Topic: Rogue & Gambit- Discussion/ Spoiler Talk

[Nekobaghira]

I don't mean to be skeptical but I'll believe what she says after reading a few issues. Just because she really wants Gambit fans to buy her series and is saying the right things, doesn't mean it's what we're going to get. All I can say is, I hope we do.

Agreed. I'm not completely sold mostly because writers have fed fans lines of bs before, this one would be no different. Perhaps its a jaded view but by this point in time - the Gambit fan has been dragged with pretty words and no delivery on the pretty words for a few years now. The truth will be in the issues.

As for the list Don, all good except for the cats.  *teasing you*

[DonPriceTag]

no, no, no, I know your stance on those flea-bags! You love them. As for the book, well of course she has to walk the walk, but there a few out there that aren't even willing to give it a shot, despite her openness. The only other writer that interacted this much (positively, Carey had some wars and that was BEFORE Twitter) with fans was Asmus, who even granted our little corner of the internet a visit. Last I checked no one was saying go sign up a for a pre-sale. However wishing Gambit into a oblivion is counter productive if your a comic reading fan. It's not absurd to want to see him in a book and written well. Otherwise, why are we here? To talk about decades old story lines and a 17 issue run? Having a hostile fandom especially with how sensitive creators are nowadays can't do anything but push interest away from the character. I'm a comic fan. I like reading comic books (can't believe I'm reading a DC title [Mr Miracle] and might even start reading more. See what you've done to me Marvel?!) and I'd prefer to read my favorite character occasionally, preferably portrayed as competent.

[Nekobaghira]

RE: Rogue and Gambit book. (edit for clarity)

The characters are polarizing. That divide between fans created by Marvel itself with poor story telling, and bad decisions. Add in poor characterization and bad attitude  with some writers and lets be honest - very little delivery of the "goods", this is a combination that does not lend itself to "lets get on the bandwagon" for this thing. Not defending, pointing out that the opposition to this book has its foundation.

Written well has YET to be seen. All that has been given is some press and opinions that sound favorable. PAD said good things too. Carey straight up lied for the most part but clearly knew the characters. Asmus was editorially hand tied. The B Boys (DvG) only did a mini for the money. The track record doesn't look good.

[DonPriceTag]

polarizing ...are we talking about the cats or Gambit and Rogue. Because I reeeeaaaally hate those cats. Not cats in general. I'm big dog guy, but I do enjoy cats.


I understand what you mean. And your forgot Lui. She promised a Gambit arc in AST. Never got it. But to have this cynical attitude for something we have no idea what it is won't help matters. Writers get around the net. They do read comments and posts. Creating a less than peaceful attitude around the subject matter will scare creators away (because they are sensitive and net response DOES effect them). I consider myself a "super fan" of Gambit, there aint much I dont know about the character. But I'm never going to allow my fandom to override my sense or reason. Gambit is a comic book character. It's great that he's finally getting a movie, but to hold onto that only... that's an appearance every couple of years, at best. Gambit isn't slated for any other book. Creators most often have freedom to use characters  as they see fit and if I was one and got around and saw this a 3 to 4 month-early backlash from Gambit fans (I'm not saying here or even CBR is the end all but they do visit. it's a fact) about something they even haven't read or them saying they won't even keep an open mind, I might pass on using him to spare my social media timeline. To each their own but while I'd rather he'd not be used than be used badly, I'm not satisfied with limbo. Outside of this mini, he's not slated to be anywhere else. Hopefully the movie spawns a solo or at least a team birth.


And before anybody catches feelings, I'm open the idea of this BOOK because I want to read a good book with Gambit in it (AST is a good book, but Gambit is weak as hell in it). The relationship part is whatever to me. I'm historically a Romy fan, but not at the expense of Gambit's character. I'm the one that made this poll and I'm one of two people that believe that this book is an instrument to split them up. That part doesn't concern me too much, more than how Gambit get's portrayed. I wasn't even all that happy about KT writing it until I started talking to her. Now I'm more open to idea and her ability to write Gambit. I'm giving her a chance. Ain't no "gushing" over here. If we're resigned to not caring but a possible comic future because of the past... why the *bleep* are we here and not just in the movie sections of this and CBRs board?

[Nekobaghira]

I completely skipped the cat thing, it was a joke and I know you don't like them. I love cats, I've lived with cats all my life so there is no problem with them for me ever. and you and I agreed long ago to agree to disagree on them. They're more for fun or teasing now than any actual discussion. 

I focused on the The Rogue and Gambit Book and your comments regarding those who are dismissing or wishing G into oblivion instead of jumping up and down for joy based on some nice words by a writer. I should have added a regarding thing which I will do now.

[DonPriceTag]

See that's what I'm talking about, "jumping up and down"? I'm not saying that should be us or anybody. There's a huge difference in "joy" which I've seen on CBR and spewing straight venom for Gambit's sake. I'm not "jumping for joy" because I' havent read it, but I'm also not damning Gambit to oblivion at the thought of him being around Rogue. I was skeptical, but after talking KT, I'm giving her chance. Instead of stamping feet in the ground, go to Tumblr and Twitter and do the same yall. Might be surprised. At least enough to stop wishing oblivion.

[cc008]

See that's what I'm talking about, "jumping up and down"? I'm not saying that should be us or anybody. There's a huge difference in "joy" which I've seen on CBR and spewing straight venom for Gambit's sake. I'm not "jumping for joy" because I' havent read it, but I'm also not damning Gambit to oblivion at the thought of him being around Rogue. I was skeptical, but after talking KT, I'm giving her chance. Instead of stamping feet in the ground, go to Tumblr and Twitter and do the same yall. Might be surprised. At least enough to stop wishing oblivion.

I agree Don, because I felt the same way. Very skeptical. But the fact that Gambit is headlining a book again (whether he's second billing or not) and is being written by someone who has been very vocal about how she wants to treat him in ways that I certainly agree with, I'm gaining confidence by the day. Certainly don't believe he's doomed just because he's in a book with Rogue.

[DonPriceTag]

If it turns out to be bad, then it's bad. But deezang y'all, it's already happening. I don't want be that "crazy fan base" writers talk about. You know, the ones that drove Carey crazy lol. So crazy he retconned his own story just to get back at them? Good times.

[Nekobaghira]

If you/any/all are excited, awesome. Buy this book!!! I will never tell you not to buy something you are genuinely excited about.

I'm glad she stoking your interest in the hobby via tumblr, twitter or where else KT wants to promote her projects. I wish her well and its great she's managing some excitement.
 
If she has instilled confidence via your interaction with her, fantastic.

I am not taking writers at their word anymore, too much subjectivity and no agreement on terminology. And I will go so far as to not interact with them either, let them do their thing and  I'll wait and see. The proof will be in print. 

[DonPriceTag]

I wouldn't use the word "excited", for me. Open to "waiting to pass judgment"... perhaps I should I just drop this. There seems to be a bias that because I'm not "against" the pairing, that I'm championing something (because I'm not) rather than cautioning fans about the way and frequency in which they voice negatively. Not talking about you persay, boss. Over on CBR as well. All I'm asking is that we wait and see. That's it. I'm not conducting a train here and you won't find any posts of me doing so. I don't like the idea of your either "for" or "against". It's just not a healthy way to get Gambit, the character, a fair shake in this climate of hyper-sensitive creators and execs (across the board, not just in comic either. Video game producers are very similar. But the two past times are so close in terms of demo, its basically the same type of person). I'm not about this allowing myself to be "polarized" by anything. I just dont get it. I dont harbor passion for one way of thinking or another. I pride myself on being that way. Except with cars... I'm a gear head and there certain things people do to their cars that I just can't stand. Oh, and I'm a Miami Heat fan... so, like eff LeBron (he tried to kill us on his way out. I will never forgive him for that. Let's go Heat.)

[Nekobaghira]

Clearly, I'm using all the wrong words today. I apologize.

[remydat]

People care too much about what writers or Marvel thinks.  We are the customers and I demand a good product.  I will never again temper my expectations or settle for breadcrumbs.  I did that for years with Gambit and you know what it didn't get better.


Marvel has earned my open hostility, disdain, and skepticism given their treatment of the character and saying that scares them away is making excuses.  When we were quiet they still screwed the character over so this idea we scare them away is just Marvel's way of justifying their f***ery.  If playing nice mattered then we wouldn't be in this predicament in the first place because sorry we played nice for decades.


Right now some of you guys sound like people that have been tortured for so long that they start making excuses for their torturer.  It's like comic book Stockholm Syndrome.  I'm done playing Neville Chamberlain to Marvel's Hitler.

[Nekobaghira]

You aren't wrong Remydat. We are the consumers, and we should expect good product.  For me personally, that is one without Rogue.

[remydat]

Well the fundamental issue is this.  Does anyone honestly think anything is going to happen in this book that represents lasting development for Gambit?


At least with Deadpool and Gambit, the end result was a new relationship despite how lame the story was.  Now Gambit and Deadpool have a friendship.  What's going to come out of this?  The likely answer is nothing.


But if I'll happily eat crow if I'm proving wrong but I doubt I will be.

[DonPriceTag]

Well the fundamental issue is this.  Does anyone honestly think anything is going to happen in this book that represents lasting development for Gambit?


At least with Deadpool and Gambit, the end result was a new relationship despite how lame the story was.  Now Gambit and Deadpool have a friendship.  What's going to come out of this?  The likely answer is nothing.


But if I'll happily eat crow if I'm proving wrong but I doubt I will be.

...where have you seen Gambit and Deadpool have a relationship since that book? We still don't know when that story took place as it had Gambit in his classic get-up and Deadpool didn't seem to have any relationship with Brother Voodoo. Deadpool has an ongoing and (was) part of several team books. It hasn't been brought up once, not even as a gag in UA where it would have had the biggest chance of being referenced. That book (which should have been cc's dream) devolved into utter nonsense. You give Marvel's observance of continuity too much credit. I'm almost certain that book was a cash grab because Marvel thought the Gambit movie was going to be in theaters, but when it got pushed they didn't want to hold onto it anymore, so they just added it to the Deadpool catalog.


And I just realized Neko's avatar is the ANXF cover with all those... things.