Author Topic: Gambit bi?  (Read 3678 times)

Offline andresa

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #15 on: March 18, 2020, 08:17:23 AM »
LOL the current meaning of the term SJW is pejorative because it refers to people on the internet who problematize and are offended by absolutely everything. Representatives of modern SJW aren't really fighting for people's rights and equality; they're a bunch of hypocrites making noise while pushing double stantards and attacking anyone with a divergent opinion. To me the worst part is how these people undermine these important issues by acting like self-righteous idiots and being manipulated. 

The X-Men being a diverse group was earned and was honest. Changing characters's cores for shock value isn't honest. You can't change stablished characters like Iceman on a couple of poorly-written pages and be surprised when there's backlash. And not because these people, these fans are intrinsically homophobic it's because the shift in Icenman's sexuality wasn't warranted. Why would any Gambit fan want his sexuality changed for no reason is beyond me.

Offline Toadman005

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #16 on: March 18, 2020, 09:35:45 AM »
Okay. Be opposed to changing Gambit's sexuality if you want. But can we stop saying SJW like it is a bad thing or some kind of insult? Social justice is important and caring about equity and representation is not a bad thing. In fact, I don't understand how you can be a fan of the X-Men franchise and disparage "SJW". I think that is cognitive dissonance to the nth degree.



I absolutely am opposed to it, or any other characters' sexuality, race, gender or anything else that is needlessly changed.


And, in my opinion, SJW is a negative term, a bad thing. SJW's are angry, bitter, destructive ideologues who claim to be fighting for a righteous, virtuous cause (like "caring about equity and representation") when in reality they're just cowardly bullies ganged together to coop or destroy things to make others feel as miserable as they do.


I was, and always have been, a fan of the X-Men, a truly natural, organic diverse group. It had characters of multiple races and nationalities, genders, religions, ages, and yes, sexual orientations. And part of what made it earned and honest was that the characters were never troupes, cliches, tokens. They were actual characters first and foremost, who also happened to be (insert qualifier here). Gambit, for example, was a charming, thieving ladies man, devil may care man of mystery bad ass. He also happened to be creole Cajun. If anyone views a character based first and foremost by their race/sex/orientation etc rather than their character, they have a problem. Is Magneto a conflicted anti-hero or is he a Jew? And I say all this because, I always assumed Bobby Drake WAS gay...there were always some subtle hints, but it was never outright addressed because there was no need for it. And had he eventually come out, it wouldn't have bothered me in the least, if handled properly.


But, they didn't handle it properly, in fact, as shown, they handled it terribly. Pandering to the (yes, I say it with disdain) SJW's, who now run the industry and are killing it. And how has Iceman been portrayed since then? As a very outright gay first and foremost and as a character secondarily. When they established/changed Iceman from straight/ambiguous to gay, he ceased being Bobby Drake, long established character, and became gay token representation Iceman, who's totally gay you guys! Hey, hey reminder, he's gay! Like, he's on dates, and reminding his bigot parents he's gay, and he's like, making gay jokes, and talks about his gayness, and gay gay gay gay, guys! Oh, and, like, sometimes he's a hero, or whatever. But, I mean, that's secondary. Frankly, it's insulting.


So, yeah, I see SJW's and the concept of "social justice" as a bad thing. And I hate when people try and make the argument that you can't be a fan of comics, and X-Men in particular, and be opposed to what is passed off as "social justice", when it makes me want to puke because of the blatant hypocrisy and obliviousness to the fact that X-Men were and always have been the title that TRULY captured what they CLAIM to advocate for: natural, fair, honest and earnest representation rather than over the top, extreme progressive pink haired garbage.
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Offline Nekobaghira

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #17 on: March 18, 2020, 02:42:44 PM »
Wow - I haven't looked up a word in a long time. Thanks Andresa.  Pejorative fits the SJW attitude that is displayed on social media. SJW's eat their own, they are not even cohesive with their general dislike of whatever the flavor of the day is. E.g. the SJW who wrote a trilogy book and had it pulled from publication because the SJW's were upset with something. I can't remember and don't care. It was fiction though and it did make the news and SJW's were brought up in the article.


Its not that anyone here doesn't want justice in social situations, its how its handled that is the problem. Bullying and shaming isn't the way to fix the injustice of social situations. Whether SJW's admit to it or not, their methods are not conducive to change and make themselves look bad. I see SJW's as a negative as well because of methodology and attitude.


Getting back to Iceman's change, change for the sake of it doesn't mean its good. His personality has completely changed. Literally 4 pages devoted to his coming out is not a coming out journey for a character with 60+ years of history. And it was Jean both times telling teenBobby and adultBobby, that he's gay. That isn't how it works, at least not with any of the gay friends I know.


Its not really a question should a character or shouldn't character be bi or not, it really should be written far more organically than shown in comic books. While I get there is only 20 pages, but if a company or writer is trying for "publicity" to sell books, then put the overall story in the background for an issue and handle the character study or issue for more than 4 pages (2 per book, and only 2 books for the outing).

Anyway, interesting topic. Even if was intended for Iceman to begin with. LOL

Offline andresa

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #18 on: March 18, 2020, 10:28:35 PM »
Wow - I haven't looked up a word in a long time. Thanks Andresa.  Pejorative fits the SJW attitude that is displayed on social media. SJW's eat their own, they are not even cohesive with their general dislike of whatever the flavor of the day is. E.g. the SJW who wrote a trilogy book and had it pulled from publication because the SJW's were upset with something. I can't remember and don't care. It was fiction though and it did make the news and SJW's were brought up in the article.

It's a common word in my language, didn't realize it wasn't that common in English LOL

There's also JK Rowling who was a SJW queen until she got "cancelled"  because of a tweet by the same people she indulged for years. 

Quote
Its not that anyone here doesn't want justice in social situations, its how its handled that is the problem. Bullying and shaming isn't the way to fix the injustice of social situations. Whether SJW's admit to it or not, their methods are not conducive to change and make themselves look bad. I see SJW's as a negative as well because of methodology and attitude.


Getting back to Iceman's change, change for the sake of it doesn't mean its good. His personality has completely changed. Literally 4 pages devoted to his coming out is not a coming out journey for a character with 60+ years of history. And it was Jean both times telling teenBobby and adultBobby, that he's gay. That isn't how it works, at least not with any of the gay friends I know.


I utterly agree.

Quote
Its not really a question should a character or shouldn't character be bi or not, it really should be written far more organically than shown in comic books. While I get there is only 20 pages, but if a company or writer is trying for "publicity" to sell books, then put the overall story in the background for an issue and handle the character study or issue for more than 4 pages (2 per book, and only 2 books for the outing).

I followed The Walking Dead comics for years until its end last year, and my favorite character is Jesus, a terrific character that happens to be gay. And his being gay isn't a defining trait, it's just part of this well-written, two-dimensional character. I know it's easier when there's only one writer behind a story; still Marvel could've done much better with Iceman. If the writers had taken the time to develop his coming out, shown his coming into terms with it while still keeping his essence, there wouldn't've been that much rejection. 



Offline Nekobaghira

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #19 on: March 18, 2020, 11:56:43 PM »
 
It's a common word in my language, didn't realize it wasn't that common in English LOL

 
I like learning new words. :)

 
There's also JK Rowling who was a SJW queen until she got "cancelled" because of a tweet by the same people she indulged for years.

 
Didn't know about that but … makes the whole 'eat their own' thing more poignant - imo -
« Last Edit: March 19, 2020, 10:13:17 PM by Nekobaghira »

Offline Icefanatic

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #20 on: March 19, 2020, 05:35:12 AM »
Three things...

First, I was on CBR prior to the outing of Young Iceman. You had a contingent of 'Gayers' there who kept running back-and-forth between CBR and Bendis's Tumblr page trying to get Bendis to make Young Iceman gay. They would pop in to the Iceman Appreciation Thread there and taunt the Iceman fans, bragging about what they were getting Bendis to do to Young Iceman. After they took credit for the whole 'Disney Princess' bit, I took a look at Bendis's Tumblr and what they were posting there. "Have Jean or the Professor read Iceman's mind and tell him he is gay!" "Make him bisexual, they say everyone is!" "Yes, but only as a step to making him FULL GAY!" They were also telling Bendis the Iceman fans in the CBR Iceman Appreciation Thread hated him.

So I messaged Bendis and told him we did NOT hate him, that we had been enjoying his depiction of Young Iceman(what little he did with him). I told him how people were bragging about the things they were getting him to do and just asked him to "please do not change how you write the character because of it". Bendis didn't reply to me directly, but instead posted publicly that "I will not allow anyone to influce how I write a character". I shared with everyone in the Iceman Appreciation Thread what I thought was the good news.

Then Young Jean reads Iceman's mind and tells him that he is gay. He says mabe he is bisexual , they say everyone is. Then she informs him that no, he is "FULL GAY!".

Sigh... So all that wasn't just bad writing on the part of Bendis, it came direly from the trolls at CBR.

Second, fiction is full-to-bursting with straight characters that a large group of fans see as gay/bi/something-other-than-straight. Sometimes it is wish-fulfillment, sometimes it is simply perception. I've been guilty of the latter myself. Perception is a funny thing. I remember when Northstar came out, I felt it was a dodge to avoid the fact he had incestuous feelings for his sister. I didn't want him to have those feelings, it was simply how I saw their relationship...

Bobby Drake, Peter Parker, Johnny Storm, Steve Rogers... all have LARGE segments of fans who have seen them as either bi or outright gay for decades. Same with Dick Grayson and many others at DC. And when writers/artists/editors learn of that, many of them add stuff as jokes and fan service purely for fun, that instead gets taken as proof of something or at least 'ambiguousness', and shapes more opinions in that direction.

I got back into the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles few years back because of the cartoon airing at the time and prior to checking out some of the fan-groups I figured there was probably a contiget of fans seeing Mikey as gay, because he's a joker and those characters seem to ALWAYS get that, and also the whole recurring 'Leatherhead' bit. What surprised me was all the people insisting RAPH was gay because as one poster pput it, "He has all the qualities of a woman while being entirely disdainful of women." They had a thread so full of 'proof' it would put the old "Iceman/Steve Rogers" is gay threads at CBR to shame.

Then the show gave Raph a girlfriend and all they could talk about was how betrayed they had been by the show's creators because he was so 'obviously gay'.

Perception. The thing with Iceman is that regardless of anyone's perception, he was created as straight and written as straight for over a half-century of stories. He WAS straight. You will find misquotes by Scott Lobdell, Mike Carey and Marjorie Liu scattered around the internet as 'proof' of it being otherwise, but as I said, they are misquotes. They have all actually said the opposite. The misquotes started with a few people doing it deliberately(I watched some of that happen at CBR) and after a bit people are just repeating what they heard and believing it to be true. The perceptions of a small percentage of fans, vocal though they may be, shouldn't change the reality of who a character actually is. You do that and you not only have chaos, you undermine the ability to perceive the fictional reality as in some way real. Fans stop buying into it. The change to Iceman was a 'jump the shark' moment to a lot of fans, they either now read around his... unreality... or they don't read stuff with him at all.

Third, I am in favor of social justice, and I can't stand so-called 'Social Justice Warriors'. To me someone in favor of social justice is much like a mainstream average christian and an 'SJW' is more like a member of the Westboro Baptist Church. They both take something that should be good and positive and twist it to make it unpalatable to outright toxic.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2020, 06:59:22 AM by Icefanatic »

Offline Toadman005

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #21 on: March 19, 2020, 09:39:19 AM »

Three things...

First, I was on CBR prior to the outing of Young Iceman. You had a contingent of 'Gayers' there who kept running back-and-forth between CBR and Bendis's Tumblr page trying to get Bendis to make Young Iceman gay. They would pop in to the Iceman Appreciation Thread there and taunt the Iceman fans, bragging about what they were getting Bendis to do to Young Iceman. After they took credit for the whole 'Disney Princess' bit, I took a look at Bendis's Tumblr and what they were posting there. "Have Jean or the Professor read Iceman's mind and tell him he is gay!" "Make him bisexual, they say everyone is!" "Yes, but only as a step to making him FULL GAY!" They were also telling Bendis the Iceman fans in the CBR Iceman Appreciation Thread hated him.

So I messaged Bendis and told him we did NOT hate him, that we had been enjoying his depiction of Young Iceman(what little he did with him). I told him how people were bragging about the things they were getting him to do and just asked him to "please do not change how you write the character because of it". Bendis didn't reply to me directly, but instead posted publicly that "I will not allow anyone to influce how I write a character". I shared with everyone in the Iceman Appreciation Thread what I thought was the good news.

Then Young Jean reads Iceman's mind and tells him that he is gay. He says mabe he is bisexual , they say everyone is. Then she informs him that no, he is "FULL GAY!".

Sigh... So all that wasn't just bad writing on the part of Bendis, it came direly from the trolls at CBR.

Second, fiction is full-to-bursting with straight characters that a large group of fans see as gay/bi/something-other-than-straight. Sometimes it is wish-fulfillment, sometimes it is simply perception. I've been guilty of the latter myself. Perception is a funny thing. I remember when Northstar came out, I felt it was a dodge to avoid the fact he had incestuous feelings for his sister. I didn't want him to have those feelings, it was simply how I saw their relationship...

Bobby Drake, Peter Parker, Johnny Storm, Steve Rogers... all have LARGE segments of fans who have seen them as either bi or outright gay for decades. Same with Dick Grayson and many others at DC. And when writers/artists/editors learn of that, many of them add stuff as jokes and fan service purely for fun, that instead gets taken as proof of something or at least 'ambiguousness', and shapes more opinions in that direction.

I got back into the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles few years back because of the cartoon airing at the time and prior to checking out some of the fan-groups I figured there was probably a contiget of fans seeing Mikey as gay, because he's a joker and those characters seem to ALWAYS get that, and also the whole recurring 'Leatherhead' bit. What surprised me was all the people insisting RAPH was gay because as one poster pput it, "He has all the qualities of a woman while being entirely disdainful of women." They had a thread so full of 'proof' it would put the old "Iceman/Steve Rogers" is gay threads at CBR to shame.

Then the show gave Raph a girlfriend and all they could talk about was how betrayed they had been by the show's creators because he was so 'obviously gay'.

Perception. The thing with Iceman is that regardless of anyone's perception, he was created as straight and written as straight for over a half-century of stories. He WAS straight. You will find misquotes by Scott Lobdell, Mike Carey and Marjorie Liu scattered around the internet as 'proof' of it being otherwise, but as I said, they are misquotes. They have all actually said the opposite. The misquotes started with a few people doing it deliberately(I watched some of that happen at CBR) and after a bit people are just repeating what they heard and believing it to be true. The perceptions of a small percentage of fans, vocal though they may be, shouldn't change the reality of who a character actually is. You do that and you not only have chaos, you undermine the ability to perceive the fictional reality as in some way real. Fans stop buying into it. The change to Iceman was a 'jump the shark' moment to a lot of fans, they either now read around his... unreality... or they don't read stuff with him at all.

Third, I am in favor of social justice, and I can't stand so-called 'Social Justice Warriors'. To me someone in favor of social justice is much like a mainstream average christian and an 'SJW' is more like a member of the Westboro Baptist Church. They both take something that should be good and positive and twist it to make it unpalatable to outright toxic.


See, I always thought they strongly hinted Iceman could be gay (or bi)...and a like you say, that was perception. In thinking more about it, I mostly drew my conclusion from the mid-late 90's, when there were subtle hints such as someone (I forget who, in X-Men 19 I think it was) mocking Iceman's failed "relationship" with Opal, and it sort of reading like he can't seem to succeed with ANY woman. But mostly it was the road trip Bobby took with Rogue to confront his (presented as bigoted) dad.













Now, it's pretty much implied Bobby's dad is anti-mutant, but, given X-men have always been an allegory for being misunderstood, outcast, closeted, awkward, puberty, etc etc, it's easy to read into it that Bobby was "closeted" and his father knew/suspected and resented him for it, and Bobby had issues with that. This conversation likely reads like many coming out gay young men must have had with conservative father's in the 90's.


Now, worth mentioning, a few issues later, Graydon Creed has Bobby's father nearly killed to get to Bobby (he was running for office, and the X-Men were infiltrating him, and Bobby was ousted, but his father refused to betray his son).






Again, my takeaway from that is, it as meant to represent gay men who felt their fathers hated them for being gay, and coming to grips with their fathers still ultimately loved them, but just resented their lifestyle. Adding to this was his hospital ridden father's conversation with our favorite Cajun, where (again, consistent with 90's "it's a choice" mentality) Mr.Drake asks Gambit why he choses to be (an out and about) mutant as, he's a handsome, regular LOOKING guy who could pass as normal (non mutant, and, therefore, allegorically, straight).



(complete with some TRUE social justice...a natural, humble realization of injustice)







To me, while the story was about Bobby's tumultuous relationship with his father, and in story, overing being a mutant, it was pretty clear they were alluding to closeted homosexuality. And, it IS as you say, perception, but it's all about subtext.



and by subtext I also mean visually....like, as an artist, myself, I have to say, things are...diliberately done. Such as, uhm...well, I'll let the pic speak for itself.





While this story wasn't Iceman coming out as gay, it easily could have been. And it would have ben far better handled, more justified and earned, than the crap Bendis presented. And Rogue, being his support, was far more caring, and a humble friend, than an arrogant Jean abusing her powers and feeling self righteously entitled into putting him.
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Offline Icefanatic

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #22 on: March 19, 2020, 04:36:24 PM »


See, I always thought they strongly hinted Iceman could be gay (or bi)...and a like you say, that was perception. In thinking more about it, I mostly drew my conclusion from the mid-late 90's, when there were subtle hints such as someone (I forget who, in X-Men 19 I think it was) mocking Iceman's failed "relationship" with Opal, and it sort of reading like he can't seem to succeed with ANY woman. But mostly it was the road trip Bobby took with Rogue to confront his (presented as bigoted) dad.













Now, it's pretty much implied Bobby's dad is anti-mutant, but, given X-men have always been an allegory for being misunderstood, outcast, closeted, awkward, puberty, etc etc, it's easy to read into it that Bobby was "closeted" and his father knew/suspected and resented him for it, and Bobby had issues with that. This conversation likely reads like many coming out gay young men must have had with conservative father's in the 90's.


Now, worth mentioning, a few issues later, Graydon Creed has Bobby's father nearly killed to get to Bobby (he was running for office, and the X-Men were infiltrating him, and Bobby was ousted, but his father refused to betray his son).






Again, my takeaway from that is, it as meant to represent gay men who felt their fathers hated them for being gay, and coming to grips with their fathers still ultimately loved them, but just resented their lifestyle. Adding to this was his hospital ridden father's conversation with our favorite Cajun, where (again, consistent with 90's "it's a choice" mentality) Mr.Drake asks Gambit why he choses to be (an out and about) mutant as, he's a handsome, regular LOOKING guy who could pass as normal (non mutant, and, therefore, allegorically, straight).



(complete with some TRUE social justice...a natural, humble realization of injustice)







To me, while the story was about Bobby's tumultuous relationship with his father, and in story, overing being a mutant, it was pretty clear they were alluding to closeted homosexuality. And, it IS as you say, perception, but it's all about subtext.



and by subtext I also mean visually....like, as an artist, myself, I have to say, things are...diliberately done. Such as, uhm...well, I'll let the pic speak for itself.





While this story wasn't Iceman coming out as gay, it easily could have been. And it would have ben far better handled, more justified and earned, than the crap Bendis presented. And Rogue, being his support, was far more caring, and a humble friend, than an arrogant Jean abusing her powers and feeling self righteously entitled into putting him.

I love those comics.  :)

You are on the money with all that. Scott Lobdell has said that he used the story of a gay man bringing his gay friend home to meet his parents as the inspiration for that story. It was something he often did, taking things that applied to other 'real-world' minorities and translating them to mutants to add more relevance to the 'mutant metaphor'. Our world's 'Queer Nation' inspired 'Gene Nation' in the comics, for example. Some posters at CBR have spent over two decades pushing that because of the inspiration for the story, that Scott was trying/planning to out Bobby as gay. Totally ignoring that if the inspiration meant anything about the the character's actual sexuality, that would mean Rogue was gay, too.

Fabian Nicieza made the comment back in the 90's that the X-Office kept getting letters from some vocal fans who thought Iceman was gay, or wanted Marvel to 'make him gay' and both he and Scott Lobdell thought it was funny so they started putting jokes into the books to play to that. I actually posted a link on the old pre-reboot CBR where Scott was fielding questions at a  fan event and a fan asked him if the "jokes meant anything". Scott replied, "no, Iceman's straight, me and Fabian were just having a little fun with the fact some fans think he is not." That took the air out of the 'gayers' sails there for a day-or-two before they just ignored it and kept on.

After Uncanny X-Men #600 came out, while Scott Lobdell was writing the Titans at DC, someone tweeted at him asking him to make one of the straight Titans gay. I don't know which one because they later deleted the tweet, but Scott's response was still there. "No, because that would be like me making Bunker(who is gay and Latino) straight and white. I'm not Bendis."

Fun thing, that scene with Gambit and Bobby's dad came out around the time some fans were speculating that Bobby and Remy were actually half-brothers via Bobby's dad(this was after they speculated that Rogue was Gambit's sister but before they were specualting Bobby and Rogue were going to get married in Vegas). I remember it was interesting to read that scene with that in mind.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2020, 05:06:40 PM by Icefanatic »

Offline anya

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #23 on: March 19, 2020, 08:25:32 PM »
Lol, so there was rampant fan speculation back then too?  This is completely off topic, but it always bugged me that iceman’s hair would change from blond to brown, all the time!

Offline andresa

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #24 on: March 20, 2020, 08:19:37 AM »
I see where you're coming from, Toadman, and agree that that storyline could've been a coming out story (much better than the one Bobby actually had). But I think sometimes people can read way too much between the lines. If Asmus had been successful in making Gambit bisexual, there would have been a flood of "evidence" of his being bi, distortions and new interpretations of past scenes. 

Fun thing, that scene with Gambit and Bobby's dad came out around the time some fans were speculating that Bobby and Remy were actually half-brothers via Bobby's dad(this was after they speculated that Rogue was Gambit's sister but before they were specualting Bobby and Rogue were going to get married in Vegas). I remember it was interesting to read that scene with that in mind.
Really? Where do people get these ridiculous ideas from?

Offline Toadman005

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #25 on: March 20, 2020, 09:09:03 AM »
I see where you're coming from, Toadman, and agree that that storyline could've been a coming out story (much better than the one Bobby actually had). But I think sometimes people can read way too much between the lines. If Asmus had been successful in making Gambit bisexual, there would have been a flood of "evidence" of his being bi, distortions and new interpretations of past scenes. 
Really? Where do people get these ridiculous ideas from?


Oh God, with the exception of Daken, dare I even ask what??



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Offline andresa

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #26 on: March 20, 2020, 09:45:27 AM »
Everything. Every detail would be analized and reinterpreted to fit the new status quo. Actually, I remember people bringing up Daken, his living on the streets as a kid, kissing Courier (in a woman's body), persuing a relationship with Rogue because she was untouchable as subtext when we learned about Asmus failed attempt at making Gambit bi. I'm just glad it didn't happen.

Offline Icefanatic

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #27 on: March 20, 2020, 10:13:18 AM »
Everything. Every detail would be analized and reinterpreted to fit the new status quo. Actually, I remember people bringing up Daken, his living on the streets as a kid, kissing Courier (in a woman's body), persuing a relationship with Rogue because she was untouchable as subtext when we learned about Asmus failed attempt at making Gambit bi. I'm just glad it didn't happen.

Yep. After Young Iceman came out director Brian Singer was asked if the movie version of Iceman would, too. He replied, "No, I hope people understand that it is different universes. But there is something almost... sub-textual... about him seeking a relationship with a woman he could not touch."

They would have a field-day with that for Gambit.

Offline Toadman005

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #28 on: March 20, 2020, 11:35:57 AM »
Everything. Every detail would be analized and reinterpreted to fit the new status quo. Actually, I remember people bringing up Daken, his living on the streets as a kid, kissing Courier (in a woman's body), persuing a relationship with Rogue because she was untouchable as subtext when we learned about Asmus failed attempt at making Gambit bi. I'm just glad it didn't happen.


Jesus, you're right. I always took Gambit's initial interest in Rogue as because she was "unobtainable", and Gambit was the bad boy that loved a challenge. Her being untouchable made her wanna touch him more. Meanwhile, she was SO enamored with the tall, dark, handsome mysterious ladies man who could have ANYONE being SO interested in her, who everyone else ignored.
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Offline andresa

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Re: Gambit bi?
« Reply #29 on: March 20, 2020, 11:54:27 AM »
Yeah, that's why their dynamic worked well in the beginning.

Yep. After Young Iceman came out director Brian Singer was asked if the movie version of Iceman would, too. He replied, "No, I hope people understand that it is different universes. But there is something almost... sub-textual... about him seeking a relationship with a woman he could not touch."

They would have a field-day with that for Gambit.

We dodged a bullet there.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2020, 11:56:52 AM by andresa »