on May 02, 2018, 01:20:18 PM
if you want more Rogue& Gambit write to the marvel,  [email protected]  , mark them " ok to print"
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on May 02, 2018, 03:26:44 PM
So, issue 5 was fairly Rogue heavy, Gambit was pretty much support staff with the actual saving of the day.  That said, I still really enjoyed it.  I was pretty amused by Gambit’s trench coat being back on him in one piece at the hospital which means he either 1.) brought two coats with him to a tropical island or 2.) sewed it back together before him & Rogue went off to the hospital. 


Also, their ‘redisgns’ from the preview page shows back up in the make out splash page.  I can’t imagine KT would have used it twice if she wasn’t leading somewhere with it.  No idea where, the end page doesn’t indicate anything is coming down the pipes for them other than to look for them in Gold.


Yeah kind of felt like the villain was specifically created with Rogue in mind. Gambit was just there as her sidekick to buy her time to defeat Lavish in a way only she could.[/size]Also thought wasting panel space to develop the villain in the final issue was a poor choice. At this point I think most readers don't care about Lavish or her motivations so cramming it in the last issue is an odd story choice IMO.


Thought issues 1 and 5 were the weakest.  I just hope future writers stop with the angst and wishy washy Rogue now that she is supposedly committed.  I fear though sooner or later she will go back to not being sure and Gambit will go back to pining.


In the end, kind of felt this was really a Rogue comic disguised as a Rogue and Gambit comic.  Rogue saved the day and it was Rogue who essentially had to decide whether Gambit was worth her time.  She is essentially the focal point of the story and the person that drives the narrative with Gambit being her supporting character.
[/color]
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 02, 2018, 03:50:12 PM
Rogue finally apologized. This was too Rogue-centric. And too much space on a villain not developed well enough.

Gambit has his cats! LMAO

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Meliorist on May 02, 2018, 04:29:45 PM
I liked the last issue! Though I will disagree about it being too Rogue-centric, from a narrative stand point anyway. Most of us were concerned going into Rogue and Gambit that the story was going to be a Rogue story at the cost of Gambit, so what we got is pretty amazing. We did get a little bamboozled though because it was a Rogue story; from issue 1 to the final, it was about resolving Rogue's emotional state.


The backstory we got on the villain did make the scenario weaker because it told us that Lavish has a strong reason to avoid absorbing people, so yeah >.>
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 02, 2018, 05:47:49 PM
Gambit has his cats! LMAO


...


They printed my email. I'm in a Marvel comic. That's pretty dope. Hope my unmanly shriek didn't disturb my neighbors... Much.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on May 02, 2018, 06:10:21 PM
All and all, I thought it was a cute ending to the story. It was definitely Rogue's issue, which I kind of understand because if you're going to write about their relationship and give them a clean slate, you need to resolve Rogue's inability to commit. I still wish Remy had more face time though.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on May 02, 2018, 06:35:10 PM
Perhaps we should start calling him "The superhero formerly known as Gambit aka Rogue's insignificant other."
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on May 02, 2018, 07:21:35 PM
Just finished it. Basically a watering down of remy to build up rogue. Really tired of him being writing as a spineless shmuck for rogue, Bring ladies man remy back(I know ,wont happen)

6/10
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 02, 2018, 08:00:47 PM
Moment l saw Gambit on the ground and then saying what he said I was like..."well I know where this is going". Would have liked Gambit to not play so much second fiddle but I don't think it was so much to get butt hurt over. After having three back to back stellar issues, the dismount was bound to be shakey, even though it wasn't all that bad at all. But you know, have it, y'all. Season it up.


Think KT could have used the space she gave Lavish better but until now we had zero background on her. Kind of the set back when using an original villain. I will say, reading between the lines it was done like that and left open so it could be addressed in some fashion later on. Admittedly she seems to be more of a villain for Rogue than Gambit. She wouldn't fit well into his gallery.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on May 02, 2018, 08:14:30 PM

...


They printed my email. I'm in a Marvel comic. That's pretty dope. Hope my unmanly shriek didn't disturb my neighbors... Much.

I love this post so much. Congrats! And Letters Pages make me happy and nostalgic.

Despite its flaws, I enjoyed this series a lot more than I thought I would.

And Rogue apologized. To Remy. Someone get me my fainting couch.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 02, 2018, 08:44:54 PM
Perhaps we should start calling him "The superhero formerly known as Gambit aka Rogue's insignificant other."

Heh heh. My concern after reading this issue is establishing Gambit's lack of meaning or usefulness in the X-books. His character not worthy of his own presence because now that he is attached to Rogue, it will be for her benefit.

It's a shame.

As for this mini being mainly about Rogue .... it was that way .... all the way through. Gambit was seldom shown as his own person. IMO - Just another writer boosting Rogue at Gambit's expense. Clearly, Rogue was the preferred character, as she got all the growth. It didn't do anything for Gambit but regress him the 1990's. IMO
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 02, 2018, 09:07:46 PM
I umm.. I liked 90s Gambit. I thought we all did? Would you prefer 00s Gambit? Because that guy made me quit comics for half a decade.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Miss Misery on May 02, 2018, 09:10:14 PM
The always-Rogue's-cheerleader thing is something I'm afraid of. We'll see what happens next.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 02, 2018, 09:34:56 PM
I umm.. I liked 90s Gambit. I thought we all did? Would you prefer 00s Gambit? Because that guy made me quit comics for half a decade.

I liked 1990's Gambit when he was doing his stuff ... his adventures. Not the stuff where angstville happened.

I am thinking the moment they were hooked up which was with Xmen #4 (for irony) or something close to that number, but he did go downhill in the "00's. (I can't decide to change my post or let it stand as it is.) LOL

I mean the time period you are thinking of, however, in hindsight ... had they not hooked up ... not sure how things would be today.
Title: KT's response
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 02, 2018, 09:48:40 PM
http://community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?270-Le-Diable-Blanc-Gambit-Appreciation/page586 (http://community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?270-Le-Diable-Blanc-Gambit-Appreciation/page586)
Quote from: Kelly Thompson
I'm sorry so many of you guys feel let down and convinced that Gambit didn't get enough time to shine and that this was "Rogue's book." I certainly disagree. Especially since I literally broke down the issues point by point on my own for each of them in each issue and in every issue except the last Gambit had more "cool action beats/moments" than Rogue. I was pretty careful about that because I knew she was going to be getting the lion's share of the finale due to her similar power set to Lavish and I wanted balance.
 
 On the more emotional front...Rogue definitely had more time throughout the series, but I felt that was necessary because she was the one that had to see the light and have some revelations about their relationship and also be the one to make the apologies. Gambit was already emotionally there...waiting for her to figure it out. And you can disagree with that if you like, but I inherited what I inherited, and that inheritance was a Gambit still in love with Rogue and waiting for her to figure things out so that they could be together. That requires that she does more emotional lifting in our story than Remy...as he said to her from issue one.
 
 Anyway. Sorry it didn't work for a lot of you, I appreciate you giving it a chance (if you can honestly say you did - I think some of you definitely did...others I'm not so sure). I'm definitely walking away from this particular thread feeling like there's no way to please most of you in here and y'know, that's okay...we all want what we want. Including me. And I gotta carve my own path. But I'm sorry that going forward I'm unlikely to be the right writer for a lot of you. Good luck to ya.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: X-fan73 on May 03, 2018, 12:32:05 AM
I really think the Gambit fan base has been become too jaded. I enjoyed this series and both Rogue and Gambit’s characterization. Well done, Kelly Thompson!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Meliorist on May 03, 2018, 12:46:24 AM
Too jaded, perhaps but she is also responding to the reactions of 8 or so people and calling that 'so many' or 'a lot'... seems like a bit of a miscommunication. Especially since it isn't 'fire and brimstone' but rather 'meh'. I do agree that the last issue was weaker than the prior three but I still enjoyed the series and will get the trade paperback when it comes out.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on May 03, 2018, 02:35:25 AM
KT`s letter made me sad.
She wrote a great book.
Title: Re: KT's response
Post by: bark_no_byte on May 03, 2018, 09:54:47 AM
Quote from: Kelly Thompson
I'm sorry so many of you guys feel let down and convinced that Gambit didn't get enough time to shine and that this was "Rogue's book." I certainly disagree. Especially since I literally broke down the issues point by point on my own for each of them in each issue and in every issue except the last Gambit had more "cool action beats/moments" than Rogue. I was pretty careful about that because I knew she was going to be getting the lion's share of the finale due to her similar power set to Lavish and I wanted balance.
 
 On the more emotional front...Rogue definitely had more time throughout the series, but I felt that was necessary because she was the one that had to see the light and have some revelations about their relationship and also be the one to make the apologies. Gambit was already emotionally there...waiting for her to figure it out. And you can disagree with that if you like, but I inherited what I inherited, and that inheritance was a Gambit still in love with Rogue and waiting for her to figure things out so that they could be together. That requires that she does more emotional lifting in our story than Remy...as he said to her from issue one.
 
 Anyway. Sorry it didn't work for a lot of you, I appreciate you giving it a chance (if you can honestly say you did - I think some of you definitely did...others I'm not so sure). I'm definitely walking away from this particular thread feeling like there's no way to please most of you in here and y'know, that's okay...we all want what we want. Including me. And I gotta carve my own path. But I'm sorry that going forward I'm unlikely to be the right writer for a lot of you. Good luck to ya.


I think this makes a lot of sense. I haven't had a chance to read issue 5 yet but I've really loved the series. I'm glad that KT is sticking by her guns. Hope she gets to write more of these characters soon

Edit: Gah, for some reason it's including my comment with the quote. Can't figure out how to change it

Resource:
http://community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?270-Le-Diable-Blanc-Gambit-Appreciation/page586 
Title: Re: KT's response
Post by: Dantay on May 03, 2018, 11:08:24 AM

I think this makes a lot of sense. I haven't had a chance to read issue 5 yet but I've really loved the series. I'm glad that KT is sticking by her guns. Hope she gets to write more of these characters soon

ffs why is she apologizing, the book was good,Gambit had a very strong showing and well written , i would like for her to get the opertunity to write him again . I am not a Romy fan but she fixed the mess Austin - Carey put that relationship in.
Title: Re: KT's response
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 03, 2018, 02:02:47 PM

I think this makes a lot of sense. I haven't had a chance to read issue 5 yet but I've really loved the series. I'm glad that KT is sticking by her guns. Hope she gets to write more of these characters soon

Edit: Gah, for some reason it's including my comment with the quote. Can't figure out how to change it

Well, I've actually spent time yelling at my machine trying to figure this out for you. And have spent more time trying to fix than I thought possible. LMAO

There has to be a dangling tag somewhere ... I can't seem to find it. Never say never, right .... At least you can be quote correctly.

Title: Re: KT's response
Post by: bark_no_byte on May 03, 2018, 02:19:38 PM
Well, I've actually spent time yelling at my machine trying to figure this out for you. And have spent more time trying to fix than I thought possible. LMAO

There has to be a dangling tag somewhere ... I can't seem to find it. Never say never, right .... At least you can be quote correctly.


Weird. Oh well. Thanks for looking into it
Title: Re: KT's response
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 03, 2018, 02:25:15 PM

Weird. Oh well. Thanks for looking into it

Its CBR's thread ... something there but not sure what ... I'll add the link to the end of your post for resource information and if it doesn't work, we'll leave it out. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 03, 2018, 02:57:06 PM
...what if Mystique secretly implanted the cats with an explosive device?  >:D  That's possible right? Cat confetti? I guess listening devices would be cool too... but explosives... better.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 03, 2018, 06:38:50 PM
I guess it actually doesn't matter. Its not like much will be carried over to anywhere. Is what it is. LOL
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on May 03, 2018, 06:45:01 PM
...what if Mystique secretly implanted the cats with an explosive device?  >:D  That's possible right? Cat confetti? I guess listening devices would be cool too... but explosives... better.


OMG. Is it bad that I laughed reading that? Probably is, but I'm more of a dog person anyways... :P


Anyway, regarding KT's comments: it's a shame she's taking the harsher criticism to heart. She's gotten some great reviews. I, personally, think she did a great job. She put a lot of time and effort into researching her subject and put a lot of thought into what she was writing. I give her kudos for that and I hope they give her a shot at another x-book. She's one of the better comic book writers out there right now, IMHO.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 03, 2018, 10:20:33 PM
I guess it actually doesn't matter. Its not like much will be carried over to anywhere. Is what it is. LOL


I beg to differ. Those flea bags have followed him since Astonishing. He cant seem to shake them. They are the final linchpin to what's left of Marvel's continuity. May they live long and prosper... Until cat confetti, of course.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 04, 2018, 05:22:53 AM

I beg to differ. Those flea bags have followed him since Astonishing. He cant seem to shake them. They are the final linchpin to what's left of Marvel's continuity. May they live long and prosper... Until cat confetti, of course.

*chortle* better them than Rogue I say! LMAO. At least they'll love him unconditionally, they won't dump him off in Antarctica. Okay, okay, I'll stop. LOL ... I am making fun. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cajunpirate on May 07, 2018, 08:48:42 AM
First, I really hope I am completely off-base here, but...


does anyone else think Marvel is going to pull the ultimate switch in Gold 30, the one where Kitty / Peter get married? I think it ends up being Gambit / Rogue who tie the knot, after Peter / Kitty decide not to go through with it. We just had a Rogue / Gambit run that pretty much highlighted their entire romance, the ups and downs, together (via clones), and Gambit is now making cameos in Gold, albeit brief lines such as "anything for you chere." The cover of 30 shows the 2 front and center there, and pretty tight, and now a secret poly-bagged cover has just been announced by Marvel. Again, hope I am wrong, as I much prefer the solo Gambit, but I have to be honest, this idea has been gnawing at me for awhile now.


If I bummed anyone out (besides myself), to cheer yourself up, check out etsy.com and type in Gambit. Some pretty cool stuff to buy.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on May 07, 2018, 09:01:52 AM
First, I really hope I am completely off-base here, but...


does anyone else think Marvel is going to pull the ultimate switch in Gold 30, the one where Kitty / Peter get married? I think it ends up being Gambit / Rogue who tie the knot, after Peter / Kitty decide not to go through with it. We just had a Rogue / Gambit run that pretty much highlighted their entire romance, the ups and downs, together (via clones), and Gambit is now making cameos in Gold, albeit brief lines such as "anything for you chere." The cover of 30 shows the 2 front and center there, and pretty tight, and now a secret poly-bagged cover has just been announced by Marvel. Again, hope I am wrong, as I much prefer the solo Gambit, but I have to be honest, this idea has been gnawing at me for awhile now.


If I bummed anyone out (besides myself), to cheer yourself up, check out etsy.com and type in Gambit. Some pretty cool stuff to buy.


No, I doubt that. I don't think it's their style.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 07, 2018, 09:08:35 AM
A Different World? But without the bride stealing. LOL


(https://www.buzzfeed.com/danibewriting/26-memories-from-a-different-world-that-prove-it-zs3a)
No, I doubt that. I don't think it's their style.



Not their style... but definitely Guggenheim's style.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on May 07, 2018, 09:25:38 AM
First, I really hope I am completely off-base here, but...


does anyone else think Marvel is going to pull the ultimate switch in Gold 30, the one where Kitty / Peter get married? I think it ends up being Gambit / Rogue who tie the knot, after Peter / Kitty decide not to go through with it. We just had a Rogue / Gambit run that pretty much highlighted their entire romance, the ups and downs, together (via clones), and Gambit is now making cameos in Gold, albeit brief lines such as "anything for you chere." The cover of 30 shows the 2 front and center there, and pretty tight, and now a secret poly-bagged cover has just been announced by Marvel. Again, hope I am wrong, as I much prefer the solo Gambit, but I have to be honest, this idea has been gnawing at me for awhile now.


If I bummed anyone out (besides myself), to cheer yourself up, check out etsy.com and type in Gambit. Some pretty cool stuff to buy.
Saw such ideas at CBR. Always thought that it is insane idea :)  But then X Classified one shot got announced. Without any story, characters or writers. Bleedingcool says that one shot will tie in to Wedding special and that it will arrive with hiden covers. So you won`t find spoilers till you read it.


And after that I thought that wedding change can really happen.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on May 07, 2018, 09:30:33 AM
That is an interesting angle, but I still can't see it. Marvel's have been struggling, I don't think they'd pass up the extra sales this would bring. The G+R mini would have sold better, because it would have been previewed as 'important' and not a throw away mini. And orders for the wedding issues would likely have been bigger, too.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on May 07, 2018, 06:27:04 PM
First, I really hope I am completely off-base here, but...


does anyone else think Marvel is going to pull the ultimate switch in Gold 30, the one where Kitty / Peter get married? I think it ends up being Gambit / Rogue who tie the knot, after Peter / Kitty decide not to go through with it. We just had a Rogue / Gambit run that pretty much highlighted their entire romance, the ups and downs, together (via clones), and Gambit is now making cameos in Gold, albeit brief lines such as "anything for you chere." The cover of 30 shows the 2 front and center there, and pretty tight, and now a secret poly-bagged cover has just been announced by Marvel. Again, hope I am wrong, as I much prefer the solo Gambit, but I have to be honest, this idea has been gnawing at me for awhile now.


If I bummed anyone out (besides myself), to cheer yourself up, check out etsy.com and type in Gambit. Some pretty cool stuff to buy.


It crossed my mind, mostly because there were a number of allusions to "marriage" in Gambit's dialogue lately, i.e. Gambit stating in Astonishing that he wasn't asking to "conjure up a priest and get married" (or whatever it was he said) then the comment to Nightcrawler about not seeing him and Rogue tying the knot in Gold, plus, of course the ending of R+G with his "important question" (which ended up being about his cats, LOL).


I don't think it's going to happen, but I still find the allusions a bit odd...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on May 07, 2018, 08:10:06 PM
While a lot of the allusions are true, I think if they went through with it -now- it would be doing a disservice to Marvel and its fans both, especially ROMY fans. I know there are some who had the torch lit for the two of them after all these years, but it's been what, a decade or longer since they were last actually 'together'?


Romy was up there with Scott and Jean in regards to popularity in the 90's, and they've spent the last 20 years letting it splutter and die (if not outright trying to kill it *cough*CAREY*cough*MILLIGAN*cough*), with a few moments where it looked like it was going to be revived only to go on life support once again. They've got 10+ years of people getting into comics since then having no idea what Romy is, and having a wedding between the two of them when they literally just got back together an issue ago strikes me as an incredible waste.


Rogue is already in super-popular territory, but Gambit has been relegated to sidekick/wallpaper status, he needs more time being given his own development and not left as an afterthought before the two of them having a wedding would even be considered worth it, in my opinion.


Gambit is the #$%#$% KING OF THIEVES in the comicverse, but that barely even gets a whisper, and the last one who did was PAD. Anyone could use that, or resurfacing powers, or have him lead a team book for a year - THEN do the wedding. Otherwise the conversation will be like this:


"Oh hey, Rogue is getting married, can you believe it?"
"Really? Wow, that's awesome!"
"Yeah!"
"So uh... who is she getting married to? She hasn't dated anyone in a while, at least not seriously. It's not Magneto, is it? Wasn't he the last one? Or was it Deadpool?"
"Ugh no, it's actually Gambit."
"..."
"..."
"Really?"
"Uh, yeah, really."
"Didn't they break up, like, forever ago?"
"Yeah, but supposedly there was a mini that got them together again, then they immediately decided to tie the knot, I guess."
"That's... pretty lame."
"Yeah, but hey, it's Marvel."
"True."
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on May 08, 2018, 09:28:23 AM
Yeah, I get that reasoning. Definitely since since Milligan marvel's been a ticely trying to 'destroy' romy and laughing about. The only time it would get mentioned was when the current writer would bring it up basically to say 'hey, remember how big this was? Well, Gambit sucks, my guy is better...oh come one! How come everyone is not agreeing that my guy is better?! ' To turn around now and say well, I guess they've back together and now their married, especially as a double wedding my with a less popular couple, who is getting all the attention and promotion.


I still think it's happening because my previously stated reasons, but one reason it might happen is because marvel loves trolling romy fans, lol
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 08, 2018, 05:31:53 PM
While a lot of the allusions are true, I think if they went through with it -now- it would be doing a disservice to Marvel and its fans both, especially ROMY fans. I know there are some who had the torch lit for the two of them after all these years, but it's been what, a decade or longer since they were last actually 'together'?


Romy was up there with Scott and Jean in regards to popularity in the 90's, and they've spent the last 20 years letting it splutter and die (if not outright trying to kill it *cough*CAREY*cough*MILLIGAN*cough*), with a few moments where it looked like it was going to be revived only to go on life support once again. They've got 10+ years of people getting into comics since then having no idea what Romy is, and having a wedding between the two of them when they literally just got back together an issue ago strikes me as an incredible waste.


Rogue is already in super-popular territory, but Gambit has been relegated to sidekick/wallpaper status, he needs more time being given his own development and not left as an afterthought before the two of them having a wedding would even be considered worth it, in my opinion.


Gambit is the #$%#$% KING OF THIEVES in the comicverse, but that barely even gets a whisper, and the last one who did was PAD. Anyone could use that, or resurfacing powers, or have him lead a team book for a year - THEN do the wedding. Otherwise the conversation will be like this:


"Oh hey, Rogue is getting married, can you believe it?"
"Really? Wow, that's awesome!"
"Yeah!"
"So uh... who is she getting married to? She hasn't dated anyone in a while, at least not seriously. It's not Magneto, is it? Wasn't he the last one? Or was it Deadpool?"
"Ugh no, it's actually Gambit."
"..."
"..."
"Really?"
"Uh, yeah, really."
"Didn't they break up, like, forever ago?"
"Yeah, but supposedly there was a mini that got them together again, then they immediately decided to tie the knot, I guess."
"That's... pretty lame."
"Yeah, but hey, it's Marvel."
"True."


I completely disagree with this statement. No one says "awesome" when they hear someone's getting married this days. Typically its a nonchalant "really? that's nice" then some exploratory questions, and perhaps some more well-wishes leading up the wedding with some "buts" left in to hedge bets.


This is going to go over some heads...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 08, 2018, 05:35:22 PM
...To turn around now and say well, I guess they've back together and now their married, especially as a double wedding my with a less popular couple, who is getting all the attention and promotion.


You do know this happened on Arrow/Flash like a couple months ago, right? Made me gag. Same guy that wrote that is writing this book, so...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on May 08, 2018, 06:42:10 PM

I completely disagree with this statement. No one says "awesome" when they hear someone's getting married this days. Typically its a nonchalant "really? that's nice" then some exploratory questions, and perhaps some more well-wishes leading up the wedding with some "buts" left in to hedge bets.


This is going to go over some heads...


It was meant to be over the top, unless I'm being thick in the head and you caught on to that.  :o
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on May 08, 2018, 10:53:45 PM

You do know this happened on Arrow/Flash like a couple months ago, right? Made me gag. Same guy that wrote that is writing this book, so...
Lol, I did learn that... scary thought...  :o
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 09, 2018, 08:46:23 AM

It was meant to be over the top, unless I'm being thick in the head and you caught on to that.  :o


I knew no one was going to get it...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cajunpirate on May 10, 2018, 09:21:33 AM
Happy I wasn't the only one who had the idea in my head. As I said, I don't like the idea either, but the past month or two with the Gambit appearances in books just made me think something was up. Looks like they are a couple again, which is a shame. There was so much potential with Gambit flirting with other female heroes...even X-Factor had him trying with Polaris.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 10, 2018, 09:48:06 AM
Happy I wasn't the only one who had the idea in my head. As I said, I don't like the idea either, but the past month or two with the Gambit appearances in books just made me think something was up. Looks like they are a couple again, which is a shame. There was so much potential with Gambit flirting with other female heroes...even X-Factor had him trying with Polaris.
Agreed, welcome to the "legion" ... if you haven't checked the other site and the sales thread, apparently it could be speculated the Legion of non-romys or Remy fans didn't support the book thus bad sales. It's easy to put the sales woes somewhere but ... I don't think it was the legion, imo.

http://community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?110950-X-Books-Sales-April (http://community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?110950-X-Books-Sales-April)

We will pick a Legion Commander .. perhaps a poll for one.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on May 10, 2018, 10:36:23 AM
I too would've loved to see Gambit and Polaris hook up for a little bit before going back to Rogue and Havok. Polaris was actually my favourite choice for Gambit to date after Rogue.
There was that one "date" Gambit had with Hellcat that was hilarious, even though Remy found her a little obnoxious...but I enjoyed the scene.


During Gambit's break from Rogue, he did sleep with other women, but meaningless and forgettable characters really, they all seemed like rebounds. I would've liked a known character, and not Belladonna or Frenzy...someone high profile, like Polaris.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 10, 2018, 11:47:40 AM
I too would've loved to see Gambit and Polaris hook up for a little bit before going back to Rogue and Havok. Polaris was actually my favourite choice for Gambit to date after Rogue.
There was that one "date" Gambit had with Hellcat that was hilarious, even though Remy found her a little obnoxious...but I enjoyed the scene.


During Gambit's break from Rogue, he did sleep with other women, but meaningless and forgettable characters really, they all seemed like rebounds. I would've liked a known character, and not Belladonna or Frenzy...someone high profile, like Polaris
.
I also wanted a high profile character for Gambit as well. Polaris - my favorite choice, followed by Sage and Jean ... Though Sage probably isn't as high profile.
Edit:
BTW - all of Rogue's flings during the break up have been high profile characters. Magneto, Torch (I know off panel, what ever), Deadpool or not Deadpool (no clue what is going on with that -whatever again) ... the point being ... Rogue's play  things are not the made for her types who no one cares about. Again, Rogue being treated a tad better than Gambit.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on May 10, 2018, 01:41:21 PM
Edit:
BTW - all of Rogue's flings during the break up have been high profile characters. Magneto, Torch (I know off panel, what ever), Deadpool or not Deadpool (no clue what is going on with that -whatever again) ... the point being ... Rogue's play  things are not the made for her types who no one cares about. Again, Rogue being treated a tad better than Gambit.


I don't believe Rogue and Deadpool did anything more than kiss, but I haven't actually been reading Avengers. To your second point, I think a lot of those times were cases of writers shipping their favorite characters w/ Rogue bc they have the hots for her, which (as a Rogue fan) kinda grosses me out.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 10, 2018, 02:28:37 PM

I don't believe Rogue and Deadpool did anything more than kiss, but I haven't actually been reading Avengers. To your second point, I think a lot of those times were cases of writers shipping their favorite characters w/ Rogue bc they have the hots for her, which (as a Rogue fan) kinda grosses me out.
I would agree on the shipping thing, especially with Magneto. However, I didn't find that as horrendous as others did.  :D
I don't know whats going on with Deadpool, which is why I was so vague.

The Torch thing was for story or something, and done off panel for no reason other than not having to put it in a book. Say it for drama and move on. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 10, 2018, 02:56:31 PM
If the past 25 years haven't told you all enough, Marvel allows Gambit to be a ladies man and romancer only off panel. And if any one you think that in today's climate that would change, you're out of feather plucking minds. But feel free to stay crazy my friends. Keeps life interesting.


I think I was the main voice for mini entitled "Gambit @&#&# the Marvel Universe" (title was a joke) where Gambit goes out on one date but throughout the span of 5 issues ends up on several "encounters" (She Hulk, Maria Hill, Viper, Spider-Woman etc, just all over the place) and in the midst of it all saves the world /universe from destruction. Similarly to the Buffy episode "the Zeppo", where Xander is pushed to the sidelines but goes off on his own adventures ultimately being the main proponent that saves the day and discovers himself.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on May 10, 2018, 06:57:20 PM
I also wanted a high profile character for Gambit as well. Polaris - my favorite choice, followed by Sage and Jean ... Though Sage probably isn't as high profile.
Edit:
BTW - all of Rogue's flings during the break up have been high profile characters. Magneto, Torch (I know off panel, what ever), Deadpool or not Deadpool (no clue what is going on with that -whatever again) ... the point being ... Rogue's play  things are not the made for her types who no one cares about. Again, Rogue being treated a tad better than Gambit.


I agree with your list of potential Gambit girlfriends, post-break up. It's a shame PAD didn't properly develop the Polaris/Gambit relationship. A missed opportunity if you ask me.


I guess one could rationalize Gambit's lack of relationships with A-listers as him having adopted a "don't date a teammate" attitude after Rogue broke his heart...but honestly, I don't think the writers gave it that much thought.

I actually didn't mind Rogue/Deadpool. I found it more believable than Rogue/Magneto. Deadpool's got a great sense of humour and while Magneto makes a good villain, he's otherwise just...well...a bit boring IMHO.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 10, 2018, 10:20:05 PM
As obvious as the Rogue/ Deadpool thing was, you're right, it did make more sense than Magneto.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on May 10, 2018, 10:30:05 PM
I want to ask why ... why is Deadpool more acceptable than Magneto? I am not looking for a character vs character thing - but why?
Or did I miss something ... in the end though ... it is what it is ... but  .... I'm not really understanding this entire issue.
From my pov - Rogue is sowing her oats as it were and Gambit ... is held accountable for doing the same thing.
I don't get it. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on May 10, 2018, 11:25:51 PM
Deadpool is more mainstream?
Deadpool is more relateable?
Deadpool isn't a on-again, off-again megalomaniac?
The Magneto and Rogue angle had already been done in AoA, so people prefer something different?
Deadpool doesn't suffer from delusions of grandeur? Just regular delusions for him.



Just throwing possibilities out there...


I don't understand the whole 'Rogue can do whatever with whoever' angle either. The most action Gambit gets outside of Rogue (on panel) is a kiss with Jean-bot in the danger room, having his lips assaulted by Sage when he was blind, and a cringy-why-did-it-happen-this-way kiss with Polaris.


Oh yeah, and he got set up to sleep with his boss's wife at Serval. *shrug*
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on May 10, 2018, 11:29:08 PM
Well, there are a number of reasons why I, personally, dislike the Rogue/Magneto relationship, but the one point I really can't wrap my head around or rationalize is mainly this one: Magneto was the one behind the trial of Gambit. Gambit nearly died in Antarctica. It ruined their relationship and it traumatized both of them (as evidenced in R+G). Plus, let's not forget that Magneto filmed everything.


I mean, I can understand if Rogue had a crush on Magneto way back when, but to have an older more mature version of herself (who knows Magneto was behind it all) just...forgive and forget? I just don't buy it. Lord knows, I like Rogue a lot, but I don't think she's that forgiving. That's why it never made sense to me.  :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on May 11, 2018, 09:56:12 AM
Deadpool is funnier, basically. When it comes to violence in media, funnier is always more 'acceptable' because it seems less real, and more like a cartoon. And Deadpool's never done bad stuff to her before (like kidnap her and lock her in a cave) they also didn't have bad power dynamic, Deadpool wasn't the her 'boss' nor was he supposed to be more powerful. Whereas mags is always more powerful and always in charge in some way. In legacy he was 'Vice President of uptopia and in AoA he was literal her boss/teacher/foster father. I still don't like Rogue/Deadpool because if it ever did go anywhere, she'd have to give up all of her moral/philosophy ideals to stay with him, which is not good, and he'd be an incredibly annoying boyfriend. But most people still find annoying boyfriends more acceptable than domonieering and frankly, abusive boyfriends.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on May 11, 2018, 12:10:30 PM
Deadpool's a far better choice for Rogue than Magneto. Far less depressing as well...
As much as I HATE seeing Gambit in love-triangles, one that involves Deadpool could actually be half-entertaining if written well. But I really don't have the energy to read something like that ever again to be honest, but I'm sure there's a lot of unimaginative writers at Marvel plotting such garbage.
Though the Joelle triangle was great, because it was actually refreshing to see Rogue act jealous for once and have her chasing Gambit around, especially after she ignored him throughout Legacy while he was chasing her like a pathetic unwanted puppy. Such an embarrassing time to be a Gambit fan.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on May 11, 2018, 02:51:51 PM
Man forget all that. In Anarctica ge tortured them, filmed them having sex at least twice and then kept the tape. All just to play mind games that ended with Gambit nearly dieing a slow death. Before that, he spent a lot of the last decade in direct conflict with the X-Men. Nearly killed several of their friends. It's personal.


Deadpool was just a another guy. No reason to really dislike it other than it was another example of a writer sticking Rogue with their favorite character.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on May 30, 2018, 06:59:19 PM
For those interested, this episode of "Marvel Quickdraw" has Daniel Warren Johnson drawing Gambit & Rogue:


http://marvel.com/videos/watch/6753?linkId=52362437 (http://marvel.com/videos/watch/6753?linkId=52362437)


I wish they would have focused a bit more on the drawing part... :(
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on May 31, 2018, 02:07:33 AM
For those interested, this episode of "Marvel Quickdraw" has Daniel Warren Johnson drawing Gambit & Rogue:


http://marvel.com/videos/watch/6753?linkId=52362437 (http://marvel.com/videos/watch/6753?linkId=52362437)


I wish they would have focused a bit more on the drawing part... :(


Thanks. I liked it ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on May 31, 2018, 10:01:04 AM

I wish they would have focused a bit more on the drawing part... :(


Yeah, having never watched any of these before, the title felt a little deceiving haha I thought it would be more of a time-lapse. Still a cool video though, and I really like that sketch he did.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on June 04, 2018, 07:01:43 PM
Glad y'all liked it.  :)  I just noticed that on Marvel's Instagram account, the preview of the Quickdraw episode focused entirely on the drawing. Voilà:


https://www.instagram.com/p/BjaaHuPlsO9/?hl=en&taken-by=marvel (https://www.instagram.com/p/BjaaHuPlsO9/?hl=en&taken-by=marvel)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on June 05, 2018, 10:21:00 AM
Not sure if anyone follows Jim Lee's Twitch, but he did a live drawing of Gambit and Rogue yesterday. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/268969943
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: belay on June 05, 2018, 10:36:33 AM
That looks so amazing. I love Jim Lee's work so much and he is one of my all time favourite artists along with Clay Mann.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on June 05, 2018, 04:07:44 PM
R0d got his question answered in X-Po:Love is in the air, as R0d asks, “What are the odds for a Rogue & Gambit Volume 2? A five issue miniseries wasn’t enough, we need more of them and from Kelly Thompson, she is great.”White: I will say that I would certainly enjoy that as a reader. I’ve heard from a lot of fans who feel the same way. It’s certainly something we will consider. R&G are one of the most fun couples in the X-Universe, up there with Scott & Jean in my heart.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on June 05, 2018, 04:12:33 PM
Not sure if anyone follows Jim Lee's Twitch, but he did a live drawing of Gambit and Rogue yesterday. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/268969943 (https://www.twitch.tv/videos/268969943)
Thank you! Love Lee's art.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on June 05, 2018, 04:26:22 PM
R0d got his question answered in X-Po:Love is in the air, as R0d asks, “What are the odds for a Rogue & Gambit Volume 2? A five issue miniseries wasn’t enough, we need more of them and from Kelly Thompson, she is great.”White: I will say that I would certainly enjoy that as a reader. I’ve heard from a lot of fans who feel the same way. It’s certainly something we will consider. R&G are one of the most fun couples in the X-Universe, up there with Scott & Jean in my heart.


Kind of a non-committal answer but that's cool he answered. It means they're at least conscious of the demand for more R&G
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on June 05, 2018, 07:01:34 PM
Not sure if anyone follows Jim Lee's Twitch, but he did a live drawing of Gambit and Rogue yesterday. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/268969943 (https://www.twitch.tv/videos/268969943)
Wow, what talent. He draws such an amazing Gambit.  :smitten:



Kind of a non-committal answer but that's cool he answered. It means they're at least conscious of the demand for more R&G


Yeah, it's kind of encouraging...and yet, not really. I'm never sure if they mean it or they're just leading us on.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on June 06, 2018, 02:22:51 AM
Ahah, Nox I love your avatar.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on June 06, 2018, 02:37:50 PM
Ahah, Nox I love your avatar.


Yeah, that's pretty great haha
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on June 06, 2018, 06:33:45 PM
Ahah, Nox I love your avatar.

Yeah, that's pretty great haha
LOL! Thanks.  ;)  Of all of Pere Perez's art in R+G, I just love that Gambit image. Remy's got that trademark 90's smirk.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on June 06, 2018, 11:31:39 PM
Couple things I wouldn't mind seeing in a future vol;


I think tackling their relationship from the more Gambit centric side would be interesting. I'd recommend using Laura in a more little sister role. Have her no be completely sold on the idea of Gambit being back with Rogue. Not from a jealousy standpoint, but more like a bratty little sister. For all intents and purposes, Laura has only heard of the two together, never been around with them as a couple. Let her ask the hard questions, but more from protective stance of Gambit. We've had other characters (and creators) do the same for Rogue. Laura can ask Gambit "why are you doing this again?" It could be both rhetorical and real as Laura may not be all that familiar with romantic forgiveness.


Oli and Becca; their son and daughter from the "The End" timeline. We've seen the couple get wrapped up in time travel exploits before. Perhaps bring back that Princess Gem thing. Have them glimpse or briefly visit that future timeline. Get some reactions from them and even tie up Oli's issues with his father. He blamed Gambit for Rogue's death. Give the character some closure and I'd love to have KT write Rogue's reaction to meeting her possible adult children, probably something she never thought she'd have, then given hope, just to have it ripped away again when her powers got scrambled back in UA.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on June 07, 2018, 10:19:35 AM

I think tackling their relationship from the more Gambit centric side would be interesting. I'd recommend using Laura in a more little sister role. Have her no be completely sold on the idea of Gambit being back with Rogue. Not from a jealousy standpoint, but more like a bratty little sister. For all intents and purposes, Laura has only heard of the two together, never been around with them as a couple. Let her ask the hard questions, but more from protective stance of Gambit. We've had other characters (and creators) do the same for Rogue. Laura can ask Gambit "why are you doing this again?" It could be both rhetorical and real as Laura may not be all that familiar with romantic forgiveness.



I reeaally like this idea. Especially with how much he stuck up for her when Hellion was being an a-hole and helped her through that. It would be cool to see a callback to that
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on June 07, 2018, 06:21:48 PM
Couple things I wouldn't mind seeing in a future vol;


I think tackling their relationship from the more Gambit centric side would be interesting. I'd recommend using Laura in a more little sister role. Have her no be completely sold on the idea of Gambit being back with Rogue. Not from a jealousy standpoint, but more like a bratty little sister. For all intents and purposes, Laura has only heard of the two together, never been around with them as a couple. Let her ask the hard questions, but more from protective stance of Gambit. We've had other characters (and creators) do the same for Rogue. Laura can ask Gambit "why are you doing this again?" It could be both rhetorical and real as Laura may not be all that familiar with romantic forgiveness.


Oli and Becca; their son and daughter from the "The End" timeline. We've seen the couple get wrapped up in time travel exploits before. Perhaps bring back that Princess Gem thing. Have them glimpse or briefly visit that future timeline. Get some reactions from them and even tie up Oli's issues with his father. He blamed Gambit for Rogue's death. Give the character some closure and I'd love to have KT write Rogue's reaction to meeting her possible adult children, probably something she never thought she'd have, then given hope, just to have it ripped away again when her powers got scrambled back in UA.


That triple team-up book with Laura would be pretty great, actually. I really like that idea.


I'd love the idea of bringing back something like GeNext (that's what it was called, I think?). I thought it was a great concept. Wasn't totally sold on the roster though...I think a few x-kids had mystery parentage, right? Which I didn't understand. You have a ton of interesting X-couples to pick from, why would CC not capitalize on that?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on June 08, 2018, 03:49:36 AM
Don, it seems someone really liked your idea and asked KT.





Someone on CBR pointed out the fact that Laura would be protective towards Gambit and would act a bit bratty towards Rogue like a little sister that wouldn't completely trust her big brother's girlfriend because of their past issues. I think that would be quite cool to read. What are your thoughts ?


I can see how Laura might not be completely trusting of Rogue, but I also think Laura really respects people’s privacy and their agency. I don’t see her as interfering in whatever choices Remy is going to make. She knows he’s an adult and she knows that only he knows what’s best for him. She’s also not inclined to interfere or be bratty/dramatic. It’s just not who she is.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on June 08, 2018, 09:04:08 AM
... well thats weird, someone running off with the idea lol. But yeah, of course, Laura wouldn't go out of her way, but if some reason they were unavoidably stuck together (the 3 of them), then something would be there. Perhaps set it off at the mansion or in the city and have Gambit deliberately bring her along for something after noticing the tension, just to have it blow up in his face, but in the end it's squashed..but that's probably better for a two-issue arc in an ongoing not a 5 part mini.


Eff it. Writing another short story.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on June 08, 2018, 06:11:15 PM
Don, it seems someone really liked your idea and asked KT.


Well, it wasn't me! LOL. I still think it's a good story idea though...
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on June 19, 2018, 07:03:33 PM
KT interview:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7PFYRtpumY&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7PFYRtpumY&feature=youtu.be)

No real spoilers there, since it was filmed before she was able to talk about Mr & Mrs X.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: jpraner on June 21, 2018, 11:25:06 PM
Quote from: Nekobaghira link=topic=5109. msg73448#msg73448 date=1525967260
I also wanted a high profile character for Gambit as well.  Polaris - my favorite choice, followed by Sage and Jean . . .  Though Sage probably isn't as high profile.
Edit:
BTW - all of Rogue's flings during the break up have been high profile characters.  Magneto, Torch (I know off panel, what ever), Deadpool or not Deadpool (no clue what is going on with that -whatever again) . . .  the point being . . .  Rogue's play  things are not the made for her types who no one cares about.  Again, Rogue being treated a tad better than Gambit.


I feel like she has been made into an (o) by the writers.  She might have slept with higher profile characters but it's just added to her terrible reputation.  I'm glad she's being written as more likable recently.  I feel like Remender and others have degraded her personality over time and this may be a return to her 90s earnest-ness. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on June 21, 2018, 11:27:40 PM
Welcome jpraner to the forum.

There is the thing about writers wanting to insert themselves into the narrative, I don't know if its true. But ... maybe that is the why the treatment of being with the fav of the month would be. :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on June 22, 2018, 12:24:06 AM
...perhaps using a word other than "insert" would be better. ;)


But if you look at whom and how it's done it's hard to ignore. It's nearly always the writers favorite and typically the one that's handling some or all the of the books pov. They can't have Rogue themselves, might as well imagine what it's like via their comic avatar. I will say Deadpool was the tamest example even though unlike the rest, Duggan observed it outside of the book occurred. He sorta carried it over into his Deadpool solo. Wade seemed more taken with Rogue than she was willing to go with him.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on June 22, 2018, 12:34:18 AM
...perhaps using a word other than "insert" would be better. ;)
Its the right word and you know it! LMAO
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on June 22, 2018, 12:37:25 AM
Its the right word and you know it! LMAO


Well that would have "narrative" mean something completely different than what Websters explains.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on June 22, 2018, 01:15:39 AM

Well that would have "narrative" mean something completely different than what Websters explains.
Oh c'mon .... "narrative", insert the writer to be apart of a story that they are writing to give them the perspective they want. LOL
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on June 22, 2018, 09:28:09 AM
Lol, 'insert' is a completely accurate word for the situation.  ;D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DearMachine on June 22, 2018, 09:55:04 AM
Weirdly, I thought KT had a good explanation for Rogue's behavior.  For most of her adult life, she wasn't able to touch anyone, and she had only really dated one person (well, maybe Joseph too, maybe), let alone had serious, long-term relationships.  She's in love with Gambit, but also knows they've had a very complicated, tempestuous relationship, and is scared that she is making a terrible mistake with him out of lack of experience.  So, she plays the field.  She gets with guys who are interested in her, and, after Magneto, maybe goes for people with whom she doesn't have a deep emotional connection, because she wants something uncomplicated.  Torch is pretty.  Deadpool is . . .  fun? Why not? She's single. 


Yeah, I know it's a retcon of some bad male writing, but it's a good retcon.  It makes sense.

Plus, Rogue canonically has terrible taste in men.  She had a serious crush on Longshot, which is all the evidence you need . . .  even if Joseph did not exist, and he does.  She just got lucky with Gambit.  :D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on June 23, 2018, 10:22:03 AM
Not even 'in her adult life', she never had a boyfriend as a teenager either, because of her powers and her crazy mom.  And she didn't even really have that mini ch of an 'emotional connection ' to mags, because it feel apart so fast and there was brainwashing involved . Yes I know the 'real' reason was because it was not a good story, did not take off and did not become the next Scott and Emma, and so other writers didn't stick with it. ;) So yeah, good enough explanation, though even Carey said the fake memories/brainwashing was a factor, I kinda wish KT had gone with that more, but we don't get everything we want.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on June 23, 2018, 08:40:14 PM
Oh c'mon .... "narrative", insert the writer to be apart of a story that they are writing to give them the perspective they want. LOL


I don't think you caught my joke. It was rather crude anyway.  :-[  but still funny and accurate.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on June 23, 2018, 08:46:07 PM

I don't think you caught my joke. It was rather crude anyway.  :-[  but still funny and accurate.
oh, I guess I didn't. That happens to me sometimes, really annoying when it happens irl.  ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on June 23, 2018, 11:18:36 PM
Ok ok ok...


If "insert" is them using a character to infuse the story with thenself, it's a literary stand in for their member. Follow me now. If that's the case, then in this bit of wordplay, the "narrative" is figuratively the.........
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on June 26, 2018, 06:22:13 PM
From Skottie Young's instagram...
It's a variant cover for MMX (not sure which issue) I'll have to check the solicits again.


(https://78.media.tumblr.com/b6e52b1023098da2259fa2b4ceece97e/tumblr_pawbdtTw6d1qes700o1_1280.jpg)

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DearMachine on June 26, 2018, 09:06:42 PM
I normally don't like Skottie Young's covers very much, but that is adorable. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on June 27, 2018, 08:40:39 AM
...I need this cover...  :o
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on June 27, 2018, 10:18:57 AM
Skottie Young doesn't often draw Gambit but I always love what he does with him. Definitely going to pick this up
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paneo01 on July 02, 2018, 08:25:52 PM
Darn...this isnt good :(

Quote
@LarrysComics
1h
Haw. It’s a legendary bat run. The trades & back issues just fly. You’re dead balls wrong. RT @ldsanty: @LarrysComics @RyanHigginsRyan Take a look at your orders for Rogue/Gambit Mini Series @Marvel just completed. Couldn't even sell 3 copies in store. Made it easy for us to pass
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on July 02, 2018, 09:08:20 PM
what? what does that mean? Who's Larry?
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on July 02, 2018, 10:37:57 PM
I too am having trouble deciphering what that means
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Paradox Jast on July 02, 2018, 11:35:01 PM
Well, based on Google searches... the bad and/or controversial things about people who have an internet presence seem to float to the top, and while there isn't a lot of negativity... what does appear is pretty ugly. Most of it was years ago. Seems like he's been in the business for a while, but his latest things show him being rather cross with the 'bait and switch' stuff, so that likely also attributed to his 'pass' attitude.


The mini sold well enough for them to greenlight MMX, regardless of what one LCS may or may not have sold.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on July 03, 2018, 12:01:52 AM
Darn...this isnt good :(



We'll see how the bat/cat wedding sells now that it's been spoiled by the NY Times (I'm not posting a link, because writer Tom King is pretty annoyed by the reveal, so I'm not sure if they were supposed to announce it).


That being said, the Rogue fans amongst us should check out KT's twitter. Judging by the image posted, the art for M&MX will be top-notch, I think.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DearMachine on July 03, 2018, 08:00:35 AM
I went back to the Twitter thread.


Marvel is not doing a great job with the Mr & Mrs X roll-out. They haven't communicated to their retailers what the book actually is, and they're screwing around with the cover variants. Apparently, many people collect J. Scott Campbell covers, and they've made them incentive (i.e. the store buys 25/100 regular covers and gets 1 variant cover) vs open-order (i.e. the store can order the variant covers directly).


I think it's legitimate that comic store owners are annoyed about that, since it's hurting their ability to run their business.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on July 03, 2018, 09:28:17 AM
Yeah, I was already concerned about the way they we're handling it initially. When you have a major book coming out and your secretive about that the retailers have no idea (because not everyone has time to be on the net) what it's called or the name is different than what's on the order form, then it becomes an issue. As soon as it was official Marverl should sent out free promotional poster and the such to make sure it's in front of the buyers... Stupid non-descript title doesn't help matters.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on July 03, 2018, 10:48:17 AM
Yeah, I finally went into my LCS this last weekend to put that on my pull list and they kind of rolled their eyes and were going on about how pissed they were at Marvel. For example, in their order form it was still listed as X Classified. I really hope Marvel's lack of communication doesn't make the sales tank for this book.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on July 03, 2018, 06:25:02 PM
Does Marvel track digital sales or is it just the physical copies sold? I've stopped going to shops, because it's too much of a hassle. I just get the digital copy then buy the trade when it comes out.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on July 03, 2018, 06:59:06 PM
Does Marvel track digital sales or is it just the physical copies sold? I've stopped going to shops, because it's too much of a hassle. I just get the digital copy then buy the trade when it comes out.


Marvel tracks them. They have to. They just don't release the numbers.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on July 03, 2018, 07:10:54 PM

Marvel tracks them. They have to. They just don't release the numbers.


Right! Thanks. I don't understand why they don't post the numbers.  ???
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: anya on July 03, 2018, 08:10:23 PM
No businesses release their sale data, really. Only as much as is required by law, for like shareholders and such. Sales info is considered propriety data, (they don't want competitors to get ahold of that info) if any employee who knew it released it publicly they would be fired and likely sued by Marvel. The numbers that get argued about on forums are not 'released' by marvel, estimates made by comichron, trying to guess the sales. 


Long story short, marvel absolutely tracks digital sales, but they ain't never gonna release those numbers. They'll only talk about them in generalities.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on July 03, 2018, 08:23:14 PM
No businesses release their sale data, really. Only as much as is required by law, for like shareholders and such. Sales info is considered propriety data, (they don't want competitors to get ahold of that info) if any employee who knew it released it publicly they would be fired and likely sued by Marvel. The numbers that get argued about on forums are not 'released' by marvel, estimates made by comichron, trying to guess the sales. 


Long story short, marvel absolutely tracks digital sales, but they ain't never gonna release those numbers. They'll only talk about them in generalities.


Ah, I see. Thanks for explaining.  :)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Sparta on July 03, 2018, 11:40:08 PM
In regards of comic sales (printed), Gail Simone explains it quite well on the 2nd page of this thread...


http://community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?112541-X-Books-Sales-for-May/page2


I'll just quote her here...


Quote
They are estimates of a narrow but significant number. They are valuable mostly in comparison to other numbers estimated the exact same way, ie. month by month for the same title, or in overall comparison to other titles. They can be useful determining market share (though it’s still a guess), but are less valuable in determining dollar share (for which they are pretty much useless).[/size]It’s data, but it’s not hugely useful for the result people most often use it to express. Anyone calling themselves an expert based on these numbers simply doesn’t know the full picture. Retailers know more, publishers know more still, and even creators don;t get a full picture until MUCH later. In some cases, we never really do get the full picture. So we can be completely in the dark for months at a time. There’s no condescension here, it’s just multiple revenue streams and the fact that many purchase outlets are not included in this estimate.It’s odd. And honestly, we are often just as in the dark as anyone. Insider sales knowledge can be hard to come by and very slow to arrive. But when it does arrive, there are a lot of outlets that this estimate doesn’t cover.Hope that makes sense. It’s good information, and on the whole it can be meaningful, but some books are hugely profitable in ways this list doesn’t even cover. The reverse is also true, some sales numbers are inflated and don’t actually get purchased.I wish this stuff was a lot more transparent. Hope that helps![/color]



She was referring to the 70% drop of sales in Domino #2 (according to the public sales charts).


...and that's probably why a book like 'Iceman' got another shot at an ongoing. Even though Iceman's sales numbers towards the end were in just 4-digit numbers (maybe as low as 8,000), but apparently it did well in TPB form (and maybe digitally too?). It also had solid reviews (sometimes quality wins). Perhaps it was the same for 'Rogue & Gambit'. I noticed most of the Tumblr ROMY fans were posting screenshots of their DIGITAL purchase, and it had a big social media response.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on July 04, 2018, 12:56:09 AM
Yeah, I read that on CBR to. It's a nice way of saying the numbers that are given to us are not exact and we're not telling. All anyone can do is look at how many books are sold at each shop and try to devise a rough estimate. If that estimate isn't to the creators/publishers liking, then they should just release the daggon numbers and stop fighting critics with phantom figures. Can't have it both ways. Basically telling the public "you don't know, but we kind of do, but won't tell you, so stop making educated guesses".



Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on July 10, 2018, 05:04:53 PM
Not fully agree here.
Maybe that sales not full but they give more then enough info.


If you are under 20k and you are not Captain Marvel then you will be cancelled.
Iceman sold a lot as trades so they gave him 2nd chance.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on July 11, 2018, 02:53:44 PM
But you see... We don't know what those numbers are. That's the problem lol.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on July 11, 2018, 03:56:24 PM
Eh Marvel can say what they want about trade as the numbers are not public.  Did Iceman magically sell more in trade and of so why?  Or is it the case they gave it a second chance because someone at Marvel thinks it fits their agenda. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on July 11, 2018, 04:13:19 PM
Eh Marvel can say what they want about trade as the numbers are not public.  Did Iceman magically sell more in trade and of so why?  Or is it the case they gave it a second chance because someone at Marvel thinks it fits their agenda.


I agree. They gave first solo only because he became gay.
I am not a fan of writer.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on July 11, 2018, 04:19:36 PM
Eh Marvel can say what they want about trade as the numbers are not public.  Did Iceman magically sell more in trade and of so why?  Or is it the case they gave it a second chance because someone at Marvel thinks it fits their agenda.


They said it did well in trades. But it's a mini, not an ongoing as they don't make known. If people believe it's a ongoing the sales will be higher, specifically for issue 1.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on July 11, 2018, 06:54:31 PM
I know they did.  I am saying without numbers that is subjective.  What is well mean?  I think it entirely possible that other books did better in trade but still got canceled for various reasons.  Unless you see Iceman numbers and can compare it to other books then it did well in trade is a meaningless comment.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: saksiv on July 12, 2018, 04:22:32 AM
Hello Guys!


When it comes to sales numbers, I think they don`t represent anything at all.  Because today its mostly digital, and thre are more "readers" world wide than "collectors".


Here is my reasoning. [/size]Most ROMY shippers come from XTAS, and XTAS was actually aired around the globe.  So you can imagine how many shippers are out there. And the best part about it is that they are adults (around 30) and adults have money to spend and dont have time to search for scans. I read the mini on bus on my phone with marvell app.  it was greate!I lurk in Russsian internet.  And guess what 40% of X-men fanfiction is Romy.
So its possible that on paper the mini didn`t sell well, but on didgital it could have outsold anybook. I believe that when the first issue of RG mini by KT went to sale. Te Marketing guy who saw the numbers was like: "Exclusive deal to Kelly Thompson!!! Hijack the wedding!!!! RG Ongoing!!!"))
[/color]
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: saksiv on July 12, 2018, 04:33:52 AM
Oh and marvell also wont ever reveal those numbers because of work ethics.


Just imagine what a toxic enviorment it would be if the creators knew how much actual money each of them bring to company. 
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on July 12, 2018, 07:18:18 AM
I know they did.  I am saying without numbers that is subjective.  What is well mean?  I think it entirely possible that other books did better in trade but still got canceled for various reasons.  Unless you see Iceman numbers and can compare it to other books then it did well in trade is a meaningless comment.


I'm in 100% agreement with you, remydat.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: DonPriceTag on July 12, 2018, 07:56:58 AM
I know they did.  I am saying without numbers that is subjective.  What is well mean?  I think it entirely possible that other books did better in trade but still got canceled for various reasons.  Unless you see Iceman numbers and can compare it to other books then it did well in trade is a meaningless comment.


You know I wasnt debating you, right? The way you worded it in your post it didn't sound rhetorical. Because it was exactly the reason they gave lol. I couldn't care less about this book.


But if they are basing the revival off of this, then why not pump out graphic novels every few months instead of pressuring shops to buy monthly books that won't sell?


Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: cc008 on July 12, 2018, 10:10:37 AM
But if they are basing the revival off of this, then why not pump out graphic novels every few months instead of pressuring shops to buy monthly books that won't sell?


That was my argument at cbr, don. I mentioned why not just release OGN's if that's where the book is successful. I can't remember why that was shot down, but someone had some rebuttal for it.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on July 12, 2018, 10:11:09 AM

But if they are basing the revival off of this, then why not pump out graphic novels every few months instead of pressuring shops to buy monthly books that won't sell?
Or use their lame marketing scheme to bolster books for a variant, some of which doesn't benefit the book the variant was commissioned for.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: remydat on July 12, 2018, 07:10:38 PM

You know I wasnt debating you, right? The way you worded it in your post it didn't sound rhetorical. Because it was exactly the reason they gave lol. I couldn't care less about this book.

But if they are basing the revival off of this, then why not pump out graphic novels every few months instead of pressuring shops to buy monthly books that won't sell?


It is a psychology thing.  Spending 3.99 or 4.99 a month seems more reasonable than spending 20+ dollars on a graphic novel particularly when you can buy a novel with a ton more story for less than that amount.  They likely fear some of those monthly buyers dropping out of the market altogether and aren't smart enough to come up with a marketing campaign to prevent that.

Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on August 13, 2018, 04:46:43 AM
I made some fanart and decided to share it here too :)


(https://78.media.tumblr.com/f9882c0f56203e3cb62fac639f5b31ee/tumblr_pde5ikSZWP1s9oaz7o1_540.jpg)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: magicrubbish on August 13, 2018, 09:24:52 AM
OMG ! This artwork is so so beautiful.  Magical , just like Romy ! They're indeed star crossed lovers.  Their love story , for the most part , comprises of stuffs that makes fairy tales.   :smitten: :smitten: :smitten:
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on August 13, 2018, 09:31:06 AM
OMG ! This artwork is so so beautiful.  Magical , just like Romy ! They're indeed star crossed lovers.  Their love story , for the most part , comprises of stuffs that makes fairy tales.   :smitten: :smitten: :smitten:


Thank you for kind words! Happy that you liked ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: bark_no_byte on August 13, 2018, 09:40:34 AM
Holy s*** that's amazing haha nice work!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on August 13, 2018, 10:49:41 AM
Holy s*** that's amazing haha nice work!


Thank you :gambit:
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nekobaghira on August 13, 2018, 03:02:27 PM
Great job Purp! Looks great.  :D
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on August 13, 2018, 04:07:55 PM
Great job Purp! Looks great.  :D


Thanks, Boss ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on August 17, 2018, 06:52:50 PM
Beautiful art, Purp!
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on August 17, 2018, 07:36:29 PM
Beautiful art, Purp!


Thanks! Glad that you liked ;)
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: andresa on August 17, 2018, 08:21:44 PM
From KT's tumblr:

"I’m sure Rogue’s ex killing gambit’s ex-wife would have made the tone of things very different."

"Agreed. Regardless of anything else, Belladonna is currently planned to show up in MMX #6!"
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: Nox on August 17, 2018, 08:32:30 PM
From KT's tumblr:

"I’m sure Rogue’s ex killing gambit’s ex-wife would have made the tone of things very different."

"Agreed. Regardless of anything else, Belladonna is currently planned to show up in MMX #6!"


Well, I guess we can assume that it might (maybe) take place in New Orleans and hopefully feature Jean-Luc and Tante Matti as well? Looking forward to it, for sure.
Title: Re: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk
Post by: purplevit on August 18, 2018, 02:32:45 AM
From KT's tumblr:

"I’m sure Rogue’s ex killing gambit’s ex-wife would have made the tone of things very different."

"Agreed. Regardless of anything else, Belladonna is currently planned to show up in MMX #6!"


Cool! Fingers crossed for Jean-Luc and Tante to appear.